No Greater Joy Ministry

I laughed at that whole comparison - comparing children to horses. I train horses. Trust me - if I trained my horses the way Michael Pearl says to train children, I'd have some very dangerous animals in my care. I ride one horse who's withers (the part at the bottom of the neck where it attaches to the spine) is 5'8" and he's about 1500 lbs. I'm 5'3" and 145 lbs. Fortunately he's been trained with love, care and gentle guidance and because of that, he trusts me. Otherwise, he'd be dog food - believe me, he'd be dog food. He's just too big to deal with if he were a danger.

It hasn't - but it's certainly not the thing that is going to prevent my husband from all sin. He's got his own sin nature to deal with and even if I made love to him every night, he still has the ability to stray, to lose his commitment to me and to leave our marriage. Sex does not equal commitment OR sanctification.

Honestly, I don't know what you're asking here.

The Scripture references are not garbage but certainly the taking the Scripture out of context and her interpretation is. Do you think a woman's sole reason for existing is to be a helper to a man? That we should study "meet" to find out what we're supposed to be about for our men? That on page 188, where she says of the word "sophron" from Titus 2:4-5 (translated as discreet) as also being translated as "taste" in the KJV several times and that discretion then means "having good taste...good judgment...useful...to be of good understanding" when the word is never translated as "taste" and it is actually only translated as "sober", "temperate" and "discreet"? She's leading women astray with clear error in her Scripture interpretation. That's dangerous.

 

Since Michael Pearl says that he is the only one who knows the truth on original sin, and that he himself is sinless, he is a heretic IMO. Not worthy of listening to at all. Here are a few of his statements from his sermon on Romans:
"99.9% of churches don't teach this"
"out of 25-30 commentaries on this they were all incorrect - their basic approach was in error"
"probably anything you've been taught on Romans 7 is wrong"
"I don't know any preachers other than myself that teach this correctly"
"here's how R.C. Sproul manifests his unbelief" (before reading from Sproul's commentary)
"these guys (25-30 commentary authors) don't believe like we do"

As far as I'm concerned, they have nothing worthy to listen to.

 

Oh - I do when he does something wrong. But I will not put a carrot in front of him then expect him to give me his full attention - beating him to make sure he listens to ME. Michael Pearl tells us to get our child interested in something then call them - and if they don't come the second you call, you're to spank them. You are to put something in front of them that they want to touch, you tell them "No" then you spank them when they naturally go to touch what you're tempting them with. That's not the way to train a horse, that's not how God deals with us, and it's not the way we're to raise children. I will spank my children - I will smack my horse. I will not tempt them then punish them for falling for it. God doesn't do that either.

I never said He was. This is different than training.

So my sleeping with my husband will sanctify him and totally protect him from temptation? During the times that we could not have relations (10 weeks of hemorraging, 2 miscarriages, 4 c-sections and one very over stimulated ovary producing 20 eggs), he would have the right to stray? It would be my fault that he'd stray? I agree that my body does not belong to me but it belongs to him but in the same way, his body belongs to me. Besides that, who is responsible to God for lust and/or action on that lust? The wife? The husband? It is the person who has that lust. Period. Manipulating your husband with sex or without sex is manipulation - and wrong.

Page 188: "We learned the practical side of marriage when we studied the word sober, the sexual side when we studied to love our husband, and that our job is to be instant in season and out of season when we learned how to love our children. The next word on God's list is discreet. One usually thinks of discretion as the ability to avoid saying or doing that which is inappropriate - to know when and how to conduct oneself so as not to offend. If this is all that is intended by the text, then a person intending to commit fraud would always attempt to do so discreetly, but much more is obviously contained in this word. The Greek word that is translated as discreet is also translated, in the Authorized Version, "taste" several times. In other instances it is translated "behavior" and "judgment". Discretion, therefore is, having good tastes...good judgment...useful...to be of good understanding. God says that a woman who lacks discretion is like a jewel in a pig's nose. She is ridiculous, out of place, embarrasing, a joke. Something otherwise lovely is rendered ridiculous in the context of indiscretion. She might be pretty, a real jewel of a beauty, but if the jewel is in the nose of a pig, what good is it? "As a jewel of gold in a swine's snout, so is a fair woman which is without discretion" (Proverbs 11:22)."

