New World Order: Still A Conspiracy Theory?

AMEN! Now you have it! :thumbs: One world government will be cheered by more than less! It comes in on harmony and peace for ALL! Pay attention poncho and you could be saying "I see the Day approaching, I have been discerning the signs of the times".

:jesus:

 

Good to see someone else who believes in conspiracies. I firmly believe that we have never been told the truth about 9/11. I too believe that Bush was not the force behind it but merely the front man. I don't think that you have to look towards international cartels however. The people behind 9/11 were not our government but individuals inside our government.

Bin Laden was just a dupe. He had neither the smarts nor the connections to pull it off. The FBI doesn't even have enough on him to charge him with a 9/11 related crime. So, we went to war in Afghanistan and in Iraq for other reasons namely because the Neo-Cons wanted to maintain America's world military supremacy. I didn't say to provide for our defense because those wars had nothing to do with that. I said world supremacy. Do you understand that?

I judge Presidents based on what they do not on my politics or some vague conspiracy theory that you seem to think has been around forever. When did you conspiracy start? I saw Bush as a hopeless loser but I haven't seen that in Obama. Maybe you do. I also don't put him as a part of your ill-defined conspiracy simply because he's a Democrat and Democrats have always been involved. You'll have to show me something more concrete than that.

I'm aware that a large amount of money was missing from the pentagon during Bush's administration. Unfortunately, the Dept. of Justice doesn't chose to acknowledge it.

So, come back with some facts. I have plenty on 9/11.

 

You don't even like it when someone agrees with you. Post the reference where I was preaching to "give into evil", unless your proved to be making up stuff.

Please post my post where I preached this, unless this is just another straw man.

How about a quote of mine to support your rhetoric?

While you are at this task, could you define what is evil about joining a one world government? Do you think the states joining the One country of the United States was evil?

:thumbs:

 

Something seems a little out of order here. Where! is our country, our future, and our freedom??.

 

Have you ever heard of the project for the New American century? They tried to get president Clinton to invade Iraq and failed. Then said in a public document that it might take something like a "New pearl harbor" to get the American people behing their planned invasion. Sound like 9/11? It does to me.

 

Focus ring? Je ne se pas.

 

Reply by Steaver

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I don't know about "devil's kool aid" but agree with Poncho's assessment and his summary of Scripture is accurate. Your definition or interpretation of that Scripture is abbreviated and/or somewhat wrong.

There is no confusion when it states "...none should perish". That is not a "reference" as you stated but instead an emphatic statement that God desires no person to perish but that all should find salvation.

You are similar to the Christians Simon Peter was correcting or instructing in his Second Epistle as found in 2 Peter 1. If you read that letter you will see Peter was instructing Christians as you upon this exact subject but with a very different outlook than you.

It speaks of Gods "longsuffering to us-ward..". Again, His desire is that none should perish but all should gain salvation. The Lord is not suffering for no reason but as this allows time for many to come to salvation. You are seemingly attempting to rush God with the Second Coming. You have stated people should be doing certain things or that we should support what amounts to evil policies in hurrying up or in bringing on the second coming. This is completely wrong minded and not what the Second Epistle of Peter was addressing.

Yes there will come a time for reckoning. Christians know this and are to be 12”Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God…”. Simon Peter’s instruction should apply to you in this regards whereas you are going beyond simply being “mindful” of these things as clearly stated in 2 Peter 1:2. You are focusing in on and attempting to make them occur faster by stating we should embrace things which according to you will help hasten end times. This is contrary to Scripture and specifically as Simon Peter was instructing. It is also bordering false prophecy which we should be weary of.

The focus of this Scripture is not singularly that God will bring about end times but that He loves us and wishes none to perish. This is His greatest desire and why Jesus died on the cross for us. Remember, we were given the Great Commission in spreading the Good News and bringing people to salvation. The Great Commission was not in worrying and debating when the Lord would return!


Do note the importance of 2 Peter 1:18 as the Second Epistle is summed up and ends.

The thrust of the Second Epistle is not on end times but on how we should live as good and moral Christians. Only our Lord knows when He will return and it is silly to think we have power in helping to determine His return. That is His alone and is already decided!

