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Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by LadyEagle, Mar 26, 2004.
Thanks for the post
So what is the point? He saw a movie and felt bad about whacking someone? Who was the religious advisor I wonder.
Duh, a family friend, don't you have any friends who are religious advisors
(Specializing in free advice for small donations)
"Something (the adviser) said, between that and the movie, he felt in order for him to have redemption he would have to confess his sin and do his time," Kubricht said."
Now there is some scary theology. Was he taught a works salvation?
I read another report of this on another thread, it seems to me to be no more than a works salvation thing happening.
I hope it is true, but the idea from the other report stated he felt in order to gain redemption he had to do his time.
Sounds if not, awfully nearly close to a picture of purgatory to me.
Well, faith without works is dead.
That is right Sheeagle. You get 'em. Anything that can help validate sensationalism is what you need. Keep fighting the good fight.
Works salvation is not the message of the Bible and you know it. Works do not bring redemption or salvation. Salvation brings about good works. This is the message of James.
It is "...not by works, lest any man should boast...".
"I asked him, `What nagged at you, what stone did you leave unturned?'" Kubricht said. "He said, `The only thing I didn't do was rub her hands on the cord.' That's the thing that nagged at him the most, that he didn't leave her DNA on the cord."
Is it just me, or did this paragraph not make much sense in the context of the rest of the article? I wonder where Mark Babineck learned to write.
I had the opportunity a while back to baptize a older gentleman---everybody kept telling me, "Preacher! He ain't saved!! He ain't saved!!"
Well, I decided that the next time I saw him---I'd quiz him about his salvation!! I started praying for the Lord Jesus to open up that opportunity!!
By and by---I ran into him at the grocery store---and made up my mind to ask him right there in the store! I cornered him over at the vegetable/produce section and started talkin' to him---
"Brother Freeman! Can you tell me about your salvation?? Are you saved??"
"Yes sir, Preacher! I was saved over sixty years ago in the country of Belgium! We were part of a Army Division making our way through the hottest part of the Western Front---the "Jerries" were shelling us relentless and we were shelling them---fierce fighting!(these were REAL bullets and REAL shrapnel!)
He went on:
I had time in my foxhole to think about where I would spend eternity if I didn't make it! I had talked with a Chaplain earlier and he told me how to be saved! So in that foxhole---under intense hostile mortar fire---I gave my life to the Lord Jesus Christ! I repented of my sins and asked him to come into my heart!!----
Long story short---Mister Freeman made it through---and when he got back to the states---he never did follow through in Believer's Baptism---he knew he needed to---but never did! The further away from intense enemy fire he walked---well, the less he thought about following through with a Profession of Faith!
So I asked him---"Mister Freeman! Will you come to church this coming Sunday and make a Profession of Faith in front of all our church members---and will you be baptized that same Sunday??"
"I sure will, Preacher! Be glad to!!"
That next Sunday---here came that 82 year old man---walking down the isle of the church with a cane---publically professing Jesus as his personal savior and being Baptized in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit----sixty-five years after he prayed to recieve Jesus in that foxhole in Belgium!!
How about that for a testamony---that God's word will not return void???
You're right, Joseph, that paragraph doesn't 'fit' with the rest of the article.
I see these "miracles" opening up new possibilities in a "clock work orange" sort of way. Maybe we can show this movie in all of the prisons, and give the inmates copies of the soundtrack. They will all fall under the conviction brought on by the movie, they will all confess, and we won't need to pay for court appointed lawyers, and can save the taxpayers some money. They could have just as easily confessed their crime after watching "It's a wonderful life".
Dear Brother Blackbird,
I am glad to hear that. I know a man who came to church, every chance he got. Professed salvation, and eager to be baptized, always right there for anything the church needed. He was married to a Catholic lady and that caused problems at home. He was always requesting prayer for his wife and children who were raised catholic.
He would sometimes cry while requesting these prayers. He was always interested in learning of Jesus and doing what he could to serve (he was a veteran of Korea).
He was a good man, but sometimes during business meetings he would let disagreements bother him, still, we all do that sometime, right.
