Murph saw the passion finally!!!!

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by C.S. Murphy, Apr 8, 2004.

  1. C.S. Murphy

    C.S. Murphy
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    Well I finally saw the film and right up front there are some apologies in order. To those whom I have been overly harsh concerning this film please forgive me. I sat there with pen in hand ready to make notes on all the error I saw.
    #1 The devil in the garden bothers me but I can't honestly say that it is contrary to scripture.
    #2 the fact that several people refer to Mary as mother is very catholic and a little disturbing but does not necessarily contradict scripture.
    #3 The incident where they dropped him off the bridge is stupid but I honestly don't see it compromising scripture.
    #4 The fact that Mary is always around and remains strong for the most part is not against any scripture that I see.
    #5 The portrayal of satan holding the baby during the beatings is ignorant IMO but again I see nothing against scripture.
    #6 The crow pecking the eyes out of the cross victim is out of place but I cannot say that this never happened or did not happen here.
    #7 the cloth with the face of Christ is obviously a catholic symbol and I don't believe it happened but I see no scripture that would be violated by it.
    #8 IMO Mary was not grotesguely licking the blood off Jesus feet, but rather kissing her sons feet. According to the film this was the only place she could reach. While mel may have meant a catholic promotion by this I don't think it betrayed scripture.
    #9 The fact that Jesus spoke to Mary during the journey to the cross is troubling but we always have John's gospel saying that the world would not hold everything he said were it written down. Now I don't understand Him saying to her "behold I make all things new" but again this was made with Mel's money and IMo scripture doesn't definately say this did not happen.
    #10 many have complained that the film doesn't give reverence to the resserection but I feel it was covered to all who believe and it gave enough information so as to spark the interest of any seekers. The scripture is given declaring His resserection and then we see the open tomb.
    #11 the issue of a naked butt is just a waste of time, remember I was taking notes and I saw the upper thigh from the rear but not a butt.

    That's about all I remember that I would classify as unimportant and now I want to add a few items that IMO are not against scripture but may be against the spirit of the text.

    #1 the demon children chasing Judas should not be there as I feel the reason judas hanged himself is because of Godly sorrow over his actions not because demons were chasing him.
    #2 The way that they did not show the guards falling down as He said "I am" This omission is harmful because it shows the power that He possesed.
    #3 The ommission of the Jews saying "His blood be upon us" I have read that Mel intended to use it but Jewish pressure forced him to delete it.
    #4 Mary being present and holding His body after He was taken down seems to contradict the scripture stating that Joseph took down His body but another Gospel says that the body was delivered to Joseph. Was mary there? she could have been and I really don't feel it contradicts scripture.

    Now to my sole remaining beef with the film. According to Matthew the angel rolls away the stone and shows them that He was risen. Why then does Mel show the stone moving and Christ standing up and walking out of the tomb. I feel this is very important because it contradicts scripture and IMO weakens the power of the Lord. Nobody had to roll the stone He exited before that occured. Once again to those I have offended i apologize and to those I am about to please feel free to question my opinion it is just that an opinion.
    God Bless
    Murph

    Now
     
  2. Karen

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    Thank you. [​IMG]

    Karen
     
  3. TaterTot

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    Ditto, murph.
    Where was the butt? I saw the film twice and never noticed a butt. Also, I figured the demon children were just the form Mel chose to portary the mental/spiritual anguish Judas experienced. But, I agree with your assessment. Glad you saw it.
     
  4. onestand

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    murph...your take on the movie is much appreciated, thank you for actually making an educated attempt at it..*smiles*
     
  5. blackbird

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    You're "April Foolin'?" Right, Murph??

    Your buddy,
    Brother David
     
  6. NaasPreacher (C4K)

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    I don't thik the problem was ever that it was "unbiblical" but that the extra-biblical parts were so Catholic and Murph appears to have confirmed those concerns.

    Thanks for the input Murph, but still not ready yo go.

    By the way - not going has given me half a dozen excellent chances to share the gospel as the "why" I will not go.
     
  7. blackbird

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    Wake up, Murph!! Its a bad dream!! You'll be alright!!! Wake up! Wake uuuuuuuuuup!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  8. LadyEagle

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    Thank you, Murph! Your apology means a lot to some of us who have really taken a bashing here on the Board. I'm glad you saw the film. [​IMG] Again, thank you!

    Your Sister in Christ,
    Lady Eagle
     
  9. Spirit and Truth

    Spirit and Truth
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    Murph said:

    To those whom I have been overly harsh concerning this film please forgive me. I sat there with pen in hand ready to make notes on all the error I saw.

    #1 The devil in the garden bothers me but I can't honestly say that it is contrary to scripture.

