Old People's Church

:tonofbricks: :laugh:

 

Bad Rbell! As I recall you aren't a whole lot younger than me so you are headed in the direction of old too! :laugh:

At 43, I only expect to have about 60 years left and according to my kids, I have just about crossed into old. That makes for a lot of years spent as an 'old white person'.

After considering it for a while, I don't think I would want to be part of a "old folks only" type church, no matter the color of the members. Young folks tend to keep ones attitude young. Being with them makes one feel grateful and blessed that God has already taken care of you through what they are going through now.

No, I just can't imagine going to church where all the folks look and think just like me. I think I would find it boring. Plus, how I fulfill the command of God for the older women to teach the younger, if there are no younger women around?

I do believe that there should be some accomodation made in the church for the differences in worship styles between young and old, but I believe that both the old and the young need to be making accomodation for each other. It shouldn't be a one sided kind thing. The Bible says we will be known by how we love one another. Is it really loving for one group in the church to have nothing to do with another group?

 

NO I MEAN WHERE ALL CAN COME TO WORSHIP THE LORD!

If we limit our churches to believers only then how are we going preach the Gospel to the lost? I want as many of the lost as I can get to come on in the doors of the Chruch. If we got the lost to come in then they will hear the Word of God, and a seed will be planted. If that lost soul only comes once that might be the only chance they ever get to hear the Word and be saved. Just maybe they will hear the Gospel and want to hear more, then we can water that seed, care for it and the Lord will allow it to take root in their lives.


Bill :godisgood:

 

I recently heard someone say that the youth are needed to set the Chruch on Fire for God, and the Seniors are needed to make sure the youth don't burn down the Chruch.

Bill

 

Thanks to the balkanization of the church, it's the only kind I would feel welcome in. Diversity has never meant unity.

 

God is doing amazing things in our congregation.

We are a "cradle to grave" church.

One thing that happens in our worship that I'm so happy about...our younger generation is learning the richness of the great hymns of the faith. Our older generation is learning how God is continuing to inspire the generations behind them to worship.

We allow our folks to express: "That's not my favorite," or even "I don't like that very much." But we don't have any, to my knowledge of, "That's not of God."

When I first arrived, one of the grumpiest men in our church was constantly complaining. Not about worship...but about everything. He especially disliked the youth. Nothing they did met with his satisfaction. One day, he publicly castigated several kids for something that they didn't do. It was the closest I've ever come in ministry to really losing my temper.

Long story short: Over time, God softened this man's heart. It helped that one of our youth led his only granddaughter to the Lord. Last year, he volunteered to come and help park cars for a benefit concert that one of our church's bands had for Children's Hospital. The night before, he came in, and said to our band (composed of 18-26 year olds):

What a great attitude! I nearly get tears just typing that. What a work of God that was. God used him mightily, and still does.

A few months ago, our youth praise band did the entertainment for our senior adults' monthly luncheon. They were very scaled down (acoustic). They wore slacks & ties. They took requests, and played favorite hymns.

All of this came from them. I just set it up. And our senior adults loved it. So did our kids.

It doesn't take war, folks. And God can do some amazing stuff. It does take lots of prayer, and lots of patience. Sometimes, I have to push our traditionalists a bit. Others, I have to pull back our innovators a bit.

But, with God's help, we're getting there. And we're not destroying each other in the process.

Maybe this will help ya'll understand me & my thoughts a bit.

Or, if you wanna throw rocks, you can aim better. :laugh:

 

What bothers me is that you, as a pastor, had no trouble introducing music into your congregation that people found offensive. Is this man the exception, or the rule? How many old folks did you force out with your music? How many are you forcing to stay in the parking lot?

 

I shan't throw rocks at you! I SHALL say PRAISE GOD that He is working in your church in such a wondrous way!!

 

You obviously didn't read my post at all.

Did you not see that the man mentioned complained about everything??? Music wasn't even the issue with him! And at the end, he expressed an opinion of taste.

Could you not comprehend that this congregation--old and young--is serving one another in love, instead of throwing rocks and making accusations as you are doing???

Did you not even READ how my students were learning to appreciate the great hymns of the faith, and many others were learning to appreciate the new stuff coming along???

Are we, as ministers, supposed to do stuff that people like, and that's it????

Since when did "not being offensive" become the standard??? You would, in virtually any other context, argue that sometimes we must be offensive!

My post was written to show that we can teach all generations about worship. (And I'm not equating worship with music here). Unfortunately, it appears that your agenda makes you the kind of person that looks for conflict where none exists.

This is one of the more offensive posts I've seen in my time here. I don't appreciate people castigating the ministry God has allowed me to have here. If you'd like, you may PM me and I'll gladly give you fifty names and numbers of these poor senior adults I'm brutalizing with satanic trash, and they can set you straight. Give me a day or two to get their consent. I'll even give you the name of the "grumpy old man." Get ready though, he'll probably set you straight.

How dare you to insinuate I'm forcing folks out of my church. You owe me an apology.

 

an old white people church is racists and their members are so steeped in traditonalisim they unwilling to make needed changes within the church in order for the church to grow otherwise there would be more than just old white people in attendance.

the Church is supposed to be for all colors and all ages and I don't want to belong to a church where my ethnic brothers and sisters and my children are not welcome.

 

I can't go along with this as a blanket statement.

There are quite a few churches here in Alabama who would welcome black attendees, but whose worship style is unlike most black church styles here.

Many of these churches, comprised of exclusively 60+ aged people, are simply doing church as they know how. They love God, mean well, and don't want to die out as a church, but their age, church resources, and community dynamics make it difficult.

Are there "old, white, racist" churches; or "old, white, tradition-trapped" churches? Sure...but there are many who simply don't know the next step to take. I think your brush is too broad here.