Is this the Biblical definition? Can you show me where in Scripture? Because the word is never translated as "taste" in the KJV even though she says it is as well as being translated as "behavior" and "judgment". These are lies pure and simple. In print. The word is translated as "sober", "temperate" and "discreet".

OK - What about those who ARE OTR truckdrivers or plumbers? Or horse trainers who get dirty and hairy (especially in shedding season - phew!!) and at times battle with a very large 1500 lb. animal? I'm a lady - I'm feisty. I can be at a formal ball and look beautiful and graceful. I can be at the barn scooping poop. I can be on the boat and scramble handling the lines. I can drive a truck. I'm just what my hubby finds attractive so.....

 

This is from his website:

The Biblical way of deliverance from sin and self is so little known that the Scripture itself seems almost fanciful to many. There is not space here to relate this gospel effectively. There are so many things you first need to unlearn. Our CD set called “Sin No More” or our Colossians or Romans studies cover the Scriptures verse by verse in a thorough and understandable way. These messages are not motivational teachings or principles for you to apply. They are the wonderful good news that Christ has done everything to free you from all sin, all the time, from this day forward, to sin no more.


So, here is what most Christians have missed. When a person believes on Jesus Christ, God immerses him into the very body and life of Jesus Christ (1 Cor. 12:12-14). He becomes a member of Christ’s body (Eph. 5:30). As the whole human race was in Adam and his acts became the acts of all, so God places into the body of Christ all who are his, so that Christ’s actions become the actions of all who are in him (1 Cor. 15:22; Rom. 6:8). Just as when Adam sinned, I sinned (Rom. 5:12), so when Christ didn’t sin, I didn’t sin (2 Cor. 5:21). When Adam died, I died, so when Christ died for my sin, I died with him for my sin (2 Cor. 5:14). Just as I failed to overcome in Adam, I did indeed overcome in Christ (Rom. 6:6). Just as being in Adam took me away from God, being in Christ takes me into complete favor and glory (Col. 2:10). At one time my history began with Adam. Now my history begins with Christ (2 Cor. 5:17). As went Adam in his flesh and spirit, so went I. As went Christ overcoming in the flesh by the Spirit, so go I (Col. 2:9; Eph. 1:15-23).

Here is the crux of sanctification. When Christ died, he not only died for sin, he also died to it (Rom. 6:10). That is, his death as a human being put him out of reach of sin and conquered the power of death (Heb. 2:14). He served his time and is now done with it (John 19:30). Christ is now on the other side of the flesh (Luke 24:39). His flesh is free from the power of sin (Rom. 6:10). His flesh is seated on the right hand of God (Acts 5:31). His flesh is eternally holy human flesh (John 20:27). He reigns victorious, the overcoming man (Eph. 1:20-21; Heb. 6:20).

Satan is defeated (Heb. 2:14-15).

Remember, Christ’s history is now my history. Being in him, I have not only died for my sin, I have died to its power (Romans 6:14). As sin was defeated in Christ, and because I am now in him, sin was likewise defeated in me. I am as dead to sin as is Jesus (Rom. 6:7; Romans 6:2; 1 Pet. 2:24).

When Christ was raised from the dead, all who are in him were raised from the dead with him (Rom. 6:5-6; Col. 2:12-13, 3:1-3; Eph. 2:6).

When Christ ascended up to the right hand of God, I ascended. As he is seated, so am I—in him (Eph. 2:6). His history is my history. His future is my future. His glory is my glory.

Finally, as Christ is now the reigning Adam, the fully overcoming man restored to the glory intended for the human race, a man with authority, so I am the fully reigning man, bathed in eternal glory, filled with all the fullness of God, an overcomer in every way that he is an overcomer (Eph. 1).

