Limited or Definite Atonement is the Gospel !

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by savedbymercy, Apr 16, 2012.

  1. savedbymercy

    savedbymercy
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    1 Cor 15:1-4

    1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

    2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

    3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

    4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

    Now, who did Paul mean, when He said, that He received by Revelation, that Christ died for our sins ?

    Notice He said in vs 3 That which I received ! Where did He receive His Gospel ? Lets Look here Gal 1:11-12


    11But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

    12For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

    It was by the revelation of Jesus Christ. What was this Revelation ?

    Its the Church, that is what Jesus Christ revealed to Paul as being who it was that He gave Himself for Eph 5:25,27

    Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

    This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

    One Knows a mystery by Revelation ! This is just one of many evidences that Paul's Gospel was one of Preaching a Particular redemption, and that is who He meant by our sins in 1 Cor 15:3, which we know without a shadow of doubt is part of the Gospel Paul Preached !

    I challenge anyone to refute this with scripture !
     
  2. DHK

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    I challenge you to prove it to be true.
    Prove that you are one of the elect, that Christ died for you, that you do indeed have salvation, if you did not accept that salvation by faith. If it is Particular Redemption as you claim, how can you know that you are of that elite group. Give evidence.
     
  3. savedbymercy

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    dhk

    I just started proving it from scripture, now if you reject the proof, that is on you ! I challenge you to prove that Paul did not mean specifically the Church when he said in 1 Cor 15:3 Our Sins !
     
  4. mandym

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    I am starting to thing that behind everyone of your posts is a teenager who parents have no idea what you are doing.
     
  5. savedbymercy

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    Personal attack #1. Try dealing with the scripture witness !
     
  6. mandym

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    Uh no. I believe this is an actual fact. The way in which you present your views and then respond lacks any real maturity.
     
  7. seekingthetruth

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    savedbymercy?

    You are just nasty. Why in the world would any sinner want to repent and become like you?

    Dude? Get a grip, have a heart, and show some kindness.

    john
     
  8. DHK

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    First, Paul did not mean "The Church" because there is no such thing. He was writing to "the church at Corinth," the assembly at Corinth, the local church at Corinth. There was no Universal Church. The word ekklesia means assembly. The only assembly he was addressing was the one at Corinth. It was a very personal letter in which he addresses questions that were being asked of him by certain members in the church. See 1Cor.7:1. "Now the things you wrote to me of..." They had written him a letter. He is answering back concerning the issues that they wrote to him. He is writing a specific letter to the church in Corinth.

    Second, Paul always makes Scripture applicable. The Bible is not sterile. It was not written in a vacuum. Note the signature line on the bottom of each of my posts:
    I know whom I have believed, and am persuaded that he is able to keep that which I have committed unto him against that day.

    This was Paul's testimony. "I know", a testimony of faith. The object of his faith "whom I have believed. Again, faith in whom he believed. "Am persuaded" is indicative of another statement of his confidence or faith in Christ, "who is able to keep that which "I have committed" (another statement of faith) unto him against that day.

    --Paul lived by faith. From salvation to death his life was a life of faith. The Bible is not a sterile book simply to be studied as if in a vacuum. It is living, powerful. It is the power of God unto salvation. For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. (1Cor.1:18)

    Paul gave his testimony. Can you give yours? How did you meet Christ? How were you saved? Is this book alive to you?
     
  9. savedbymercy

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    dhk

    Yes He did, That was the Mystery revealed to Him in the Gospel ! Rom 16:25

    Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,

    Paul stated without question His Gospel was received by Revelation Gal 1:11-12

    11But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

    12For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.


    Eph 3:5-6

    5Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

    6That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body [Church], and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:


    You deny this, you deny the Gospel !
     
  10. savedbymercy

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    Deal with scripture, and enough of the personal attacks !
     
  11. savedbymercy

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    Who does Paul mean, Christ died for our sins ?

    1 Cor 15:1-4


    1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;

    2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.

    3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;

    4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

    Another way of knowing who Paul meant as to whose sins He preached in His Gospel that Christ died for, is by understanding who the letter is addressed to.