In Christ

 

It (being the satement by poncho that none should perish) is a "reference" as I accurately stated. It is a reference to "eternal life". Just as you reitterated by saying "salvation" rather than "eternal life".

2 Peter 1:9 "...but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance..." is referring to "salvation/eternal life".

I don't get your beef in this complaint.

Plaese give a quote of mine that I may properly respond.

Again, I will have to see the quote you are referring to, thanks.

Amen! :thumbs:

 

Thank you for your honesty. There was no post of mine declaring your conclusions. Now let's stick with what is actually being said :thumbs:

This is your speculation, my speculation is it will come in with majority support. So the rest of your post is really moot.

:jesus:

 

If you cannot see it Steaver it is simply because you are blind to your own statements. Poncho referenced the correct Scripture and then accurately summed up your perspective, “God's will is that none should parish. What you're saying in effect is hurry up and parish already so I can get to heaven a little faster…” .

His statement is spot on! You replied by seemingly attempting to challenge the meaning of that Scripture by stating “… “none should perish” is a reference to eternal life and God's long suffering…” .
That was my interpretation. Otherwise, why are you clarifying Poncho’s own words for Poncho? What sense does it make for you to “reference” for Poncho what Poncho had just “referenced”? Again your interpretation, irrespective of Poncho, is not exactly correct. You are the only one who stated “…is a reference to eternal life and God’s long suffering…” .

I felt compelled as a Christian to correct you scripturally for the following reasons.
1) It is not a “reference”. It is an emphatic statement that God wishes no person to perish but that all should gain salvation. This goes directly to what Poncho was pointing out to you and as the Second Epistle of Peter specifically addresses.

2) Your interpretation is sorely abbreviated. God’s “longsuffering” is not for some unknown reason or just-because, as your sentence could leave some to conclude. His longsuffering is because He showed Grace in allowing time for people to come to salvation. The Second Epistle of Peter speaks directly upon that in explaining to the early Christians why the Lord has seemingly to us, delayed His coming. It is the exact context in which Poncho was explaining and stands in stark contrast to your statements and views.

Had you said “God’s long suffering” was “to-usward…” there would have been little argument on that specific point. However, you did no such thing. To do such in fact tends to contradict your stance. God’s longsuffering is not because of us or because the time has yet to come; His longsuffering is for us! There is a difference. You seem to want Him to hurry on up with things as your statements clearly indicate.

Where would you like for me to begin Steaver? I will start in this thread and follow up from “God is the one who placed Obama as President…” as started by you.

Do note your apparent glee and seeming attempt to usher in this as the One World Order. The Bible says the Lord will return as a “Thief in the night” and “..nobody knows” not even the “Son” when that will occur (Matthew 24). Do you know something Jesus doesn’t?

Again you are approaching false prophecy. Again you are supporting and attempting to usher in what you believe the One World Order or end times. How do you know this is God bringing about the end times or that it has anything to do with prophesy? The Lord has said He will return as a "Thief in the Night" and nobody but God knows when that will be.

We are called to be good Christians and Citizens. Allowing bad leaders to impose bad policies against our people and Constitution is simply allowing evil to prevail. America has traditionally been a Christian nation and has helped nations and millions of people around the world. To wish our sovereign nature to fail is to weaken America and Americans which in turn weakens our ability to help others or in spreading the Good News abroad.

That is a mouthful Steaver.
First, man is not perfect and even God knows that!
Second, not everyone wants to go to Heaven and some are happy to die for their false gods.
Third, not everyone is as concerned with death or how they die as you seem or portray. I have heard many a good Christian or known some who welcomed their time. Some of the same being content and happy in the service they were called upon for God.
Fourth, many Americans do care about people in Third World nations and elsewhere. Mission work and support thereof is a clear example of that.
Lastly, our government has at times helped support Missions through Treaties in insuring Mission Works could occur in other nations. China is one historical example. In addition, name any country which has given more of resources, time and money for those in need than America?

This is deep end Steaver. What ever God has deemed to occur will occur! Who thinks or has ever said you can stop what God has deemed? Who are you to believe it can even be “delayed” as you alone stated? You really seem to believe that from all your statements. Again, here you are clearly and seemingly attempting to usher in the coming of the Lord as if you have that authority. As if anything we do can force God to hurry up and come. The Lord will come at the Fathers annointed time.

