It's all good!!

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by convicted1, Jan 30, 2011.

  1. convicted1

    convicted1
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    You know, in these last few weeks, I have been called a heretic, a Pelegian(sp?), a Semi-Peligian(sp?), and a Semi-Gnostic, all by my Brethern, nonetheless!! But that's okay. As long as y'all are talking about me, you are leaving my Brothers and Sisters alone. I am 6'2" and weigh 217 lbs, so I have big enough shoulders to carry it.

    I have never attacked anyone on here, I have always done my best to show my points with scripture and kindness, and have never leashed out at anyone, unless they did so first. All I have done is do my best to show love, and in turn, you see the names I have been called. Why? Because my posts don't seep, ooze, drip, with the Doctrines of Grace. I disagree with those who hold to this theology, but to go as far as call them a heretic, I would never do that. I ask God all the time to show me something, anything, that I believe doesn't correlate with His Word. He has shown me things that have caused me to change my beliefs, and I am sure He has done so with the rest of y'all.

    I read in the bible of a man named Jesus, who showed love, and all He got in return was crucifixion. He was blameless; so I being so far from being anything like Him, deserve what I get, just because I have a sinful body, but a soul that has been made perfect by His blood!

    The point I am trying to make is this, Brethern; if you smack someone in the face, the pain will eventually go away. But the words we say(or on here "type") go deeper than a "blow", and will hurt much longer!

    That being said, I truly do love EVERYONE on here with ALL MY HEART!! Can y'all say the same? I have been called many names, some good, many bad, but there is one name I love to be called.......HIS!!! I love you all!!

    i am I AM's!!

    Willis
     
  2. Luke2427

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    Willis, best I can tell, you are a nice, sweet person.

    And playing the victim here will no doubt get you a great deal of attention from some who love to paint the Reformed as bullies and monsters. They will coddle you and spit venom at me and other defenders and promoters of the DoG. Perhaps that is what you had in mind, I do not know. But regardless, I think you are a good guy.

    But the facts, which matter a great deal to some, and not a whole lot to others because feelings matter more to them- the facts are that you line up with Pelagius on this one point concerning original sin. That does not mean you are a full blown Pelagian. I have not called you one, and frankly doubt that anyone else has either. But when you say that babies are born without sin except in their flesh this is terribly close to Pelagianism whether you like it or not. In FACT it IS Pelagianism on this point.

    So you are not being "attacked" by that being pointed out to you.

    The FACT of the matter is that you need to account for this problem of getting the souls of babies into heaven without the blood of Christ.

    You say their souls are without sin and that they are not sinners until they "commit sin" and that only their physical bodies are affected by sin- then why do they need the blood of Christ and the grace of God?

    They do not according to your beliefs because blood was shed for sin and grace is for sinners.

    So, according to your doctrine MOST of the human population of heaven is there WITHOUT the blood of Christ.
     
  3. pinoybaptist

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    Brother Willis,

    Welcome to the club. I love you, brother, and you know that, even if you're not Primitive Baptist.
     
  4. Jerome

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    Spurgeon recounts similar reviling and nastiness in the 1800s:

    "I remember saying something on this subject on one occasion in a certain ultra-Calvinistic place of worship. At that time I was preaching to children, and was exhorting them to pray, and I happened to say that long before any actual conversion I had prayed for common mercies, and that God had heard my prayers. This did not suit my good brethren of the superfine school; and afterwards they all came round me professedly to know what I meant, but really to cavil and carp according to their nature and wont. "They compassed me about like bees; yea, like bees they compassed me about!" After awhile, as I expected, they fell to their usual amusement of calling names. They began to say what rank Arminianism this was; and another expression they were pleased to honour with the title of "Fullerism;" a title, by the way, so honourable that I could heartily have thanked thern for appending it to what I had advanced. But to say that God should hear the prayer of natural men was something worse than Arminianism, if indeed anything could be worse to them. They quoted that counterfeit passage, "The prayer of the wicked is an abomination unto the Lord," which I speedily answered by asking them if they would find me that text in the word of God; for I ventured to assert that the devil was the author of that saying, and that it was not in the Bible at all." —"The Raven's Cry"
     
  5. quantumfaith

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    Very poignant and heart felt words Willis. Love you brother.

