Not Worth the Cost of Treatment

Discussion in 'Politics' started by carpro, Jul 29, 2009.

  1. carpro

    carpro
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    Ready to write off your parents...grandparents...yourself?

    Let the government help you.


    http://www.lifenews.com/bio2896.html

    Lawmakers Confirm House Health Care Bill Promotes Euthanasia Among Elderly

    by Steven Ertelt
    LifeNews.com Editor
    July 24, 2009

    Washington, DC (LifeNews.com) -- Two Republican leaders in the House of Representatives are confirming reports that the health care restructuring bill the House is currently considering promotes euthanasia. A leading patients rights advocate is worried about the effects of the legislation.

    Betsy McCaughey, the former New York lieutenant government who is now a patient's rights advocate, notes that the government-run health care plan would require "end of life" counseling for seniors.

    The counseling, she says, would be focused on telling seniors how to end their lives sooner.

    In a statement sent to LifeNews.com House Republican Leader John Boehner Republican Policy Committee Chairman Thaddeus McCotter confirm those fears.

    "Section 1233 of the House-drafted legislation encourages health care providers to provide their Medicare patients with counseling on ‘the use of artificially administered nutrition and hydration’ and other end of life treatments,'" the pair say.

    That section "may place seniors in situations where they feel pressured to sign end of life directives they would not otherwise sign."
     
  2. targus

    targus
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    But of course - food and water by IV is such a drastic and expensive medical procedure don't you know.:rolleyes:

    No doubt Crabby will be along any time to ask if we are afaid to die and why don't we trust in God.
     
  3. OldRegular

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    For certain!:laugh::laugh::laugh:
     
  4. carpro

    carpro
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    Then he will really like Obamacare. It helps God make His decision about when you should die.
     
  5. carpro

    carpro
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    Relevant sections:


    PG425 L22-25, 426 L1-3 Government provides approved list of end of life resources, guiding you in death.

    PG 427 Lines 15-24 Government mandates program for orders for end of life. The Government has a say in how your life ends.

    PG 429 Lines 1-9 An “advance care planning consultant” will be used frequently as patients health deteriorates.

    PG 429 Lines 13-25 The Government will specify which Doctors can write an end of life order. Logan’s Run anyone?

    PG 430 Lines 11-15 The Government will decide what level of treatment you will have at end of life.

    PG 432 Lines 18-21 The Government will publish “quality measures” for individual’s end of life in Federal Register.
     
  6. KenH

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    One can go here: http://thomas.loc.gov/ and search for bill HR 3200 and read section 1233 for himself/herself and see if these things are so.
     
  7. Revmitchell

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    Surely that is not KenH in the politics section.
     
  8. targus

    targus
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    Thanks, Ken. And yes - these things are so.

    From the bill - edited/truncated to be readable as it pertains to this topic:


    `(4) A consultation under this subsection may include the formulation of an order regarding life sustaining treatment or a similar order.

    `(5)(A) For purposes of this section, the term `order regarding life sustaining treatment' means, with respect to an individual, an actionable medical order relating to the treatment of that individual that--

    `(iv) the use of artificially administered nutrition and hydration.'.
     
  9. Robert Snow

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    It's no different than it is now. Just another slam at President Obama.
     
  10. targus

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    So there is currently a law that requires "end of life counseling" in order to recieve health care?

    Really?

    Are you sure?
     
  11. Robert Snow

    Robert Snow
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    No, we don't have any "orders" but currently, there is a limit to what the insurance company will and will not pay for. They will not bear any cost of any treatment. We faced this with the death of both of my parents. Eventually patients are sent to hospice or sent home to die. Makes me think this proposed "order" might be a good thing. Some of the doctors we dealt with could have used a little more training on end of life care.
     
  12. targus

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    So insurance companies will not pay for nutrition and hydration?

    You faced this with your parents? You denied them nutrition and hydration?

    Nutrition and hydration are expensive and extreme treatments in your eyes?
     
  13. alatide

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    This section of the bill is about providing information on options that are already in place. These include:

    An explanation of advance care planning and advance directives, including--
    (I) living wills;
    (II) Durable power of attorney;
    (III) Orders of life-sustaining treatment; and
    (IV) Health care proxies

    My mother who will be 94 in Nov. has all of these selected for herself. Recently, a doctor found evidence that she might have some form of cancer. We discussed this with the nursing home leadership and the doctor. The doctor said she wouldn't live through an operation if one were necessary and couldn't handle chemotherapy. The nursing home people and the doctor said that it would be difficult to get her to go through an MRI because of her Althimizers and anyway why find something they couldn't treat?

    This was an extremely difficult decision but my brother and I decided that it was best not to attempt to find or treat the cancer if indeed one existed at all. Anyone who has to make the call in this kind of situation (health care proxy) knows that it isn't easy but these decisions must be made. As Christians we know that although there's no getting around dying some day, it's only the doorway to a better existence with God.

    Personally, I don't see anywhere in this legislation that the right to make a life or death decision like this one is given to the government. It's up to the family. That's the way it should be.
     
  14. targus

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    What is in the legislation that is different than the current system is the requirement to meet with couselors that will advise you on your supposed end of life options.

    Since Obama is on a obsessive tear to reduce costs (supposedly) it is no stretch of the imagination to think that these government paid counselors will steer the elderly to treatments or non-treatments that will save Obama's vaulted plan some money.

    Obama has already said in so many words that the elderly should just accept their various medical conditions and forget about medical care.
     
  15. targus

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    And under what conditions would you think that it is appropriate for the family decide to withhold nutrition and hydration from the patient?
     
  16. billwald

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    "To live is Christ, to Die is gain" doesn't mean anything when the doctor tells you (in effect) to get ready to meet Jesus. For 30 years My Old Man continually stated "he was ready to meet Jesus." At the end, he fought like hell to keep from meeting Jesus with a year of pain and useless surgery. I hope I can put my money where my mouth is when my turn comes.
     
  17. carpro

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    Then one day, after you have been diagnosed with cancer, you hear a knock on the door.

    A stranger with a briefcase says "I'm from the government and I'm here to counsel you about ending your life".

    "Wait a minute", you say. "I'm not ready to end my life. My doctor says my cancer is treatable with an 80% success rate."

    "You're 72 years old, Sir" says the government counselor. "The treatment is very expensive and our statistics say it will only extend your life 8 years. It's just not worth the cost of the treatment."

    "Can I get a second opinion ?", you ask.

    "No one else's opinion matters," replies the young man, smiling broadly.

    "My doctor..." you begin.

    "Especially not him." the counselor says. "Now lets get this over with , Sir. You've wasted enough of my time."

    And so on...
     
  18. Robert Snow

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    Go back and read my posting slower; I never said anything about my parents and lack of nutrition. I mentioned that my parents were eventually sent home to die. No more treatment except pain relief, if possible until the end. That's the way it is now, and I believe it will be the same under this new system.

    You and yours are just looking for a wedge here, like they do on most issues. It doesn't matter if the talking point is hyperbole or even an outright lie, as long as it serves the purpose, kind of like the Swiftboat attack on Senator Kerry.
     
  19. OldRegular

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    It is sickening the lengths that some on this forum go to defend this baby killer and advocate of euthanasia.
     
  20. OldRegular

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    Sad but true.
     

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