Petition For The Pledge "Under God" You Can Make a Difference

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by Choosefaith, Jun 26, 2002.

  1. Choosefaith

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  2. bb_baptist

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    Pledge of Allegiance Ruled Unconstitutional

    The Pledge of Allegiance is unconstitutional and should not be recited in public schools because it includes the words "under God," a federal appeals court ruled Wednesday.

    In its 2-1 decision, the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals overturned a 1954 act of Congress that inserted the phrase "under God" after the phrase "one nation" in the pledge.
     
  3. bb_baptist

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    The Pledge of Allegiance - I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

    Do you agree with the federal appeals court ruling that the Pledge of Allegiance, with the words "under God," is unconstitutional? Vote Here:
    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,56310,00.html
     
  4. Choosefaith

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    Wooo.. I thought I was In Trouble Again When I saw Webmaster post on the front page! :D I disagree Big time with the Courts and I found out of the Petition From Dr Falwell on Fox News.
    It is a pity, if you watch Fox News EST on the next show hannity and colmes right now! They are going to Interview the Man who started this and they are going to show the original pledge or something like that. right now they are giving the Oriely Factor but Next They will interview. I was Upset at this Guy but I respect Opinions but I don't agree.
     
  5. TheGroominator

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    Mr. Webmaster, I am not trying to be nit-pickey, I truly appreciate your previous two posts on this subject but in the pledge there is no comma between "one nation" and "under God". Whenever I have the privledge to lead the Pledge of Allegiance I always point out that that part of the pledge should be repeated as a whole, not divided.
     
  6. Sam

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    If the Pledge is changed and we are to take God out of "one nation under God" we will be saying "one nation under." I belive that "one nation under" is exactly what we will be. Wake up America, and turn back to God, before it is to late. ~Sheila~
     
  7. Don

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    The Muslims already believe we are a godless nation.

    Thanks to the 9th Circuit Court, they're almost right.
     
  8. Gayla

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    "dittos"
    groominator, sam and don
     
  9. flaman

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    Why would we pledge allegiance to a Masonic symbol, the flag of the United States? Did Jesus pledge allegiance to Rome?

    The Pledge of Allegiance was written by a member of an occult brotherhood, a Freemason. And there are little chidren and adults who believe "the story" instead of truth with hands over their hearts, in a Masonic gesture, pledging allegiance to the flag of America. What does this have to do with the King of kings and the Lord of lords?

    "I Pledge Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

    The above pledge (except for "one Nation under God") was written by Francis J. Bellamy (1855-1931), a Baptist clergyman and also a -- Fabian Socialist, who was also a member of Little Falls Masonic Lodge No. 181, Little Falls, New York. The pledge was published in "The Youth's Companion" magazine on September 8,1892 in Boston. The phrase, "one Nation under God", was added in 1954 by the U.S. Congress.

    Followers of Jesus ought to re-examine this civil ritual for several reasons. This pledge is really an oath. Jesus said that we should not swear oaths, but to let our "yes" be yes and our "no" be no (Matthew 5:33-37).

    We ought to consider what it is we are doing when we take part in a solemn ritual with pagans, Pagans, Mormons, Masons, Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, Buddhists etc. etc. and we speak of "one nation under God". What god are we referring to?

    Freemasonry teaches, "the Fatherhood of God and the brotherhood of man." The Bible says that all who have not become a child of God by becoming reconciled to God through Jesus Christ, are an enemy of God. When we face the Red, White, and Blue with our hands over our hearts and speak of "one nation under god", are we speaking of the god of the U.S. one dollar bill? "In god we trust"? The god of the one dollar bill is the god of the U.S. seal on the one dollar bill: equilateral triangle, All-seeing Eye of Osiris, and the Egyptian pyramid. All symbols of Freemasonry.

    The more one looks into the history of Francis Bellamy and the Pledge, the more questions arise as to what has really been going on.

    I encourage you to re-examine whether you, as a follower of Jesus Christ, or your children, ought to be taking part in this Masonic ritual.
     