    Mercy, Peace and Love in abundance.
     
  6. Old Union Brother

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    Debate is good. Open discussion is good. Both cause me to pray and search the scriptures. Debate is about establishing a position and laying out support for your position. Countering the arguement should also be done by establishing a position and laying out support for that position. Unfortunately that does not seem to work on here. Almost every debate breaks down to name calling and ranting. It is impossible to ram your beliefs down someone's throat and expect then to eat it.

    As one of the old writers wrote: Isa 1:18 Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.


    There is a couple of old saying in my part of the woods: " Everybody is right in their on mind". And "You draw more flies with honey than you do with vinegar".

    I guess what I'm trying to say is that if I establish my position and support it and it is seasoned with the Love of God that is in my heart then you are more likely to listen to it or read it. If it is seasoned with harsh caustic comments then you may just turn it off or put me on ignore.

    Not trying to play the martyr just some thoughts.

    Love peace and prayers

    Jeff
     
  7. Winman

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    John 9:34 They answered and said unto him, Thou wast altogether born in sins, and dost thou teach us? And they cast him out.

    Does this sound familiar to anyone here? First they tell you you are born a sinner, then they tell you you are too stupid to understand scripture. Then they try to get rid of you.

    Willis, you have the right attitude, study the scriptures and ask God to help you understand them.

    But expect these attacks, they are going to come as sure as the sun will rise today.

    Keep your loving attitude, this is very good!
     
  8. mets65

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    You just seem like a positive and uplifting person. Just what being a Christian is all about. All the name calling, arguing and pointing fingers is what keeps so many people out of church and away from Christ. I know this because I've seen it first hand. If we don't promote love we can never be used by Christ the way he intended.
     
  9. Luke2427

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    That sounds sweet and it makes us all feel warm and fuzzy on the inside and most people go for it hook line and sinker.

    And it works for many of us because there is some truth to it.

    But love is not laying down and letting false doctrine go unchallenged and unchecked.

    Jesus was as loving in Matthew 23 as he was to the woman caught in the act of adultery.

    Love is not being limp and pusillanimous and singing cum ba ya.

    Luther was not unloving when he called the Pope all kinds of names.

    Elijah was not unloving when he mocked the prophets of Baal.

    Jesus was not unloving when he called Peter Satan.

    Paul was not unloving when he got up in Peter's face and lambasted him.

    There has never been a great man of God who was not strong and hard against evil or false doctrine.

    The wussification of the Church is her downfall in this metrosexual culture- not her willingness to call a spade a spade.
     
    #9 Luke2427, Jan 30, 2011
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  10. Earth Wind and Fire

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    Oh Winman, LOL.....you never cease to make me laugh at all your accusations! Oh boy, oh boy ROFL.

    Yes Willis, this is a Calvinist conspiracy designed specifically to debase & deceive you poor Free Will guys & make you feel bad LOL about yourselves:laugh::laugh:

    Oy vey!

    Well yes here in my Calvinist "How to" manual its all layed out....lesson 1, Tell Willis & all Free will believers that they are born sinners.....here is how....ask them to read the Scriptures (Both a cunning & devious trick by those rotten Calvinists) :smilewinkgrin:

    Sub-note : Dont let them know our satanic doctrines resemble GANG RAPE tactics.

