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Original Intent or Living Tree Doctrine?

Discussion in 'Political Debate & Discussion' started by Ps104_33, Mar 20, 2008.

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  1. Ps104_33

    Ps104_33 New Member

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    How do you view the Constitution?

    1. As an organic document that must be read in a broad and liberal manner so as to adapt it to the changing times?

    2. Or are you an originalist which says that the court should try determine what the authors were trying to achieve and give effect to what they intendedthe statute to accomplish.

    3. Or are you a "textualist". To quote Scalia;
    "You will never hear me refer to original intent, because as I say I am first of all a textualist, and secondly an originalist. If you are a textualist, you don't care about the intent, and I don't care if the framers of the Constitution had some secret meaning in mind when they adopted its words."


    For an example. What was the method of execution after the 8th amendment was written? Can we use that to determine what "cruel and unusual punishment" was? If it was hanging, do you think that that would tell you that it wasnt cruel and unusual?

    Who was allowed to own a gun after the 2nd amendment was written? Just the Army?

    Since 1789 we have had a chaplain of the US Congress. There have been 17 Prebyterians, 23 Methodists, 8 Baptists, 1 Lutheren and 1 Roman Catholic and a few others like Unitarian etc.
    What does this say about the original intent of the 1st amendment? Why is prayer allowed in the hallowed halls of our Congress but not public school?
    One could make a case for slavery, giving women the right to vote and the fact that we can amend the Constitution as proof that it is a living document. What are your thoughts?
     
    #1 Ps104_33, Mar 20, 2008
  2. dragonfly

    dragonfly New Member

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    Living Tree Doctrine.
     
    #2 dragonfly, Mar 20, 2008
  3. Revmitchell

    Revmitchell Well-Known Member
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    When you subjectively change the meaning of the words to fit what ever preconceived notion that pops into the liberal mind then the document and the wods have no meaning. If there is a necessity to change the Constitution then there is a process for that. The living tree ideology works to by pass the constitution itself. Those who support such foolishness are afraid to make change though the given constitutional means. They want to controll the courts so they can controll the constitution and apply whatever their latest subjective and fleeting thought overcomes them. Such a notion is anit-constitution, anti-American, and lacks any sense of real intelligence.
     
    #3 Revmitchell, Mar 21, 2008
  4. Magnetic Poles

    Magnetic Poles New Member

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    It must be viewed as a living document, as otherwise, we would still not have women voting, nor blacks counted as full persons. Mores do change and we must not be stuck with a fundamentalist view of our governing document.
     
    #4 Magnetic Poles, Mar 21, 2008
  5. Ps104_33

    Ps104_33 New Member

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    The Constitution can be amended. But how would you determine original intent of say, the 2nd amendment? The document can be amended to take away our gun rights but how would you determine what the intent of the 2nd amendment was? Individual gun ownership or just a militia?
     
    #5 Ps104_33, Mar 21, 2008
  6. billwald

    billwald New Member

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    Before and After the 2nd amendment was written any citizen could own the largest cannon it was possible to manufacture.

    The Constitution was written to give us a rule by the court system so the nature of the Constitution is determined by the court system and has been since the Constitution was ratified.

    Second, doesn't matter because we are governed by secret executive orders and secret signing statements which are paid for by the black ops budget. Only difference is that now we have a president who brags about ignoring the laws passed by congress.
     
    #6 billwald, Mar 21, 2008
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