    1 Cor 1:1-2

    1Paul called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,

    2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's:

    Paul preached that Christ shed His Blood for the Church of God ! This is established else where also Acts 20:28

    Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

    When he says purchased with His Blood, He simply means that He died for their sins.

    Paul Preached in His Gospel that Christ gave Himself for the Church, not everyone in the world without exception ! Eph 5:25

    25Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;
     
  12. DHK

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    Paul wrote a personal letter to the church at Corinth.
    Romans 16:25 has nothing to do with that letter.
    The gospel was the same. The churches were different: one in Rome, one in Corinth. They were local churches.
    Yes, it was the same gospel that he taught on three different missionary journeys, when he established over 100 LOCAL churches or assemblies. He never started a denomination nor a universal church. There isn't one.
    Written to the church or assembly at Ephesus. How do you think the believers at Ephesus at that time would have understood those verses. Paul was writing to them. That church at Ephesus was one body of believers, as every church is.
    No, I don't deny the gospel at all. It was written to the church at Corinth, to be accepted by faith. Those who accepted it by faith were saved. Those who rejected the message were condemned. That is what the message is.
     
  13. savedbymercy

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    dhk

    All scripture is one whole Revelation, it all has to do with Christ and the Church !

    You are just rejecting Truth. In 1 Cor 15:3, Our sins, is the Church ! You deny this you deny the scripture. You deny the Gospel !
     
  14. DHK

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    Notice they had to receive the gospel. They received it by faith.
    [quote2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain. [/quote]
    --Their faith had to be genuine. "unless you have believed in vain." This refers to a genuine faith; elsewhere put "believe in your heart."
    --Look in Acts 18. Paul had been to Corinth. He preached there. Verse three says: "For I delivered unto you first." "YOU" are the Corinthians, the church that he established there.
    The church of God which is at Corinth
    This specifically identifies the church that Paul is writing to. It is not some mystery church, some unidentifiable, universal. invisible, esoteric, metaphysical, undefinable, existential, so-called church, not mentioned in the Bible.
    Look at the context. The church he was speaking of here is the church at Ephesus. Everything in context.
    Who was Paul speaking to?
    Acts 20:17 And from Miletus he sent to Ephesus, and called the elders of the church.
    --He was speaking to the elders of the church at Ephesus when he said those words. As they were applicable to the assembly at Ephesus they are applicable to every Bible believing local church today.
    Again Paul was speaking to the church at Ephesus. Church, ekklesia means one thing--assembly. There is no such thing as an unassembled assembly.

    Now going back to 1Cor.15:1-4, it is a good definition of the gospel. It was written to the church at Corinth. It was received by faith. It is the power of God unto salvation. If one rejects it they are condemned.
     
  15. DHK

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    2Tim.2:15 tells us to study to show ourselves approved unto God, workmen that need not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth. Not butchering the word of God.

    You can't throw unrelated Scriptures together to try and bolster your pre-determined theology.
    Maybe we should ask what church Adam and Eve belonged to? :rolleyes:
     
  16. savedbymercy

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    dhk

    Yeah they received it. And they received the Truth that Christ died only for the Church ! If we do not receive that, we have not received the Gospel !

    I sure will, because that is where my next point is going to come from confirming that Paul preached a limited atonement, and to amplify even more as to who our sins mean in 1 Cor 15:3 !
     
  17. DHK

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    And they received it by faith.
    Salvation is by faith.
    As they received it by faith so must we all. Salvation is by faith and faith alone.
     
  18. billwald

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    The scripture in post 1 has absolutely nothing to do with the title of post 1,
     
  19. billwald

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    All scripture is one whole Revelation, it all has to do with Christ and the Church !

    Including the scripture about if a married man dies without producing children his brothers have to sleep with the wife until she becomes pregnant?
     
  20. seekingthetruth

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    Your posts are a personal attack on me, my faith, and ny savior.

    Man, you are just nasty

    When you first came to the forum I wanted you kicked out. But now I want you to stay so that maybe you can absorb some truth.

    I disagree with the Cals on here, but i doubt that any of the Cals will agree with your nastiness.

    Man, get a grip

    John
     

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