  10. Choosefaith

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    I believe it must be reversed, It must be because it is a declaration that America is no longer "One Nation Under God". The court that did this is saying that America does not need or want God and in the future they might want to remove it over all, who knows. This ruling must be reversed immediately! They are Trying to take God out everywhere in some way,The Ten Commandments,The Cross at WTC,Schools,TV,Satelite Tv, If they Keep it up I wouldn't be surprised one day if it affected the Church. I noticed in the interview with the guy who started this mess, He was at times upset at the questions and would say, "Why, because I don't believe in Jesus" in a Fox News Interview. Now it is more than taking God out of the Pledge, In Fact in his own words he wants it out of money,courts,prayer at meetings, yes he filed a suit because of prayer too that was done by Franklin Graham at the inauguration , The link to the story is below!

    "Many people who are upset about this are people who just don't understand," Newdow said Wednesday during an interview at his suburban Sacramento home. "People have to consider what if they were in the minority religion and the majority religion was overpowering them."

    I ask which is the majority religion? Christians?

    I kinda Feel Sorry for this guy and will pray for him, He said he has had threatening messages and leaves his answering machine, One online board (I am not saying the name) Had a phone number (which I don't have and would not put) I don't know if it was fake or not but I wouldn't be surprised if it was real.

    Here is the Interview By Foxnews Hannity and Colmes!
    http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,56381,00.html

    [ June 27, 2002, 02:15 PM: Message edited by: Choosefaith ]
     
  11. Kiffin

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    Are not we conservatives making a bigger deal than it really is? I believe the guy had the wrong motive in seeking to have it removed in that he has been on a crusade for years on this But...has not "under God" become a type of ceremonial Deism? and maybe slightly blasphemous since the USA is hardly a country that follows God.
     
  12. flaman

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    kiffin

    Your right, but I'm afraid that most don't want to look at the truth and blindly follow a myth.
     
  13. ATeenageChristian

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    Why would we pledge allegiance to a Masonic symbol, the flag of the United States? Did Jesus pledge allegiance to Rome?

    The Pledge of Allegiance was written by a member of an occult brotherhood, a Freemason. And there are little chidren and adults who believe "the story" instead of truth with hands over their hearts, in a Masonic gesture, pledging allegiance to the flag of America. What does this have to do with the King of kings and the Lord of lords?

    "I Pledge Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

    The above pledge (except for "one Nation under God") was written by Francis J. Bellamy (1855-1931), a Baptist clergyman and also a -- Fabian Socialist, who was also a member of Little Falls Masonic Lodge No. 181, Little Falls, New York. The pledge was published in "The Youth's Companion" magazine on September 8,1892 in Boston. The phrase, "one Nation under God", was added in 1954 by the U.S. Congress.

    Followers of Jesus ought to re-examine this civil ritual for several reasons. This pledge is really an oath. Jesus said that we should not swear oaths, but to let our "yes" be yes and our "no" be no (Matthew 5:33-37).

    We ought to consider what it is we are doing when we take part in a solemn ritual with pagans, Pagans, Mormons, Masons, Muslims, Hindus, Sikhs, Buddhists etc. etc. and we speak of "one nation under God". What god are we referring to?

    Freemasonry teaches, "the Fatherhood of God and the brotherhood of man." The Bible says that all who have not become a child of God by becoming reconciled to God through Jesus Christ, are an enemy of God. When we face the Red, White, and Blue with our hands over our hearts and speak of "one nation under god", are we speaking of the god of the U.S. one dollar bill? "In god we trust"? The god of the one dollar bill is the god of the U.S. seal on the one dollar bill: equilateral triangle, All-seeing Eye of Osiris, and the Egyptian pyramid. All symbols of Freemasonry.

    The more one looks into the history of Francis Bellamy and the Pledge, the more questions arise as to what has really been going on.

    I encourage you to re-examine whether you, as a follower of Jesus Christ, or your children, ought to be taking part in this Masonic ritual.

    -------------------------------------------------

    I disagree. Jesus said "Give what is Caesars to Caesars and give what is God's to God. We are pledging are loyalty to a nation which is not only at war with terrorism, but is crumbling from the inside. We need to show our loyalty because if we don't, that means we hate America. I agree America should come back to Christ, but there are limitations.

    The Separation of Church and State is something we have to accept. The Separatists (as I call them) want God and Christ out of every American citizen's life! This must not be allowed. Even though America is going to collapse soon (thanks to the Separatists) :rolleyes: , we need to pledge our loyalty to show we support our nation and appreciate everything it stands for! Give me another nation that has:

    1.) Freedom of religion
    2.) Freedom of Press
    3.) Freedom of Assembly
    4.) Freedom period!
     