    S&T:

    The above information was gotten through divination sources, as well as a good share of the other stuff that you discussed in both of your lists.Let's see if God thinks divination goes against His Kingdom and will:


    1Sa 28:6 And when Saul enquired of the LORD, the LORD answered him not, neither by dreams, nor by Urim, nor by prophets.
    7 Then said Saul unto his servants, Seek me a woman that hath a familiar spirit, that I may go to her, and enquire of her. And his servants said to him, Behold, [there is] a woman that hath a familiar spirit at Endor.

    S&T:

    We all know how that turned out.....


    Act 13:8 But Elymas the sorcerer (for so is his name by interpretation) withstood them, seeking to turn away the deputy from the faith.
    9 Then Saul, (who also [is called] Paul,) filled with the Holy Ghost, set his eyes on him,
    10 And said, O full of all subtilty and all mischief, [thou] child of the devil, [thou] enemy of all righteousness, wilt thou not cease to pervert the right ways of the Lord?
    11 And now, behold, the hand of the Lord [is] upon thee, and thou shalt be blind, not seeing the sun for a season. And immediately there fell on him a mist and a darkness; and he went about seeking some to lead him by the hand.
    12 Then the deputy, when he saw what was done, believed, being astonished at the doctrine of the Lord.

    S&T:

    This is how God, through Paul dealt with mysticism, and sources that confused the truth of God.


    Deu 18:10 There shall not be found among you [any one] that maketh his son or his daughter to pass through the fire, [or] that useth divination, [or] an observer of times, or an enchanter, or a witch,

    S&T:

    Clearly forbidden by the word.....


    2Ki 17:17 And they caused their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire, and used divination and enchantments, and sold themselves to do evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke him to anger.

    S&T:

    In the above scripture, God calls divination evil.


    Jer 14:14 Then the LORD said unto me, The prophets prophesy lies in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart.

    S&T:

    Here, God calls the diviners liars.


    Eze 12:24 For there shall be no more any vain vision nor flattering divination within the house of Israel.

    S&T:

    I guess then, that if people do not consider themselves part of spiritual Israel, then divination would be acceptable......


    Eze 13:6 They have seen vanity and lying divination, saying, The LORD saith: and the LORD hath not sent them: and they have made [others] to hope that they would confirm the word.

    S&T:

    Diviners are NOT sent by God...but a movie based on divination sources is?


    Eze 13:7 Have ye not seen a vain vision, and have ye not spoken a lying divination, whereas ye say, The LORD saith [it]; albeit I have not spoken?

    S&T:

    God doesn't speak through diviners, so does He speak through a movie based on it?

    The mystical sources that Mel used to fill in all the blanks that you said does not go against scripture do not even agree with each other. Since the prophets test the prophets, and since Jesus did not tell the mystics two separate sets of differing facts, it is proven to be by sources other than God. This is what the Book says, and is not my opinion.
     
  10. dianetavegia

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    Murph, thanks for this! I agree with Lady Eagle. Many of us have taken a beating and appreciate your sharing your thoughts.

    Diane
     
  11. Spirit and Truth

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    Act 16:16 And it came to pass, as we went to prayer, a certain damsel possessed with a spirit of divination met us, which brought her masters much gain by soothsaying:
    17 The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying, These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation.
    18 And this did she many days. But Paul, being grieved, turned and said to the spirit, I command thee in the name of Jesus Christ to come out of her. And he came out the same hour.

    S&T:

    Paul didn't send people to the divination source to get information or get saved. He cast the spirit out of the girl according to God's will.Because the girl was speaking "about" God, it did not make her "of" God. The devil talks "about" God. So does this movie, as it mixes a little of God's truth with sources of divination, while Christians send the unsaved to see it. Discernment is at an all time low in my opinion.
     
  12. blackbird

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    All of that "extra-cirriculum" activity going on--

    -the snake in the garden,

    -the spooky lookin' kids taunting Judas(I often wonder why Judas could look the Master of the Universe square in the eye and betray him---kissing the Door to Heaven and going to hell----and never "bat an eyelash"---but yet a bunch of kids "throws him off!!")--

    -Mary kissing the feet of Jesus

    -the teardrop falling from the sky

    -Jesus dangling from the bridge by that chain

    and all of the rest of whatever is extra---and reaks of Catholic heresy---because it DOES NOT appear in scripture---CANNOT be received as TRUTH!

    Only what is revealed in the TRUTH of SCRIPTURE is to be received as TRUTH!

    This "Can or cannot"--"May or may not" stuff---can't be accepted as truth! Look me straight in the eye and tell me I'm a liar if that ain't so!!
     
  13. Spirit and Truth

    Spirit and Truth
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    The "warm and fuzzy" candy may be sweet in the mouth for a season, but it will be bitter in the stomach for eternity.Keep you soul in shape, and lay off the "sweets", and do not offer them to the unsaved, because they could cause them to have diablo-betis. The saved should know better.

