Parable of the Talents

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by J. Jump, Jul 12, 2006.

  1. J. Jump

    J. Jump
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    Well we worked our way through the parable of the 10 virgins. Which after following the thread should be hard for someone to come away with the idea that five of those virgins were unsaved.

    So having looked at the first parable why don't we take a look at the parable of the talents to see what the Holy Spirit would have us see from the second parable.

    We are still in the context of the kingdom of the heavens, which is not an eternal salvation context. And right off the bat we see that there can be no distinction between the saved and the unsaved in this parable either, because here is what the first verse in the parable has to say.

    "For it is just like a man about to go on a journey, who called his own slaves and entrusted his possessions to them.

    I don't see how anyone can deny that all three of the slaves viewed in this passage of Scripture are saved. All three of them are "his OWN slaves." They belong to the man that is going away.

    So we find that two are faithful and received the commendation from their master well done good and faithful servant.

    But let's see what the third slave received. He received a hasrh rebuke with "You wicked, lazy slave"

    So not only do we see that the wicked slave received a harsh rebuke, and not only did he lose his opportunity to be put in charge over something, but he actually lost what he possessed. Then he was thrown out into outer darkness, where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.

    So again here is overwhelming evidence that there are indeed faithful and unfaithful Christians and that there will be a separation when we stand before our Judge.

    Folks it is time that we educate this lukewarm Christian world that there is going to be consequences for living a life of unfaithfulness and disobedience. We can not just live life any ole way we please and think we are putting something over on the Lord!

    I pray that we will heed the warning of our Lord and take His Words to heart, and may we be found faithful on that day.
     
  2. Marcia

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    Well, you've got to admit that most of the "We" on that thread did not think the 5 foolish virgins were saved. Anyone reading that thread will see that maybe just 2 people agree with this view (including you) and a whole pack of people disagreed with your view.
     
    #2 Marcia, Jul 12, 2006
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  3. StraightAndNarrow

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    I agree with you Marcia. The foolish virgins were unsaved.
     
  4. Hope of Glory

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    There were many more than that. It's just that some thought it represented people who lost their salvation, some thought it was representative of two types of Christians, and one who thought they just weren't quite saved enough. There were at least 5 people who voiced an opinion who saw that the virgins had oil, and 1 that could not comprehend the concept of "going out" as opposed to "never was lit".

    There were at least 5 who were interested in looking at what it actually meant for them to go out.

    Just as I'm sure that there are some who are going to say that when the master called his very own slaves, he was obviously lying about them being his.
     
  5. StraightAndNarrow

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    Then he was thrown out into outer darkness, where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth.

    What does this mean to you? Does it sound remotely like Heaven? Does it even sound like the millenial kingdom? This servant was sent to HELL. He's NOT a Christian. This is obvious from a casual reading of the scripture. How can you say that someone who is "cast into outer darkness" is saved? Unbelievable.
     
  6. Hope of Glory

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    Well, I guess he just didn't a firm hold on this servant, then, did he? Or did he just lie about him being his servant? Or, did the servant lose his salvation?
     
  7. Brother Bob

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    Right on Marcia;
     
  8. Hope of Glory

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    So, did he lie, or did the servant lose his salvation?
     
  9. canadyjd

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    :thumbs: :applause:
    peace to you:praise:
     
  10. Marcia

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    (To JJ, in the future, would you please put the scriptural reference for what you post from the Bible? It's just polite so that we don't have to rummage around looking for it. Thanks.)

    The passage does not give evidence that being a servant of the master means salvation. I think it means this is a parable for Israel. Israel is God's own possession - it's the land and people He created from scratch! I think this is about what he entrusted to Israel through the prophets and through his signs and the law.




    One cannot ignore the passage immediately after this, in which Jesus tells a parable about judgment of the sheep and goats, after which Jesus states:

    Nothing in the Bible is accidental, and these 3 parables being together like this seem linked. The last one seems to be a parallel to the two previous parables, so that the Lord not knowing the foolish virgins, and the servant being cast into outer darkness is the same fate as we find here: "eternal punishment" as opposed to "eternal life." In other words, hell.

