Malachi 2:16 - Who's hating?

Discussion in 'Bible Versions/Translations' started by rsr, Oct 11, 2009.

  1. rsr

    rsr
    Expand Collapse
    <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2001
    Messages:
    10,075
    Likes Received:
    102
    Tonight the pastor was preaching from Malachi 2. He uses the NKJV and, as usual, I was reading along in my Holman. (I usually carry the Holman instead of my ESV because it's smaller and easier to tote around.)

    When he came to 2:16, I noticed a significant difference.

    “For the LORD God of Israel says
    That He hates divorce,
    For it covers one’s garment with violence,”
    Says the LORD of hosts. (NKJV)


    This is similar to the KJV:

    For the LORD, the God of Israel, saith that he hateth putting away: for one covereth violence with his garment, saith the LORD of hosts: therefore take heed to your spirit, that ye deal not treacherously.


    But the Holman takes a different tack, imputing the hatred to Israel/Judah/the husband:

    "If he hates and divorces [his wife]," says the LORD God of Israel, "he covers his garment with injustice," says the LORD of Hosts. Therefore, watch yourselves carefully, and do not act treacherously. (HCSB)

    I reached for the NIV pew Bible:

    "I hate divorce," says the LORD God of Israel, "and I hate a man's covering himself with violence as well as with his garment," says the LORD Almighty. (NIV)

    [The TNIV agrees here with the NIV and the KJV/NKJV.]

    I thought this might be one of the somewhat odd readings that I've come across in the Holman, but I found that the ESV agrees:

    “For the man who does not love his wife but divorces her, says the Lord, the God of Israel, covers his garment with violence, says the Lord of hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit, and do not be faithless.” (ESV)

    [This was a change from the RSV, upon which the ESV is based.]

    I did some research and found that the Holman first edition had followed the traditional rendering:

    “I hate divorce,” says the LORD God of Israel, “and I hate it when people clothe themselves with injustice,” says the LORD Almighty.
    So be on your guard, and do not be unfaithful.


    But it was changed for the second edition and now agrees with the ESV.

    So ... who is doing the hating here?

    (There's another Holman translation issue in Malachi 2 that I also want to discuss, but that's another thread.)
     
    #1 rsr, Oct 11, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 11, 2009
  2. Deacon

    Deacon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2002
    Messages:
    6,972
    Likes Received:
    129
    “For the man who does not love his wife but divorces her, says the LORD, the God of Israel, covers his garment with violence, says the LORD of hosts. So guard yourselves in your spirit, and do not be faithless.”
    Malachi 2:16 ESV

    כִּֽי־שָׂנֵ֣א [transliterated - kî-sanay’] which translates as “but/for [he] hates” (emphatic), is translated idiomatically in most versions.

    The exact phrase is found in 2 Samuel, however unlike 2 Samuel the subject is not stated.

    But Absalom spoke to Amnon neither good nor bad, for Absalom [he] hated Amnon…
    2 Samuel 13:22a ESV (brackets and underlining inserted)

    The note in the BHS apparatus reads “prb שׂנאתי“, this alternative translates, “I hate(d)” as found in Malachi 1:3.

    but Esau I have hated.
    Malachi 1:3a ESV


    There’s a good explanation in the NET Bible

    It's certainly worth a footnote in a version!

    Rob
     
    #2 Deacon, Oct 13, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 13, 2009
  3. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2006
    Messages:
    2,872
    Likes Received:
    3
    Does God really hate divorce when He is Himself divorced? (Jeremiah 3:8)
     
  4. Deacon

    Deacon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2002
    Messages:
    6,972
    Likes Received:
    129
    Some might say that's all the more reason to hate it.

    Those that have suffered through the heartache of betrayal and the loss of their beloved, hate divorce.

    ****************
    I'd be curious to see how the ancient versions handle this passage.

    Here's one:

    But if, since you hate her, you should send her away, says the Lord, the God of Israel, then impiety will cover over his garments, says the Lord Almighty. And be vigilant in your spirit and do not abandon her.
    Malachius 2:16 New English Translation of the Septuagint [NETS]

    Rob
     
  5. Carico

    Carico
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2009
    Messages:
    311
    Likes Received:
    0
    Israel was unfaithful to him, Deacon. So yes, God hates divorce just like he hates infidelity. The divorce is simply calling what Israel's infidelity was; a broken covenant.
     
