Love of money: "THE" root or "A"root?

Discussion in 'Bible Versions/Translations' started by robycop3, Dec 13, 2006.

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  1. robycop3

    robycop3
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    On another thread, this question was raised: Is the love of money "THE" root or "A" root? And is a or the root of all evil or all sorts of evil?

    From the KJV:1 Timothy 6:10
    For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

    From the HCSB:1 Timothy 6:10
    For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, and by craving it, some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many pains.

    When I stated that mucho fornication was occurring daily, having nothing to do with money, one gent tried to link it with a love of money. To me, this is absurd, as I see couples shacked up all over the place who are by no means wealthy, nor shacked up for monetary gain. And what about homosexuality and all other sexual sins & perversions? There are very few instances of these where love of money is involved.

    AND JUST HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE BEEN MURDERED OVER THE CENTURIES OVER RELIGION???????????????????????

    And what about HITLER, arguably the greatest sinner who ever lived? His personal finances were very modest. He left very few personal effects. He was never wealthy. And none of his many sins were for love of money.

    Hitler's sins were from megalomania. Jeffrey Dahmer's sins were from sexual aberrations. Charley Whitman's (the Texas Tower shooter) sins were from a mental breakdown. Certainly, none of them had any love of money, but they committed different kinds of great sin. Now, while the love money is A large root for all sortsa sin, it's certainly not THE base root for ALL evil.

    YOUR thoughts?
     
  2. ccrobinson

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    I believe it's A root of all sorts of evil, but not THE root of all evil. However, this is not a hill I'm going to die on, and I think economic incentives/disincentives drive us, in general, more than we'd care to admit.

    Could it be argued that the push for "gay marriage" is money? There have been homosexuals throughout world history. So, why "gay marriage" now? I have a theory, that will almost certainly never be proven, that the push for "gay marriage" began in earnest when the so-called marriage penalty was eliminated in the federal income tax code. Without the financial gain that comes by being able to file your taxes jointly, I don't believe "gay marriage" would be an issue at all.

    I readily admit that this reasoning may be complete nonsense, but something has to explain why there has been such a push for "gay marriage" now when it could have been pushed just as easily in the mid to late 90s.
     
  3. Amy.G

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    Because it takes time to desensitize and soften the public about homosexuality. As far as the OP, did Cain kill Able because of money?
     
  4. Rufus_1611

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    The love of money is the root of all evil. I know this because the Bible tells me so and does not need to be proved by man's arguments for it to be truth. All Christians would be confident that money is the root of all evil, unless they were reading from different Bibles that say different things.

    In your fornication example, there is something that gets into the head of people that causes them to sin against God. Their fornication is not the root of their evil it is a sin or a symptom of rebellion. We are what we believe and what we put before our eyes impacts our thoughts and our actions. I would challenge you to find people that are fornicating together who do not watch television, movies or listen to rock and roll. Popular entertainment does enormous harm to the worldview of people. The individuals that put out this popular entertainment do it for the love of money. In their love of money they serve to corrupt people and cause them to sin against God. The producers of these evil communications love...money.

    Another example would be covetousness. Why do people covet, especially in America? One of the reasons they do this is because they have been bombarded by commercial after commercial, programming them to desire things they do not have or need. The corporations that put out these advertisements love...money.

    The number one cause of divorce is...money. People in America are struggling because of their covetousness and because of an unbalanced and corrupt monetary system. This system has been set-up by bankers who love...money.

    Less than 10% of the world owns 85% of the world's wealth. How much is too much before we consider them greedy and lovers of money? How many would be fed, how many would have less restless lives if they didn't have to compete against the greedy folks who love...money.

    I'm sure you will disagree, but the primary cause of hundreds of Bible versions, which serve to cause division in the church and confusion throughout, is...money. How much evil in the world occurs because so many don't believe they have the Word of God in their hands or are confused because they have no foundation as multiple versions of the Word of God say such different things?

    As to religion and persecution from religion. Where would the Catholic church been had they not coerced people out of their money. Remember this?

    "When the coin in the coffer rings a soul from purgatory springs." - John Tetzel​

    You can't keep people impoverished without seducing them out of their wealth. You need money in order to buy swords, guillotines and other instruments of torture in order for wicked people to persecute others who don't think like they do.