  14. flaman

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    In this dispensation it is not the calling of God's people to get involved in the political process nor the functions of civil government.

    Our citizenship is in heaven (Phil. 3:20). We are strangers and pilgrims (1 Pet. 2:11); we are sojourners, not settlers (1 Pet. 1:17).

    God has not called us to try to make this a better world in which to live. "This world," Paul wrote, "in its present form is passing away" (1 Cor. 7:31b).

    The work of the Church is to call people out of this world system by evangelizing the lost and making disciples. Except for caring for our widows and orphans, et cetera, there is nothing else for the Church to do.

    The leaders of the sixteenth-century Reformation did not see the important difference between the Old and the New Dispensation regarding separation between Church and State. To this day many conservative leaders in the Church have been wrongly influenced by the teachings of some of those reformers. The attempts by some of them to establish a theocracy led them to compromise with the world rather than stand in contradistinction to it.

    Christians who think that God has called them to run for political office are deceived. We are not to pledge allegiance to any flag, nor are we to be sworn into any office. Indeed, in this age we are not to swear any oath or swear to uphold any constitution or civil government (Mt. 5:33-37; Jam. 5:12). This is true for Christians in Russia or Switzerland or the United States.

    We as Christians should not get involved in the governments or kingdoms of this world. Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world" (Jn. 18:36a).

    Some Christians say that we can infiltrate these political systems to have a Christian influence so that we can raise our children in a better environment. This may sound plausible, and indeed according to the Scriptures we are the salt of the earth. But we must do God's work His way; everything else is, at best, a fine grade of wood, hay, and stubble.

    Some say that Satan has changed his strategy, and no longer persecutes Christians in places like America. But do not be deceived, beloved Christian. It is not Satan who has changed, it is the Church. The Church is so much like the world that there is no contrast---therefore there is no persecution. If Christians refuse to compromise with the world and its carnal offerings, and call sin what it is---sin---then they will suffer persecution, they will be hated by worldlings including loved ones and others. And the day is coming when, in America, Christians who are of the likes of John the Baptizer and the apostle Paul will suffer martyrdom. But all the better. Persecution has always served to purify the Church, to separate the goats from the sheep, to glorify God. According to Paul, "Everyone who wants to live a godly life in Christ Jesus will be persecuted" (2 Tim. 3:12).

    If the Second Advent is near, then America, if not exclusively then as part of a system, is depicted in the Book of Revelation as the abominable commercial and spiritual Babylon from which God's people are commanded to come out. Not that we should physically leave, but we should be spiritually separated. We are in the world, but we are not of the world, and the only reason we are in the world is to call people out of it. That is, those who have been saved, prepared, and sent should evangelize the lost and make disciples until Jesus comes back.

    Scripture says that "we know that we are children of God, and that the whole world is under the control of the evil one" (1 Jn. 5:19). It also says that "when a country is rebellious, it has many rulers" (Prov. 28:2). This truly is the case in the United States today. Rule by the ruled---that is democracy.
     
  15. Choosefaith

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    Alot of what you are saying is true (Especially Biblical Verses) But I do not see how it is wrong to disagree with a decision, and get involved with a petition like this Pastor, Dr. Falwell and the ministry is doing. I think people should vote too, That's not wrong? We know in the Future it will get worse and it will be a lot worse then taking a phrase out of the pledge since there is evil and worse to come.But We Have Won The Battle And We Do Not Have To Fear Since God is On Our Side. Our goals as christians is not to do petitions and only vote and be in the politics but to lead others to Repentance and Christ and to show them his love and Plan of Salvation to live a life for him.

    [ June 27, 2002, 06:00 PM: Message edited by: Choosefaith ]
     
  16. TheGroominator

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    So, flaman, you would have us believe that we are supposed to sit with our heads in the sand and let the unbelievers, the sodomites, the whoremongers rule this country that God has blessed, that we are to do nothing and hope for the best. Whatever happened to being good stewards of what God has given us? Luke 19:13, we are to "Occupy till I come". That means do business. It is true, we are not of this world, only passing through, that doesn't mean that we are not involved in its' affairs. Everything we have is God's, we are only the caretakers. Of course we are to be politically involved in the administration of our country.