Well there is nothing to worry about then is there?! The NWO will occur as God has deemed and at the precise time God has deemed.

Until that occurs I will continue to fight for my rights and good American policies. I will continue to oppose bad Presidents who attempt to undermine the sovereignty of America, the Constitution, the People and whom support un-Godly issues as abortion and homosexuality, etc. I do take exception to your statement “…So if you want Jesus to come back…” which is a misguided notion. It is a clear example of your attempting to force people to believe as you and in attempting to support bad policies for misguided reasons. Your reasoning is such that we should not oppose any evil people in the World because one my actually be the Anti-Christ and to do such would some how interfere with prophecy.



Now from “God is the one who placed Obama as President…”;

There is no reason for you to respond to your own statements as they are clear and as they were summed up correctly by others.


My beef is with Christians whom think they can determine when the Lord shall return or think they have any such knowledge and with citizens who bash America/Americans. We are called by God to be good Christians and Citizens. We are not called to be people who desire to usher in chaos because they think somehow that will speed God up!

Take care, In Christ.:jesus:

 

It seems it does not matter how many times I posted very clearly that the Day cannot be hastened, shortened or stopped. You still choose to ignore my very words for your own opinions of what I believe. I say very clearly what I believe and you guys like to use the old straw man tactic where you decide to make up your own words of what another believes and then proceed to punch at it. You take one's words and say "this is what you are saying", NO, I said what I said and have clarified many times with clear words that you are bearing a false witness. Yet you carry on as though no one sees what you are doing.

Now I don't know anything Jesus' does not. I have said over and over and over again and again, but you will not hear. NNE KNOWS THE DAY NOR HOUR. Now could you stop acting as if I believe otherwise. Your wasting your time.

1) I have refuted your accusation that I am "attempting to usher in a one world government" because that is God's timetable, not mine. I only can discern the signs of the times and preach it is coming. As should all Christians.
2) You said, "The Bible says the Lord will return as a “Thief in the night” and “..nobody knows” not even the “Son” when that will occur (Matthew 24)."
We all know this and I haven't said anything different, so this is another moot point that keeps coming up and has been refuted several times. Give it a rest.
3) You said, "Do note your apparent glee ". Yes, I am excited to see the Day appraoching. Why aren't you?

2Ti 4:8Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.

First paragraph is pretty much the same as you said above and has been refuted. Second paragraph is full of opinion and no one has wished for America to fail. You see how you keep putting up statements that nobody made? Let's stick to what is actually being said, ok?

Oh boy, raying:. Yes Ralph, not all act the way I posted. It is a post meant to stir up hearts and minds to get of their lazy couch and to reflect on this world verses heaven.

So you repeat what I said and then say I said something different. Oh brother, when will you actually give a quote of mine where I said anything remotely close to what you falsely say I am "seemingly" saying? Please raying:

There you go again, saying I am saying something I did not say. I will say AMEN to what you said up to and including "etc".

Well there you have it. This was quite a long post you gave brother and you proved my point. You nor poncho can give one quote where I said what you falsely accuse me of saying. Not one.

Hbr 10:25Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some [is]; but exhorting [one another]: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching.


Do you see the Day approaching brother? PLEASE don't post that nobody knows the day again, we all understand that. Do you SEE the Day Approaching like Hebrews says we can?

:jesus:

 

And with that, you have made my point for me. The board can judge if you did the twisting of anothers words or if I did. Funny how niether you nor Ralph has accused me of twisting you guy's words. Because I don't debate that way. I debate what is actually said. And if I have a question about what you said, I will ask for clarification rather than falsely accuse you of saying something other than what you really did. But you two won't even acept clarification, you two just hate debating facts so you must go about building straw men for your pleasure. It just make you guys look desperate. Please repent and be honest when debating. We are Christians afterall.

:jesus:

 

God's will for none to perish is in reference to the second death i.e. going to Hell. It has nothing to do with attacking the army of the Antichrist. The Bible also says that we do not fight against flesh and blood, which you are so0 focused on, but against spiritual enemies.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places].