    As to Hitler, his motivations may not have been money but he would have gone back to the hole he came out of had people not provided him with the resources to do what he did. Someone or someones supplied him with...money and as much as there are losers in war there are always winners and their wins are gauged in profit.

    I don't know what the fights were about but if they were like most couples I can guess that at least one or two of the fights were about...money.
    "There were constant fights between Joyce and Lionel Dahmer and Jeffrey took each of these fights to heart.

    Little did they realise that there constant fighting would be the one of the reasons for Jeffrey's downfall."​
    (Source: http://www.tornadohills.com/dahmer/life.htm)

    Charley Whitman was also alleged to be on Dexedrine, does anyone profit from the sales of psychotropic medications that mess with people's minds?

    My Bible says the love of money is the root of all evil and I believe it.
     
  5. AVBunyan

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    Here is a novel idea - Try studying the English word money.

    One of the definitions of moeny is wealth, influence.

    Then study wealth and you can also get:
    "external happpiness, possession of goods"

    Study influence also denotes power.

    "The" fits perfectly - the love of money covers it all including all the examples you folks gave.

    When in doubt do not assume the word is wrong bcause you don't understand it - study the "words" out. Some things arre hard to be understood.

    God bless
     
  6. Amy.G

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    No doubt these things can be evil and the devil uses them to deceive God's own, but people have been fornicating long before the invention of tv or electronic devices. Did the love of money cause Cain to kill Able? No doubt loving money causes many sins in different areas, but it is not THE cause of all evil. Human's worship all kinds of idols, not just money. Did Adam sin because of a love of money?
    The passage in question is speaking about greedy ministers who have strayed from the faith because of their "love of money".
     
  7. Amy.G

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    Where did you get these definitions?
     
  8. AVBunyan

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    http://65.66.134.201/cgi-bin/webste...inetpub/wwwroot/cgi-bin/webster/web1828=faith

    Folks sometimes run Bible references but a great study is to first go to a good English dictionary and fisrt get the defintion - then study the key words of the definition and then run the key words through the same dictionary - and then finally go back to the scriptures and run the definitions through to see what the scriptures say - the method is part of "The Principle Approach" method to studying any subject.

    My wife has built homeschool subjects/lessons based upon the above method.

    And yes, I understand if scripture says one thing and the dictionary says another the scriptures are right and the final authority.

    BTW - most people assume money just means "money" as we speak of it in the form of coin, etc. Money means more than that and also carries with it gain and this can mean gain of anything.

    God bless
     
    #8 AVBunyan, Dec 13, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 13, 2006
  9. Amy.G

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    Yet, you are using the dictionary to prove your point. I checked webster's and didn't find these definitions.
    Did Adam sin because of a love of money?
     
  10. AntennaFarmer

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    Yes. The love of money is not the cause but the root of all evil.

    We know from nature that a root is that which anchors in place and nourishes a growing thing. A root is hidden in the earth so we seldom see it.

    Checking the Greek I see that the TR reads the same as the revised text (Aland third edition). It isn't an issue of a change of the Greek.

    It appears to me that the King James is more literal in translation than the MVs as kinds does not appear in the Greek here.

    A.F.
     
  11. tinytim

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    I guess the love of money will cause people to redefine words to make them fit with their interpretation of the Bible.
     
  12. tinytim

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    And my Bible says, 1 Timothy 6:10 (NIV)
    (10) For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil. Some people, eager for money, have wandered from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.

    And I Believe it.. and it makes much more sense!
     
  13. Amy.G

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    Did the love of money cause Adam to sin? Was it the ROOT of his sin?
    Anybody?
     
  14. tinytim

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    Pride is what is behind all sin... From Satan's fall to the sin that was just committed..

    Sin is putting yourself first!
    Eve did it.
    Cain did it.
    The one that just committed adultery thought of himself instead of his wife.
    The one that just stole something was thinking of themselves.
    It has led to one version onlyism from the RCC and their Latin to the OVOist of today.
    It makes us think that we are know it alls.
    It will make us think that the way church is done in the southern US is the only way to worship God.
    It will make us think that just because we worship God in a certain way, it must be the only way.