    It's amazing how someone can take a subject as basic as this and run amuck with it to end up so far out in left field that they have their own zip code. A pledge is a promise or agreement. An oath is a ritualistic declaration based on an appeal to some revered person or thing. You interchange them much too easily, flaman. Yes, Bellamy wrote the pledge, but he didn't write it for this country, it was written so that all of the world republics of that time could use it. It started, "I pledge allegiance to my flag.....", he was furious when it was changed to "...the flag of the United States of America". When Theodore Roosevelt added "One Nation under God" in 1954 he said that now the children would be able to affirm the sovereignty of God in this country daily. How that ties in to your money symbols, I don't know. Yes, those symbols have Masonic foundations, that just makes my point that Christians have to remain involved in Government. We have remained quiet much too long, look at the mess we're in now. It's time to take a stand on what you believe. No more walking the fence. No more being lukewarm. Write your congressmen/women, write your representatives when questionable bills come up for votes. Write TV stations and manufacturers about trash programs that they air/sponsor. Believe me, if you don't do it, the worldly people sure aren't going to do it for you.
     
  17. MissAbbyIFBaptist

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    Someone earlier posted "'One nation under' and that's what we will be." I want to say:AMEN AND AMEN!
    The fact that an atheist started this ought to be enough to get people angrey, but the fact that someone wants to take "GOD" out of our pledge, is enough to make me furious, and to convince me that "perolous times" are here.
    Our contry was founded UNDER GOD wheither people care to admitt it or not!
    I would like to point out the Pledge Of Allegiance states:eek:n nation under God, indivisible..."
    You see, you can't have one without the other. Our contry would most certianly fall without our Amazing Saviour.
    I should think after Semptember 11 we wouldn't be so quik to forgett. It could have been so much worse, but God in His grace didn't allow it to be worse. I belive 9/11 was a wake up call to America, and it surprises me just how quik people forget.
    Does anyone but me think it's a little odd that we can't pray at school,or at football games, but someone prays before Congress meets?
    If Atheists' want to take "God" out of America, then why don't they quit using money. I mean, all our money has "In God we trust" on it. Since it would be hypocratical for atheists' to say that, they ought not use it!
    As for me, when saying the pledge, will keep on saying 'one nation under God' no matter what the courts say. It's called freedom of speech, and I intend to use mine to take a stand.
    In our Saviour,
    Abby
     
  18. Choosefaith

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    WoW! Abby. :D ;) I believe Sept 11, was a wake up call and some are back to sleep -¿-zzZZZ
     
  19. flaman

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    A clear understanding of, and firm faith in, the coming of God's Kingdom means that we will recognize that human Government is unable to bring about perfection. Any involvement in human politics is therefore incompatible with the hope of the Kingdom. Jesus prophesied that things would degenerate from bad to worse in "the last days" just prior to his coming (Luke 21:9-11, 25-27). It is not possible to believe his words and at the same time try to improve the world's position through human politics or aid agencies.

    The record of the early believers shows them to have been committed to living a spiritual life in anticipation of Christ's return, chiefly manifesting their concern for the surrounding world through preaching to them. There is no record of their addressing the social, economic and political problems of the world around them.

    "It is not in man that walketh to direct his steps" (Jer. 10:23); appreciating the fundamental evil and error of human nature means that we will recognize that human leadership is unsuitable for God's people. Therefore getting involved with things such as this flag issue or voting is inconsistent with a true understanding of this. "The most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will" (Dan 4:32). Human rulers are thus ultimately given their power by God (Rom. 13:1); to vote in a democratic system may therefore involve voting against one whom God has chosen to be in power. Thus it is recorded that God gave certain nations into the control of Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon (Jer. 27:5,6).

    Because of our recognition that God has given nations into the hands of their rulers, we should be very careful to be exemplary citizens, abiding by the laws of the country where we live, unless they conflict with the law of Christ. "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers...the powers that be are ordained of God...for this cause pay ye tribute (taxes) also...render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due...honour to whom honour" is due (Rom. 13:1-7).

    The involvement in any of the so-called Christian organizations that are around today in forms of political activitives of this or any government is therefore an indication of their studied disregard of these basic Biblical principles. However, Peter's example of continuing to preach Christ when forbidden by the Government to do so, is an indication of how we can only obey human commands when they do not conflict with the law of Christ: "Whether it be right in the sight of God to hearken unto you more than unto God, judge ye" (Acts 4:17-20; 5:28,29).
     
  20. rsr

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    Why are so many Baptists defending a religious pledge? I have no problem reciting the pledge as it is, but I see why some would find it objectionable.
     

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