  6. rsr

    rsr
    Expand Collapse
    <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2001
    Messages:
    10,075
    Likes Received:
    102
    Thanks, Rob.

    I ran across a 25-page article by C. John Collins (the Old Testament chairman for the ESV) on the ESV Web site that explains why the ESV translators rendered it as they did.

    He points out that the KJV reading was in fact a new one: the LXX and Vulgate do not say that God hates divorce; similar readings are found in Luther, Calvin, the Great Bible and the Geneva. (He could have added the Bishops to the list.)

    The previous English versions also differed from the KJV markedly in another aspect, as shown in the Geneva:

    If thou hatest her, put her away, sayeth the Lorde God of Israel, yet he couereth the iniurie vnder his garment, saieth the Lord of hosts: therefore keepe your selues in your spirite, and transgresse not.

    Which is almost identical with the Bishops:

    If thou hatest her, put her away, saith the lorde God of Israel: yet he couereth the iniurie vnder his garment, saith the Lorde of hoastes, and be ye kept in your spirite, and transgresse not.

    You also will notice that the older English reading is different from the ESV/HSCB, which say that divorce is covering his garment with injustice or violence. The older English readings make no such declaration.

    I'm getting the impression that the entire passage is a translational mine field.
     
  7. Deacon

    Deacon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member
    Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2002
    Messages:
    6,972
    Likes Received:
    129
    MALACHI 2:16 AGAIN
    by C. John Collins

    I've got his book Science and Faith, it's well worth the time spent reading.
    I can't wait to read this article, Thanks

    Rob
     
  8. Johnv

    Johnv
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0
    Being of a class does not make one ineligible for hating that class. Many people here are divorced, and I'd venture to say every one who is still hates divorce.
     
  9. Harold Garvey

    Harold Garvey
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    The Lord put her away and is in the process of REDEEMING Israel.

    God hates the action rooted in unforgiveness.

    If Israel repents they will be saved.

    Isn't it wonder how PERFECT exeigesis works in the KJV!:love2:
     
  10. Johnv

    Johnv
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0
    Hmmmm, I think there's a DNFTT policy.
     
  11. rsr

    rsr
    Expand Collapse
    <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
    Administrator

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2001
    Messages:
    10,075
    Likes Received:
    102
  12. Harold Garvey

    Harold Garvey
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2009
    Messages:
    1,036
    Likes Received:
    0
    Everyone doesn't have a copy of your code
    book: define "DNFTT"

    Of, that's right, it's a modern version of the Bible.:tonofbricks:
     
  13. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2006
    Messages:
    2,872
    Likes Received:
    3
    Its not misspelled! Its just a typo.
     
  14. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2006
    Messages:
    2,872
    Likes Received:
    3
    First, the verse doesn't say that God hates 'the divorced' (as class of people); and I didn't say that God hates 'the divorced'. The verse said that God hates divorce (a legal action).

    Second, many people may hate divorce for various reasons: the ugliness of the process, the financial costs, the social stigma, or whatever. Outside these unpleasant consequences many people are pleased with divorce (and remarriage). But these are not the reasons that God hates divorce.
     
  15. franklinmonroe

    franklinmonroe
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2, 2006
    Messages:
    2,872
    Likes Received:
    3
    True. My sister divorced her (first) husband when she caught him committing adultery.

    But this verse is not addressing a justifiable divorce based upon a betrayal (as God's is with Judah); these men were committing frivolous divorces of convenience.

    The question is: who is committing the hating? In the context, it would seem more likely that Malachi is describing these men mistreating their wives than God hating divorce itself here.
     
    #15 franklinmonroe, Oct 15, 2009
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 15, 2009
  16. Johnv

    Johnv
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2001
    Messages:
    21,321
    Likes Received:
    0
    Do Not Feed The Trolls. That would be you.
     

Share This Page

Loading...