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Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Salty, Nov 8, 2009.
What are your thoughts about the Masons
Note, you may make multiple answers in the poll
I'm not a Mason but from what I have seen of them, they are not a Christian organization. Judging from their public rituals and symbols, I would be more inclined to call them deists. The believe in some sort of god but refuse to give him a name. This isn't to say there are no Christian Masons, I know there are, but the organization certainly is not.
As a christian I could not under any circumstances join that organisation.
I would never be a member of a church that allowed masons to serve as pastor, deacon, teacher, or any other leadership role in the church.
Years ago I joined 'the Star' with the idea of accompanying my mother to the meetings where she was member and played the piano. The only meeting I attended was my initiation: My experience isn't remembered very well but I do remember thinking, as being taken on some kind of ritual walk and processing through some stories which reminded me of the Bible stories I've read: I was told that these were alagories, and the signs and grasp were a way of secret identification to other members. I believe I remember "The Lord's Prayer" which is actuallly not the Lord's prayer, but a model prayer, being recited and it seems there was some slight alteration of what I'm accustomed to saying..... but it may not be significant. What struck me is that I was being told that this was not a religion, but the ritual reminded me of religious rituals common to some church practices derived or practiced in RC, and which, having view missionary films of pagan rituals, also reminded me of behavioral conformity of following a leader and practice of submission and acceptance and no opportunity to question or have questions answered. I was told at each 'point' what my answers were supposed to be in response to certain questions or directives. I was also told that the Bible represented the Word of God........ but not that it is the Word of God. I later studied into Masonry, from which the Order of the Eastern Star springs as the female compliment to the men's organization.... and learned that any 'holy' book in a culture would suffice...... including the koran. I started realizing that the authority this organization held was a power of its own design and the morality was a concept of loyalty to it and its membership and for some may have no association with Christianity. With the infusion of 'Bible stories' or biblical characters, and taking capital of public trust based on fronting benevolent causes, I also recognized how it would be so easily to join and go and without a relationship with Jesus Christ or to have a shallow faith and little grounding in the scripture and become seriously involved without recognizing the occult nature of the rituals and teachings or the distraction from truth when stories are presented only in part or with unscriptural embellishment to cause a conformity and dependance to a fellowship with practices which are not Christian at all.
Many who are involved don't see anything wrong with masonry appear to be sincere Christians and may not have experience the twang of conscious which red flags caution or deception. But I do believe that there are many who participate in the rituals and attend the meetings with more dedication than they would show in fellowship with a church. Many would say 'it is a Christian organization, or a organization of Christians' either believing this to be so or deceptively covering so that others believe this is so.
My grandfather believed in Jesus Christ, yet he attended the Lodge and was buried with a ritual garb called 'the Lamb skin' at his waist. I see this as mockery..... where an organization pulls calculated stories of the Bible...... some of which have relative insignificance outside of a deep study of scripture, and symbols and uses these to twisted meaning and to obscure the fact that it has nothing to do with Christianity in practice or belief, but creates a deception and confusion and may serve to create division.
Solomon's temple and the building thereof seems to be a recurring theme. While God told David that he would allow Solomon to build him a temple, by the time Solomon was involved in the building of the temple, he was already getting involved in studying and taking on pagan influences and possibly incorporated rituals and artifacts not ordained of God. In the end..... Solomon, the wisest man ever to have lived..... as he was known..... came to the conclusion that with all his learning came a great sorrow: I have wondered was this a sorrow of repentance or a sorrow of confusion and shaken faith of seeking after all knowledge and wisdom through the experience of man or occult divination, he had lost his joy and dependance on the Lord for all wisdom, knowlege and understanding.
While a time of persecution may cause some to agree to some kind of secret recognition for opening communications and fellowship with others who are similarly facing persecution....... I do not see this as part of God's design for those who trust him and find fellowship in his church.
I would be hesitant to dispell or condemn anyone involved in the masons or other secret organizations, but I do suspect that either they have not thought it through or they have and are seering their conscious by their practice..... if they are Christian and continue.
BTW, generally, unless expelled, once one joins, they are still considered to be a part of the group even if they stop attending or paying dues. I found this true in my case after reading about it in another. Therefore, I would not take the report of a person who reports anonther as being a member of their lodge or organization (which normally would not be revealed on a member in good standing) without personally checking out for myself with that person to see where he stands on this issue, if I'm so involved in an area of search or confidence where this might be important.
The masonic Bible has the compass and square embellished on its cover with the letter "G". While people are customarily told the letter G stands for God...... they aren't told the god presented in the rituals is not in agreement and the same as the God of the Christian frith. The placement of these symbols upon the Bible represents to me that all that is contained within the pages of the Bible are meant to conform in obediance and submission to masonry...... instead of the easily presumed meaning that masonry endorses the Bible. No man can serve two gods. Either an organization represents the true God, or the god it represents is not true.
I don't know any men in our church are masons or not, but I know theres nothing in the by laws about it.
One time I had a pastor who officiated at a funeral of a member of our church. The person who died was also a mason. It was an interesting ritual they went through...the pastor stepped back from it and did not involve himself.
Currently, I know of no masons (that acknowledge out loud) that are in any of the churches I attend.
This is one more of many threads about Masonry,,at least by people who think they know all about Masonry.
I was a 33rd Degree and Master Mason and still pastor of a Baptist Church. My fundamental theology was not harmed nor denied one little bit. I quit Masonry for personal reasons, but true my oath if secrecy, would never disclose anything about Masonry or why I quit.