    Lesson 2: Insist on solid basis in theology with coherent doctrinal framework. That will imply that they are too stupid to understand scripture. :tongue3:

    Lesson 3: Throw in Ephesians as proof text.... THIS WILL CONFUSE THE ISSUE. (Devious)

    Ephesians 2

    1 As for you, you were dead in your transgressions and sins, 2 in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient. 3 All of us also lived among them at one time, gratifying the cravings of our flesh[a] and following its desires and thoughts. Like the rest, we were by nature deserving of wrath. 4 But because of his great love for us, God, who is rich in mercy, 5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions—it is by grace you have been saved. 6 And God raised us up with Christ and seated us with him in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus, 7 in order that in the coming ages he might show the incomparable riches of his grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ Jesus. 8 For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9 not by works, so that no one can boast. 10 For we are God’s handiwork, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do.

    Lastly......Get rid of them! (Can you say paranoid!) Shakes Head!
     
    #10 Earth Wind and Fire, Jan 30, 2011
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  11. JohnDeereFan

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    I don't know you and I can't recall reading any of your posts. Who knows, maybe you are a heretic. But not having read your posts, I'm happy to give you the benefit of the doubt.

    But as somebody here who was recently the subject of an entire six or seven page thread that was created and allowed to remain open by the moderators for no other reason that making personal attacks on me and encouraging others to do so, as well, I understand where you're coming from.

    Just because someone says they're a Christian doesn't mean you can count on them to treat you like a brother in Christ.

    The board has an "ignore" feature and, as far as many of the people here go, you're probably just better off using it and ignoring them.
     
  12. mets65

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    I didn't say we should embrace false doctrine. I think it's impossible to 100 percent know if Calvinism is true or not true.
     
  13. Winman

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    I am not denying that all men are sinners, I believe that. I do not deny that we are born with lusts and desires, I believe that. But having lusts and desires is not sin, sin is an action, something you perform or do. So, I do not believe you become a sinner until you perform a sinful act.

    In addition being a sinner is not physical, it is a legal judgment, that is where the confusion arises. A murderer's body is no different from someone who has not committed murder. Sin is not a physical substance you can inherit from your parents. There is a physical corruption you inherit from your parents, we begin a march toward death the moment we are born.
    Death is a judgment, not a substance. Jesus said those who have not believed are CONDEMNED already. That is a legal term. When Adam and Eve sinned, their bodies were corrupted and began to die. Their soul and spirit was condemned and the judgment of death passed upon them. This is spiritual death. When you trust Christ your soul and spirit are washed clean and renewed, and your spirit becomes one with the Holy Spirit. It takes two for birth. This creates a new man within you.
    But scripture does not show us born dead, many scriptures say otherwise.
    1Peter 2:25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now RETURNED unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.
    How can a sheep go astray if it did not first belong to the flock?
    How can you return to Jesus if you were not first with him?
    I am not a heretic, I simply believe what the scriptures say.
     
  14. quantumfaith

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    Oh and BTW, you are NOT playing the victim or being coddled by anyone. You are appreciated for speaking your mind and your heart. God Bless you brother.
     
  15. BobinKy

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    Post deleted.
     
    #15 BobinKy, Jan 30, 2011
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  16. BobinKy

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    #16 BobinKy, Jan 30, 2011
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  17. BobinKy

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    #17 BobinKy, Jan 30, 2011
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  18. Andy T.

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    This is one of the most inflammatory posts I've seen on this board. And I've seen a lot of them, even some of my own. Essentially, this post tries to equate Christians of the Reformed persuasion with the unbelieving hell-bound Pharisees. Board violation, even if only in an implied fashion.
     
  19. Winman

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    You think this is inflammatory, look at some of the comments made to me.

    Where were you when the Reformed said all this to me? And if you look up these statements you will see I was not attacking them at all. This is nothing, this is just a few statements made about me in ONE day. Go back a year and you would have enough material to write a novel. Like Willis, I have been called a heretic, Pelagian, semi-Pelagian... You name it, and they have called me that.

    But that's OK, I don't need you to defend me, but maybe they do.
     
  20. mets65

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    This board should be called reformedtheology.com
     

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