Well, finally last summer or early fall the man and his wife (who was catholic) divorced. Sometime in December we had to perform discipline against this man and a married sister. I am at a loss and I can't even tell you why the thing happened. I am hoping he and the other person will come back with fruit of repentance, when these things happen there are more folks hurt than those who are immediately involved.
Works, even those of the fruit of the Spirit can be deceiving. I sincerely hope not more often, but so far, I have seen at least two members deceive a whole congregation and a husband for at least three months and all the while making the most beautiful pleas for the salvation of others and for personal prayer,
Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
Passion defenders are quick to point out that all of the heart attacks that have occured while viewing the movie, including the 43 year old man, was just coincidence, so then in order to be consistant, I must apply the same logic to this then.
If this man was convicted of his sin, possibly by the remarks of the two thieves on the crosses next to Christ, then who are we to judge his heart? Again, we limit the power of God and the Holy Spirit to say HE couldn't use a movie to soften this man's heart and bring him to his knees.
He knew he deserved punishment while Jesus died for that sin and he was going free... after killing his girlfriend and her unborn baby....
I'm sure many people have seen the film and NOT confessed awful sins. In my best friends family, one went forward on Sunday for salvation counseling but her aunt spent the night in a bar right after seeing the movie.
Dear Sister Diane,
I respect you more than you will ever be able to know in this world.
However, I know people who spent their time in a bar while their wives were giving birth to their child.
That has nothing to do with anything, imho.
I don't think anyone is limiting the power of God except that God will not go beyond his limitations.
He has ordained the preached word to provide his visitation upon the lost (I don't say sinners, because even being saved we each are yet sinners).
God never ordained the mixture of truth with gory images, visions of people who according to their confession probably were not saved (can't mix grace and works and acheive a Biblical salvation).
There has been way too much information posted in the way of links to show why we oppose this film.
This is not something that has started just because of Gibson's artistic license. but it started really when people like Billy Graham began to counsel those professing salvation to them to return to the church they were attending, even to one which teaches such nonsense as a mixture of Mary's message to the world and that of Christ. And then to openly say that we are believers of essentially the same things. This is not true of neither myself and a Catholic, nor yourself and a Catholic.
We do believe that there is nothing to be mixed with the completed work of Christ in providing to us eternal life. The Catholic cannot honestly tell you he/she believes that same thing.
Once we say things like they believe as we do, then there becomes no reason (in the eyes of the Catholic, or of the world) to see a continued purpose in remaining separated from Rome.
So, did you attend 5:00 o'clock mass this evening? If not, why not? Do you believe as the Catholic does?
They have a continued priesthood class, we are a priesthood of believers, they are not, they must approach God through many and varied sacraments instituted by the church and to them, there is no other way.
O, sure, they will explain that away in order to get you and me to join hands with them and walk along together.
But, still, being apart from the church and Rome, you and I can only hope for cleansing of our rejection of the true church as vicar (through the papal chair) of Christ in this world and this cleansing can only occur in purgatory. We can only hope we have not done despite to the spirit of Grace such that we are even permitted in purgatory and not sent straight into the lake of fire.
God has no need of this film nor any other to draw anyone to Christ, for that He uses the Holy Spirit alone.
I saw the oath of a Jesuit somewhere, I don't think it was here, I will find it and post a link to it so you can go read it to learn their allegiances and their motivations.
May God Richly bless you dear Sister
Bro. Dallas Eaton
God set a certain order, and then He Himself follows it. Can He go outside that order He has given? Yes, but He does not, thats why He is God and we aren't. God gave a specfic way of reaching lost,(as you say through the preaching of the word), and then demonstrates that to us in scripture, this is how He chooses to to do it.
Maybe upon conviction of his sin, he decided to simply do the right thing.and confess. It may have nothing to do with legalize from the Bible. I don't think I could just "ask forgiveness" and go about my life with no more thought about killing someone... unless you're Bush that killed thousands of Iraqies. Then you may have to hide your shame by making jokes about finding WMD at the press corp meeting.
The same logic used against a political figure , that is interesting that you hold a public figure to a higher standard than you do a non-public figure.