Land for peace good?,,,hardly

Discussion in 'Politics' started by hillclimber, Oct 9, 2005.

  1. hillclimber

    hillclimber
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    Is this the desired attitude or response from the Palistinians? President Bush was IMHO very wrong in urging the trade of God's promised land (Gaza) for peace.

    "[That our operations caused Israel to withdraw from Gaza] is the truth and the reality and we lived this reality during the last few weeks," al-Zohar told WND. "The withdrawal happened after years of political and diplomatic activity that achieved nothing. ...The resistance caused Israel heavy damages, including on Israeli soldiers and Israeli society. Therefore the resistance is the Palestinians main tool and option and will remain so. [Israeli Prime Minister Ariel] Sharon must realize what brought him to withdraw from Gaza and do the same thing in the West Bank."

    How about this for a Palastinian attitude about Israel's existance.

    Asked whether Hamas is trying to ultimately capture only the West Bank and eastern Jerusalem or if it is committing attacks to destroy all of Israel, al-Zohar responded: "No one will deny the fact that before 1948, the state of Israel did not exist and that for thousands of years this land was part of an Islamic and Arabic land. History proves that this is the land of the Palestinian people and we will never give up any part of it. If our generation will not succeed to liberate all of historical Palestine then that mission will be for the following generations."


    http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=46733
     
  2. Joseph_Botwinick

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    1. Hamas is a terrorist group. Of course they feel this way. It must also be noted that they also oppress their own people, many who simply would like to have their own state, and live in peace with their neighbors.

    2. It is still too early, I think, to know if the Gaza Pullout, which was BTW, supported by the majority of Israelis as is the West Bank Pullout, was a mistake or not. I say, if things are not improved by January, then we can call it a mistake. Even at that point, it has nothing to do with God's promise land. It has everything to do with Ariel Sharon's failure to demand reciprocity for land to push for democratic and human rights reforms in the PA, and to push to disarm the terrorist organizations.

    3. Disarm the terrorists and all their boasting will go away. Will Ariel Sharon have the Chuzpah to do so? We will see? If not, he will soon be replaced.

    4. To sum up: Land for cease fires and false peace will not work. You are right there. Land for human rights and democratic reforms, and for disarming the terrorists will work. That will lead to true and lasting peace.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  3. Baptist in Richmond

    Baptist in Richmond
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    That is true.

    Regards,
    BiR
     
  4. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Thanks for the article, BiR. It was rather informative as was the other article I found about the Arabs playing on the Israeli Football team. [​IMG]

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  5. KenH

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    All land is God's land. The modern political state of Israel is not connected in any way to any Biblical promises to the Israelites in the Old Testament.

    I hope that the land for peace deal works out for a peaceful, two state solution - especially for the sake of the children of the Israelis and the Palestinians.
     
  6. Joseph_Botwinick

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    I agree with you here, Ken.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  7. hillclimber

    hillclimber
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    So you folks don't put any significance to the May 14, 1948 date of Israel's statehood? Is it not God's land, and a partial fulfillment of prophecy?
     
  8. hillclimber

    hillclimber
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    Why is this nation supporting Israel? Why does the whole world hate Israel?

    No efforts are going to cause lasting peace in that region short of Christ's return. To think so is folly.
     
  9. Joseph_Botwinick

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    1. In a Biblical sense, NO. In a historical sense, yes. It was the day Israel was granted nation status by the UN, I believe.

    2. The whole world is God's land. He created it all.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  10. Joseph_Botwinick

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    1. We support Israel because they are our ally and a democracy.

    2. Most of the world hates Israel because they are our ally and a democracy.

    3. If you follow the plan I outline above, there will be lasting relative peace in Israel. To think not is a fatalist mentality which is not based on anything but an incorrect understanding of Scripture. You see, some of us would rather see terror end there than to fullfill some fantasy prophecy. Some of us have friends and friends with family who live there. If you think it is folly, then give it up. It is all a fatalist POV anyway. Whatever will be will be and there's nothing you can do about it. Meanwhile, us peacemakers will work to save lives of innocent Israelis and Palestinians.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  11. NaasPreacher (C4K)

    NaasPreacher (C4K)
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    I am pre-trib, pre-mil and I don't see the date as necessarily significant eschatologically.
     
  12. church mouse guy

    church mouse guy
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    The Gaza deal was a back-room deal between the USA and Israel concerning the war in Iraq. We agreed to go to war in Iraq and Israel was sidelined so that we would not have to fight the entire Arab League.

    However, it is unclear to the public what will happen if the USA decides to make Israel remove Iran's nuclear abilities. Will the USA allow Israel to refuel the bombers and fighters in Iraq?

    Of course, the USA could decide to clean up Iran ourselves. The question is how soon it needs to be done--will Bush do it or will it await the next president?

    And then there is the question of why we are taking so long to invade Syria. Perhaps their pullout from Lebanon was a concession to the USA to avoid invasion. However, it seems that Syria is a player in the war in Iraq so why Bush stalls is unclear to me.

    Poor Israel was forced into defeat. Israel could have won her war against terror and held the Gaza. Instead the Gaza salient was closed for almost no reason at all. Gaza should be fenced off if it isn't already. There should be no access between the bank and Gaza. There never can be a Palestinian state for Arabs. Arabs should be encouraged to leave the Bank and Gaza.

    Hillclimber, of course, we have a partial fulfillment of prophecy. These are the last days. I won't remark how empty of evidence the pre-trib position is but mathematically speaking it is less than zilch. And, of course, the holy land belongs to God and He gave it to the Jews forever. Remember Abraham slept while God made the promise. Abraham did not have to keep any promises that were humanly impossible. God gave Abraham rest from works for salvation.
     
  13. LadyEagle

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    I agree with you, hillclimber. [​IMG]

    Bush stalls on Syria because American companies are doing business with Syria, cmg. Simple.
     
  14. KenH

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    1) I certainly hope not.

    2) At this point there is no reason to do anything to Iran.

    3) At this point no case has been made to spill American blood and further increase our national debt in invading Syria.
     
  15. LadyEagle

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    American blood continues to be spilled fighting the terrorists coming from Syria over the Iraqi border. This is at least the second time our troops have had to go in and root out terrorists coming in from Syria. So, yes, American blood and treasure is already being used for Syrian invasion into Iraq.

    Iraq wants Syria to Cooperate - Article
     
  16. KenH

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    Then we should help the Iraqis control the Iraqi borders.

    I absolutely refuse to support an invasion into Syria at this time and we certainly can't afford it as we are currently going over well over half a trillion dollars further into debt every twelve months.
     
  17. hillclimber

    hillclimber
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    Why in the world is all of Christiandom locked arms in support of Israel? I'm truly baffled. If they are no more that any other third world country, why do we offer support?
     
  18. NaasPreacher (C4K)

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    "All of Christiandom" is locked arms in support of Israel?

    Do you mean US Christians?
     
  19. Joseph_Botwinick

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    America supports Israel for the reasons I stated on the first page. It is has nothing to do with some silly misunderstanding of Scripture.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  20. Bunyon

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    "All land is God's land. The modern political state of Israel is not connected in any way to any Biblical promises to the Israelites in the Old Testament""-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Sure it isn't- It must be the single most amazing coincidence in the history of the world then. Or worse a big Satanic plot :rolleyes:
     

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