Hello to all, I wanted to ask this question in the fundamental arena first. I count myself as a fundamental, and am looking forward to fellowship with others of like mind. I am sure there will be differences in generalities, but am sure also that we build from the same foundation (Jesus). The question I pose concerns the book of Hebrews, and the theme of perfection found therein: concerning Christ, His sacrifice, salvation, and that of those born-again. I am assuming a fundamental doctrine of our faith is that salvation is eternal, that is an event in the life of an unbeliever at a specific point in time, where he/she is born-again and receives the new nature. And that this salvation, because it is wholly the work of God, from our hearing the Word, to the belief in that Word, to the convicting of the Holy Spirit, and the resulting new nature, whereby we are indwelt by the Spirit of God, cannot be lost, walked away from, or any other descriptive term used to promote one losing savation. (whew, sorry for the long sentence) If these are not a fundamental belief, please let me know. One thing I have tried to debate with those who promote loss of salvation is this: lets look at the verses you use to teach this. Ultimately Hebrews 6:1-6 and 10:26 are thrown in. While I can defend assurance of salvation easily enough, because these verse are pulled out of context, they are unwilling to let go of their position (doctrine) because it flies in the face of their faith...which is easily identified as a works-based faith, in which they are counting on their own good works to retain their salvation. Rather than Christ's death in their place for the forgiveness of their sin. I was surprised, however, to learn of one brother who, though affirming salvation could not be lost, saw the hearers of 6:1-6 and 10:26 as true believers. This was surprising to me. So, one of my questions to you, fundamental brethren, is this: do you agree with this? I will say this, I firmly deny that these warnings, or rather, the chacteristics and consequenses of who the warnings are directed at are not born-again believers. This thread itself is more concerned with the use of the words perfect, perfection, full age, and consecrated, all variants of what in the greek simply means complete. No great theological discovery, but never taught, as far as I have seen. The discussion will both center around this theme which threads its way through Hebrews, and deal directly with salvation. I hope for a good discussion, tempered with a little more grace than would be found by those who purposely teach a salvation in which the believer must still work his way to heaven. Rather than entering God's rest, relying solely on the blood of Christ (His death in my place), His finishing the work He has begun in me, and conforming me to the image of His Son in the process. God bless.