    There is a progression to show judgment and that these are all linked:
    "I do not know you" said to the 5 foolish virgins
    Cast into the "outer darkness" for the servant
    "eternal punishment" in the last parable

    There is no way, imo, to coherently read the text and claim that the first two statements are to saved people while the last one is for unsaved. That would be illogical and confusing. Jesus was clearly showing them what the fate in the first 2 parables means by his clear statement in the last parable.
     
  11. DeafPosttrib

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    I do not have enough time to type post, I have go to work tonight - 3rd shift.

    I want to discuss on Matthew 25:1-13 and Matt. 25:14-30. This is a serious matter on salvation issue. Tomorrow, I will discuss more on this.

    In Christ
    Rev. 22:20 -Amen!
     
  12. canadyjd

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    Marcia

    I continue to appreciate your insightful analysis of scripture. Well done:thumbs:
    peace to you:praise:
     
  13. Hope of Glory

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    I can't think of a single parable that compares saved to unsaved.

    Matthew 25:14: For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.

    It starts off telling you that it's talking about the Kingdom of the Heavens and not simply talking about spiritual salvation.

    He called his own servants. If this is talking about Jesus, who is going away and travelling into a far country, keep in mind that Israel is God the Father's chosen people. Israel is the bride of Jehovah.

    But, this man, called his own servants and delivered unto them his goods.

    He didn't call some strangers in, he called his own.
     
  14. J. Jump

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    Well in the OP I said we talked about the parable of the virgins and so let's talk about the second parable, so I just thought everyone would know that we were still in Matthew 25 just moving down to the next passage, but I guess that's what I get for assuming.

    Marica you were absolutely right when you said the parables are linked together. A parable is one truth cast alongside a previous truth to help further clarify or explain the previous truth.

    I honestly can't see how folks can miss the clarity in the first parable, but I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt. That's why I wanted to move on to the next parable which is even more clear, and yet we still have folks that want to deny the PLAIN teaching of Scripture. That just absolutely amazes me how one can deny that all three of the servants were not saved.

    They were HIS servants. He owned them. How can you get unsaved out of he owned them. They were his. That is just blatant disregard for Scripture.

    And so not only do you want us to see that the master had a servant that really wasn't his servant. But now you want us to see that the master gave his good's to a person that wasn't his expecting him to make a profit on it.

    Where in Scripture does God give His goods to ANY unsaved person and expect them do make something of them? NOWHERE. It is IMPOSSIBLE. And unsaved person never gets anything from God until he is saved.

    Any person that is spiritually dead can not be expected to perform. They are dead. When is the last time you saw a dead man perform any task?

    There is no way in the world this third servant could be unsaved. Instead of reading the context of the parable people are going to the last couple of verses and saying oh God would never to that to one of His own that means that last guy can't be saved.

    GUESS WHAT . . . if you live an unfaithful, non-overcoming, disobedient life that is EXACTLY what you are going to hear and experience. You better take heed to the warnings. He who has an ear let him hear . . . is what is said to the churches. Church it is time to wake out of this slumber and start telling people the TRUTH!

    And this warning goes for me just as much as it does anyone else. If I live a disobedient, unfaithful, non-overcoming life I don't have to guess what is in my future, because it has already been laid out.

    It is time to get real with the Scriptures instead of playing this everyone that is saved is okay game.
     
    #14 J. Jump, Jul 12, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 12, 2006
  15. Marcia

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    I think the question to ask is "Is there anywhere in scripture where we see the term servant used and it does not indicate salvation?" The answer is "yes." There is no reason to assume that servant here means saved. Jesus was talking to mostly unsaved Jews - it makes sense that he's talking about Israel and its rejection of the Messiah. Israel was called God's servant.

    All over the OT! God gave his precious law to Israel; he revealed himself to the Jews. They had the gems of God's words given to them by handpicked prophets while the pagan nations served false gods and died in degradation. The Jews had the teaching of the Messiah to come, yet when he comes, they reject him. God entrusted them with much and they rejected it. John 1 tells us that Jesus was not received by his own -- Israel.