I just know that I laugh as I read what people have to say about it.
Like Jim1999 I have been a Mason, served as Master of my Lodge, and other offices. During my time in Masonry, I saw and read nothing that contradicted my
christian beliefs. Like Jim, I also will not discuss Masonry with anyone nor disclose anything about Masonry.
Taking an oath to slit your own throat should you reveal the "secrets" (that everyone already knows about) of the lodge should be the first indicator that there is a problem. And Christians have no business taking such ungodly oaths. But more than that who is the god of freemasonry?
The cult of Freemasonry is in direct contradiction to scripture.
I'm one of the few in my family that has yet to join up. My dad and grandfather both get some good laughs out of the conspiracy theories.
It seems that all the devil worshiping allegations go back to Albert Pike, which my dad assured me that Masons think he's nuts today.
It is frustrating that both dad and grandpa won't tell me anything though. I'm considering the local lodge and dad says hes knows a few people there.
Can you witness Christ to another 'brother' who is not saved, under the banner of masonry?
As loyal as some of you may be to the 'secrets' in masonry, can you honestly say, that, without knowledge of one thing or another, you are also bound by your oaths to support the cause of a fellow mason who signals his association through a sign of distress?
While some teachings of the Bible can be pulled and applied to the 24 hr rule of time and the teaching in masonry to divide and wisely use your time...... is it not sufficient that the Word of God, the inspired Word of God as given to Moses, the prophets and psalmist, the apostles etc. teaches these things and is the true Word?
The lodge is also referred to as a temple...... so who is worshipped there if a Koran can sit on your altar..... and lodges do have altars?
If there are no requirements to submission, then why does the very initiation begin with a control and stripping you of your possessions and clothes and garbing you in a garment of their provision and then escorting you with a blinder on your eyes in a ritual where at one point you are instructed to offer a gift........ and being stripped of all your possessions you are left to depend on the help of another human being 'a brother' to offer what is requested of you? If your providence comes from man where is the teaching of the trust in God? And since God is defined by whatever you decide him to be..... how do you know God is the same to the others with whom you fellowship and to whom you bind yourself with an oath and are repeatedly reminded by subsequent instruction?
Most of our recent presidents have been masons and while people try to make a lot about the party of the person who nominates the justices on the SCOTUS, the majority of justices sitting against allowing prayer and Bible reading in school were masons, and the said can be said about more recent rulings of the SCOTUS.
While some may say that Clinton wasn't a mason, he had been a member of the DeMolay, the youth counterpart which is sponsored and supported by masons.
If the G also represents the god of islam to the muslim, or Lucifer to a witch, how can it also represent the LORD GOD ALMIGHTY to you who find fellowship and bonding with people of other religions?
Why is it, no matter how many degrees you've made, at every step your instructed to respond that your quest is for 'MORE LIGHT'? Doesn't the Bible already tell us who is the light of the world..... Jesus Christ....... but masonry doesn't allow you to pray in his name in its rituals nor discuss salvation in him within its walls, lest you offend a brother whos god or religion is differnt? If the oaths and discipline are so secret that you feel an obligation to them over revealing them and being open with others....... what causes you to think that masonry may contain some secrets of its own that it keeps for only a few...... which may not include you...... nor be for your good or the good of your failth.
No man can server two gods.
An organization which requires a blind allegiance to it and its membership under a G which represents god to every man by how ever he defines his god cannot represent the true God........ nor does its 'good works' nor those of its members buy them a righteousness which is eternal and everlasting.
They do not need to tell you anything. Their "secrets" are posted all over the internet.
I understand the history of the Free Masons and understand its a cult that grew out of a Mideval version of a Trade Union. However, they are elitist and not inclusive. They are secret for a reason and ultimately how Christian are they really? Sure they do a lot for society but what if you're not one of the blessed by their organization. How many competant people have been overlooked for Job oportunities? How many Masons are both Mason's and KKK members? How can this be Christian?
I think it's atrocious that the Masons kept all the treasure hidden under Trinity Church all these years.
Also in the Magic Flute.
Some years ago I made a study of AF&AM, reading several primary sources - including Morals and Dogma, Claussen's Commentaries, and some modern books written for Masons by Masons - and interviewing a man who had been a 33 degree mason. Of course I read some Christian sources, also.
I came to the conclusion that Freemasonry is not only a non-Christian Cult, being by it's own admissions not a Christian organization, but it is also Occult- the meaning of occult being "hidden." Try to tell me that Masonry isn't hidden, or secretive.
As a Christian I could never be party to such an organization that places any miscellaneous religion on the pedestal, dependending on the religion of the members. If the Quran, or the Veda's, the writings of Confuncious, Bhudda, or anyone else are acceptable, then the Bible is not, since there is a large contradiction between man's religions and God's Truth. (Or does truth not matter?)
"Man loves darkness rather than light, because his deeds are evil." Truth has nothing to hide, evil prefers the darkness and secrecy.
Amazingly enough, the responses of many on this thread were quite predictable.
Our church will not accept masons as members. As many of you could have predicted.
When I was growing up in the Presbyterian Church (PCA), there were several masons in the membership of the church, some of them elders. I never really heard anything bad about them until some time after becoming a Baptist.
There is enough doubt in my mind about them I would never join, but, since I know nothing of their beliefs for sure, it is hard to condemn anyone else for joining. If I knew more about them, my guess is I would feel pretty much like Rev Mitchell does.
Since Masons give secret signs for distress, I guess they dont have much need for Onstar.