In Christ there is no emotional disorder, no addiction, no weakness, no insanity and no enslavement to sin. Satan is ineffectual against this one new man that is Christ (2 Tim. 1:7; 1 Cor. 15:57; 2 Cor. 5:17).

The believer’s responsibility is to believe that what God says is true—that he is dead to all sin and alive unto God, that is, he is now freed from the power of sin. We should and can sin no more! (Rom. 6:11 especially, but all of Romans 6; Gal. 2:20. 5:24; 1 John 2:1; Col. 3:1-4; Rom. 8:3-4; Col. 2:11-15)


I have been preaching and living this gospel of sanctification for many years. It is not a theory. It is practical, Scriptural reality. I preach it in the prisons, and it works on men who have lived lives of total addiction and enslavement. They come up to me all the time, bubbling over with joy, and tell me that they are now free from all sin. I have followed them when they get out, and I can put you in touch with sons of Adam who are now Sons of God walking in complete victory over sin and self.

This is the old fashioned gospel. It is still God’s way, and it still works. Read the Bible again. And this time, believe what you read.

If you want further instruction on this subject matter, order the Bible tapes on Romans, Colossians, Sin No More, and Galatians. The series, Sin No More, covers all the material in the verses listed above. Romans provides you with the background for justification and sanctification.


http://www.nogreaterjoy.org/article...y/12/living-parallel-lives-in-the-same-space/

 

In reading the books, I knew there was something "off" about him but once I read about his theology and studied it a bit - it was confirmed.

 

Don't we all do that with stuff? If a book is 80-90% (or more) garbage, and the basic premise that all of their theology is based on is flawed, how can we trust what they say? Aren't there other, better books out there?

As I said, I have these two books right here. I studied Created to be His Helpmeet extensively last summer on our boat vacation. Ask my husband - I spent 2 full weeks reading the book with a notebook, a Bible and a pencil and I found more damaging things in that book than there is even a molecule of truth. The ONLY thing that is good in that book can be found in other books. It's that a wife needs to be responsible for HER role as God has ordained it and she needs to be sure that she's acting in a Godly, loving way towards her husband. But that's it. Guess what? That's told to us in Titus 2. So we don't need 295 pages of trash to tell us what God has told us in 2 verses.

As for the To Train Up a Child, again - his premise is wrong. Children are not animals and even raising an animal in the fashion that he states would result in a very angry, frightened, dangerous animal. I do not tempt my children and for him to say that God tempted Adam and Eve is to speak against the Word when God says, "Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:" (James 1:3)

From To Train Up a Child, page 5: "When God wanted to "train" his first two children not to touch, He did not place the forbidden object out of their reach. Instead, He placed the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" in the "midst of the garden' (Genesis 3:3). Since it was readily accessible inthe middle of the garden, they would be exposed to its temptation more often. God's purpose was not to save the tree but rather to train the couple.
Note that the name of the tree was not just "knowledge of evil," but, "knowledge of good and evil." By exercising their wills not to eat, they would have learned the meaning of "good" as well as "evil." Eating the tree's fruit was not the only way in which they could come to the knowledge of good and evil, but it was a forbidden shortcut.
By placing a forbidden object within reach of the children, and then enforcing your command not to touch it, every time the children pass the "No-No" object (their "tree of the knowledge of good and evil"), they are gaining knowledge of good and evil from the standpoint of an overcomer.

It just takes a few minutes to train a child not to touch a given object. Most children can be brought into complete and joyous subjection in just three days. Thereafter, if you are consistent, the children will remain happy and obedient.

So by tempting your children, disciplining them when they fall for that obedience and thus "training" them, you will have children who are in "complete and joyous subjection in just three days".

That whole thing is so wrong on so many levels and I mourn for the children who are raised in such a humanistic and behavioral environment rather than a relationship with their parents. God did not place the tree in the garden to tempt Adam and Eve or to "train" them for anything. The Bible says that fathers are not to provoke their children to anger. Guess that doesn't count here.