    This is a straw man. No one is saying that everyone who is saved is okay. There are plenty of scriptures in the NT that warn believers about the consequences of bad works, deception and sin. We don't need to turn these parables into something they aren't just because the saved aren't "okay." That is not what these parables are about as is pretty clear from the plain language Jesus uses: "I don't know you;" "cast into outer darkness," and "eternal punishment." How anyone could see these statements as anything but the equivalent of separation from God is beyond me.
     
  16. Marcia

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    Thanks jd! :wavey: :flower:
     
  17. tinytim

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    OK, I know I sound like a broken record, but I still see this as Israel vs the church.

    25:14 “For it is like a man going on a journey, who summoned his slaves16 and entrusted his property to them.

    Could this not be talking of God entrusting Israel with telling the world about Him.

    25:15 ... Then he went on his journey.
    God was silent 400 yrs before Christ came on the scene.

    25:16 The one who had received five talents went off right away and put his money to work19 and gained five more. 25:17 In the same way, the one who had two gained two more. 25:18 But the one who had received one talent went out and dug a hole in the ground and hid his master’s money in it.
    Isreal had various people that served God... He did have a remnant.

    25:19 After20 a long time, the master of those slaves came and settled his accounts with them.
    Jesus arrived on the planet.

    I'll have to study the rest to understand it more.


    One thing for sure... I am taking up an extra offering this Sunday... and investing it. :laugh: :laugh: :smilewinkgrin:


    (I just read Marcia's post above, and I agree with her)
     
  18. tinytim

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    J.jump, do you know that God knows you today? Do you have an intimate relationship with him? If so, how could he say he has NEVER known you?

    He would be lying if He know you today... You salvation is secure not from what you do... But from what He did... If you don't trust completely in Him for your salvation, you are not saved. If you depend on yourself to get to Heaven, you will go to Hell... Our righteousness is as filthy rags (written to the church)

    If you were perfect from this day forward, you would just be fulfilling what you were supposed to do anyway... where would you get the extra payment for your back sins? It has to come from the life of Jesus.
     
  19. tinytim

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    double post sorry...

    Has anyone else been doing this lately.. BB seems slow.
     
    #19 tinytim, Jul 12, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 12, 2006
  20. J. Jump

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    Are you kidding me. You are telling us to drop what the Bible actually says, becuase in your opinion it doesn't mean what it says. You give no other Scripture to support your opinion. Your opinion is certainly not supported by the Scripture at hand.

    How is it that you can ask someone to ignore what the Bible says, just because you can't see it the way it is laid out.

    It is plain and simple. It is if Jesus is saying I'm going away and I'm going to give you my stuff and be about my business until I come back.

    I mean seriously.

    What is your Scripture evidence that these were unsaved Jews? I believe He was actually addressing His disciples, which lends even more support to these three being saved.

    Why would He tell His disciples who are already saved a parable about the saved and the unsaved. That makes no sense. They don't need to know about the saved, they need to know what to do now.

    What is your Scripture evidence that the Jews were even unsaved in the first place. Where in the history of Israel does the faith in the sacrificial system become unsatisfactory to God?

    They were asked to believe in Jesus as the King, becuase their eternal destiny was already taken care of. But maybe I'll start another thread on that issue and you can take it up over there.

    Again you are assuming Israel is unsaved. Your whole argument hinges on that point. If Israel is saved you have no point. And Israel was saved, but we'll talk about that in a different thread.

    It's not a straw man at all. Are you kidding me. This is CRITICAL.

    Okay if everyone that is saved is not okay what does that mean? I believe you think everyone that is saved goes to heaven. And I think you believe that the entire church is the bride, which means everyone will rule and reign.

    So tell me what the not okay saved person has to look forward to? A smaller patch of paradise? Oh me I just don't think I can handle that.

    So what are the consequences that await the unfaithful Christian?
     

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