    Rev 13:3 And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
     
  14. computerjunkie

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    For those believers who continually say this movie is a great tool for evangelism, it may very well be for those who can make themselves available to EVERY non-believer who sees the movie. However, let's assume there is not a ratio of one believer to every non-believer who sees this movie. A non-believer sees it, does not know a believer with whom to discuss the movie, and has no frame of reference to recognize contradictions, compromises, violations, or betrayals of scripture.

    2 Cor. 4:1-4:
    "Therefore, since through God's mercy we have this ministry, we do not lose heart.

    Rather, we have renounced secret and shameful ways; we do not use deception, nor do we distort the word of God. On the contrary, by setting forth the truth plainly we commend ourselves to every man's conscience in the sight of God.

    And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing.

    The god of this age has blinded the minds of unbelievers, so that they cannot see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God."


    As S&T stated, discernment seems to be at an all-time low.

    CJ
     
  15. Spirit and Truth

    Spirit and Truth
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    Diane:

    Murph, thanks for this! I agree with Lady Eagle. Many of us have taken a beating and appreciate your sharing your thoughts.

    S&T:

    The only beating or bashing that anyone has taken on these threads is from the MOUNTAIN of scripture that has been posted clearly showing that this movie is an attempt to mix chicken cordon bleu[the Gospel] with chicken dung aka divination, in it's poorly disquised attempt to exalt others equal to Jesus.I understand that it is a little "safer" over on the sanitized warm and fuzzy side of "town." I prefer to reside in the rougher cyber hood known as "Truth Town".........until I am "evicted".

    After all...the banner on the forum proclaims "the Truth shall set you free".......that is the one that is flying directly under the Passion banner..........
     
  16. blackbird

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    Nobody has stood to call me a liar yet! All of that Emmerech "extra" as well as that Bridgett junk---flies in the face of the Lord Jesus Christ!! You bunch of IFB'ers and SBCer's ought to know better!

    Brother David
     
  17. C.S. Murphy

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    Whew!!!! I have stated my view of the film and just a few hours later I am already feeling the bashing. This is fine I can take it but some cannot. Some of the discussion on my post concerns the divination, yes I agree that divination is against God's word but as non believer seeing this film I will not know about the divination all I will see is Jesus Christ Crucified and risen again. I am not saying that we are to use any means to preach this ultimate truth but I can say that I have heard more foolish things than this in several pulpits. As I said this was made on Mel's nickel and if I had made it I would not have included some of these things but I didn't make it. The teardrop is not quoted in scripture but I felt it very powerful and I believe all of us have heard this preached and in song lyrics and I may have even illustrated a sermon with this myself. I am not happy with the catholic flavor but I really saw nothing outreagous about Mary's role in the film. Honestly folks I feel that some of the accusations made against this film by posters here and by other sources are no less a lie than some of the stretches in the movie. I sat down with my pen and waited for all the heresy and I was dissapointed for I found little. I feel that God can use even this film for His glory, hey He uses the foolishness of preaching. I am not happy with the cult following this film has received from SBC and other Christians and I do not promote it as an evangelical tool but I feel it has been effective as such on many occasions. Once in the gospels the disciples came to Him and said that others were speaking in His name and asked Him to destroy them but Jesus said whoever is not against me is for me. I can't find the verse but I think this was the central meaning of it. If you don't want to see it fine I just don't think that it is the mark of the beast that many here led me to believe.
    Murph
     
  18. C.S. Murphy

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    Now David you don't really want anyone to call you a liar do you? I am snot advocating that we stick our head in the sand but as much as I dissagree with the catholics I didn't find the movie compelling anyone to convert. Above all else it shows the crucifiction and resserection of the Lord, I am thankful for that. It is far from perfect but for now it is the best film going and more people are talking about the suffering of Christ for our sins today than there were last Good Friday and it is because God has saw fit to stir people with this film. All things work together for good for those who love the Lord.
    Murph
     
  19. Debby in Philly

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    Yes, and many church folk are not aquainted with art, because in a legalist tradition they were taught that all art was sinful. This is a film. It is art. And through art we often can get a glimpse of things we cannot put into words. And to do that, artists sometimes do not use imagery that is meant to be taken literaly, or for face value.
    Of course a giant teardrop did not fall from the sky. But don't you think the Father's heart grieved for what had to be? Even in using the words "the Father's heart" I am taking artistic license, since God cannot be quantified in human terms. Just another way for our small minds to try and grasp the infinite.
     
  20. LarryN

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    Murph wrote:
    I think you might be thinking of Luke 9:49-50; also see Mark 9:38-40.
     

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