    And Greed...the love of money... is based in pride...

    Pride is the real root of all evil.
    You have to read the verse in context. Paul was telling Timothy, a young pastor how to be content.
    And those of us in ministry need to learn how to be content with what God has given us.

    When we start loving money we will fall.
    That is the context it was written in.
     
    #14 tinytim, Dec 13, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 13, 2006
  15. Amy.G

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    Thank you Tiny Tim, pride is it. THE root of all evil. It would be hard for Adam to love money so much he sinned against God since there was no such thing in the garden.:tongue3:
     
  16. tinytim

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    Of course, I can twist the words "love of money" to make it mean pride...
    Let's see...how do I do this...

    Love of money = greed
    Greed is rooted in pride
    Therefore "love of money" = "pride"

    Is that how you twist scripture to make it fit, boys?

    So therefore since Pride can be shown to be a substitute for "love of money" then "The love of money (pride) is the root of all evil"

    There that should make the KJVOists proud...
    I know, I used to be one!
     
  17. AVBunyan

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    Tiny - I try real hard to be polite to you when i respond t o - Let's analyze:

    1. I sought to give the explanation to the verse by defining the English word fron an English dictiionary. I did it without any sarcasm or attitude.

    2. The definition of the word gave clarification to the meaning of the word. you folks do not use dictionaries?

    3. Defining a word is not redfining the word - it is giving clarification to the word. I never changed the word.

    4. You changed the verse by saying pride is the root of all evil.

    5. Greek/Hebrew "pros" go to the Greek/Hebrew all the time to "redefine" the words iin a King James Bible.

    6. I sought to show a method bible study which was meant to be an encouragement.

    7. Finally, What did you do - It appears you just accused my motive in this was for the love of money thus saying what I did was evil?

    Hey mods - I'm trying to be nice.
     
  18. PASTOR MHG

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    TTim is on the right track. Everyone always seems to forget that it is the "love of money" that is the root of all evil...not just "money."

    So, to properly exegete the passage we must determine what the sin behind the "LOVE OF money" actually is. I think it is safe to say that it is PRIDE and COVETOUSNESS.

    People want "something for nothing." That even applies to roby's fornication illustration. They want the pleasures of intimacy without the commitment of marriage. And they rebell at the thought of God's judgement...PRIDE and COVETOUSNESS.

    So, according to the verse as it stands in the KJV, it is correct...the "LOVE OF money" (the sins of pride and covetousness) is the ROOT of all evil.

    Hope this helps,

    Max
     
  19. Blammo

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    And then copyright 'em. :smilewinkgrin:
     
  20. tinytim

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    Come on, money means money...
    From dictionary.com:
    mon·ey [​IMG]/ˈmʌn[​IMG]i/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[muhn-ee] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, plural mon·eys, mon·ies, adjective [​IMG] [​IMG]
    –noun 1.any circulating medium of exchange, including coins, paper money, and demand deposits. 2.paper money. 3.gold, silver, or other metal in pieces of convenient form stamped by public authority and issued as a medium of exchange and measure of value. 4.any article or substance used as a medium of exchange, measure of wealth, or means of payment, as checks on demand deposit or cowrie. 5.a particular form or denomination of currency. 6.money of account. 7.capital to be borrowed, loaned, or invested: mortgage money. 8.an amount or sum of money: Did you bring some money? 9.wealth considered in terms of money: She was brought up with money. 10.moneys or monies, Chiefly Law. pecuniary sums. 11.property considered with reference to its pecuniary value. 12.pecuniary profit: not for love or money.



    Nowhere in the Bible can you show where Cain slew Abel for money...
    He was jealous! It was based in his pride.

    And redefining "money" will never do.
    If you have to redefine the words in the KJV, then the KJV is useless.
    Ask the average person on the street what money is, and you will get one of the above definitions...not yours. You redefined it to make it seem like the KJV is right.

    The KJV was written to be understood by normal people.
    It says "money", surely it must mean "money" Unless that is a mistake in the KJV...
     
    #20 tinytim, Dec 13, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 13, 2006
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