 

I'm sorry if you didn't intend to be funny, but I laughed out loud when I read this OP! I guess it was just the next logical question after the one about starting hiphop church, huh? :laugh:

To answer seriously, I'm in the South and this describes a LOT of the churches I've been to over the years. One church in my dad's hometown that he has visited actively DISCOURAGES the attendance of youth and families with small kids. And they're all white.

In fact, I can recall only a few faces in ANY congregation I've been in that weren't white...no more than about 5 or 6 black families, maybe a couple of asian families, maybe one or two latino-background. This is not intentional on my part...I actually don't CHOOSE this "segregation"...that's just the way it is where I live. So the churches I have AVAILABLE to attend tend to appeal to old white people, because that's basically all that goes there anyway.

My current church has a strong youth program. They're growing and have an active missions ministry. This year, of the couple of dozen graduating seniors, over half of them were headed to a college for training in Christian leadership of some sort. I am invigorated by their youth and exuberance and I enjoy watching them grow up...and grow in Christ. It's a vantage point you don't get if you're in that "old-folks-only" home.

But, if God wants me to go to a church like that, then go I will. And I love the olds folks...which is a very good thing since I'm quickly joining their ranks!
:wavey:

 

I did not intend for it it to be a blanket statement.

the only churches I was talking about are the churches that fit the discription that I gave.

 

I don't think that "Old White" Churches are quite as bad as their painted to be. I have served as a youth minister, senior adult minister, and now as a pastor of a young military church. My job has been primarily the same through out all three positions. I taught the word of God, and all three responded about the same. I say this because I think when we begin a discussion on church types the problem is that people are selfish. The question for visitors today is not where can I serve in this church, but what does this church have to offer me. The church needs to guard against marketing itself, because it does not exist to serve the membership, but instead the membership of the church exists to serve those outside of its walls.

 

I have to agree whole-heartedly with this, although I certainly understand archeryaddict's point, and obviously agree with him not wanting to promote racism.

To make the point that it is seldom (that I have seen) about racism all by itself--about 25 years ago, I remember my Mom telling me about a church on a corner we passed...how years before that it had been a "white" church (when segregation DID exist in a big way there), but, at the time we drove by, it was "now a black church". I said...okay, how did THAT work? Her understanding of the situation was that the "white church" people had raised the money to build a new church building and were preparing to move most of the congregation to the new building. The "black church" people had outgrown their church. The pastors reached an agreement and one Sunday the whites were there...and the next Sunday the blacks were. The community at large "understood" that the switch had been made. No one was saying "don't come here, coz you're black", or "don't come here any more, coz you're white".....they simply had intact congregations with their own distinct styles of worship and their own history together as a church body....and they just "did things differently". No animosity....just not much overlap between the two communities of believers.

As the overlap between races in society in general has grown here...so it has in the churches here....but generally FIRST in the communities where the overlap is in place in the general populace first. The cultures themselves are different...so, too, are the preferred church services...hence BASICALLY segregated churches...but NOT for segregation's sake. Did that make sense? :saint:

 

Sure did.

In our area (a more mid-to upper mid-class suburbia), I see fewer differences between different races of families. Our culture is more unified. Thus, we have a more diverse congregation than other Baptist churches in other areas might have. We have black families (not a ton, but several--4 or 5), asian families (4-5), hispanic families (3-4), a Ukranian couple, this week a Pakistani family's kid visited...

Call us "Heinz 57 Baptist Church: Mutts for Jesus!"

 

Sounds to me that you are racist against "old white folk", you make two posts and both speak in a derogatory manner against old white people. If you going to love them all, that would include old white people, seems to me.

 

This type of thinking is dangerous. Unsaved man is an enemy of God. He is depraved. He CANNOT worship the Lord. In fact, about all he can do is hate God and rebel against his laws. (Gen 6:5, Rom 3:10-13) If churches use the services as evangelistic tools believers will suffer.The primary purpose of the local congregations is for equipping of saints and edifying the body of Christ (Eph 4:10 - onward). It actually says, the equipping of the saints for MINISTRY. We should be getting equipped in the church so WE can go out and evangelize, not leave it to the preacher.


www.wayofthemaster.com

 

Are you actually saying we should close the doors to the lost? If we do that, then in my family I could go to church, my wife could go, my son could go, but I would have to find a babysitter for my 7 yr old daughter.

Have you never rejoiced when someone walked down the aisle, knelt at the alter, and then accepted Christ as their Lord and Savior? Have you never invited a lost friend to Church? When a lost person enters the church doors do you tell them they are not welcome? Does your church not hold VBS or similar youth activities and invite the lost to attend?

The Church should not be the primary mode of evangelism, but a message that feeds me may also evangelize to the lost. God will show me a different meaning than he will show to someone else.

A lost person who comes to church is more than likely in a state where they WANT to know something of God, and it is our responsibility to show them something. The lost person who hates God will not come to Church.

Please do not close the doors of the Church to those who need it the most.


Bill :godisgood:

 

Actually, Christian Youth, the passage says that the leaders who were given to the church were there for the purpose of equipping the saints.

I Corinthians 14:23-25 says "Therefore if the whole church assembles together and all speak in tongues, and ungifted men or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are mad? 24 But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or an ungifted man enters, he is convicted by all, he is called to account by all; 25 the secrets of his heart are disclosed; and so he will fall on his face and worship God, declaring that God is certainly among you. "

So in the early church, there were unbelievers in the services who were there to investigate who Jesus is, just as they come to our services. And the services ought to be understandable to unbelievers. Obviously they are not going to be able to understand everything about the Gospel until they are saved.

I guess I was saved in a dangerous fashion, as the result of a church using the service as an evangelistic tool.