Reccomendations> Graduate studies

Discussion in 'Baptist Colleges / Seminaries' started by Havensdad, Dec 16, 2008.

  1. Havensdad

    Havensdad
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    I was curious. Was reconsidering my degree pursuits...

    I am looking for a good (Preferably RA or ATS accredited) University, that is either Baptist or Non denom with Baptist leanings, Reformed or "Neutral", which offers a MTh or STM and accepts students with a Nationally accredited M. Div. Courses that offer Week long intensives, or online classes are a plus.

    Any suggestions?
     
  2. Squire Robertsson

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  3. Havensdad

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    Brother,
    Those looked like great choices but...

    Neither of those schools offered a MTh.
     
  4. Martin

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    ==Check out Liberty Baptist Theological Seminary's Master of Sacred Theology (STM) program HERE. Usually LBTS is good about accepting degrees from nationally accredited schools and they offer the degree online and in the blended format. Of course you need to have an MDiv with languages to enter the program. Check out the admissions page to make sure you qualify before you take the time to put together an application (I assume you do qualify though).

    I hope that helps!
     
  5. Squire Robertsson

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    True, they both max out at an MDiv, but both programs do have solid language requirements. But they are both schools I trust. And they both have the course schedule you are looking for. So, if you don't have an MDiv., take a look.
     
    #5 Squire Robertsson, Dec 16, 2008
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  6. Rhetorician

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    HD Response

    HD,

    I hope all is well with you and yours?

    May I ask why you are looking for the ThM or STM? Are you going on to do a PhD/ThD?

    Please advise?

    "That is all!"
     
  7. Havensdad

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    Possibly. When I get old. Only old people get PhD's. :laugh:

    I am not sure yet. I may well stop with the ThM/STM: Why I am thinking of doing it? I like to study, I like to write, and I like to teach. If nothing else it will open some shut doors, possibly...
     
  8. Rhetorician

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    HD Response #2

    HD,

    Let me recommend that you look at The University of the South, Sewanee's, School of Theology. The web address is Sewanee.edu.

    They have a Master of Sacred Theology that can be done in the summers. I did my doctorate there. They are cordial. They are tough. They are Ecumenical. They are liberal. But you will get one "Class A" education and degree. It is a little pricey but you will have a degree from a prestigeous (sp?) university.

    From Sewanee's web page it says:

    "Master of Sacred Theology

    The Master of Sacred Theology (S.T.M.) program is an academic research degree, based primarily on courses taken in the summer at the School of Theology, although S.T.M. students may also take courses at other accredited seminaries and electives during the academic year at the School of Theology. The student has a major area of concentration and writes a thesis with the approval of the advanced degrees committee."

    I know what you may be saying to yourself!!!! Why in the world would this preacher recommend for me to attend the liberal Episcopalian seminary? Further more, why did he attend a liberal Episcopalian seminary himself? That is a long discussion and I would be glad to have it with you off line sometime.

    A second recommendation would be the South African Theological Seminary (or SATS). My good friend and reader/mentor for SATS, Dr. Bill Grover, frequents the BB and can tell you all about it. If I was wanting the Master of Sacred Theology or a MTh I would seriously look at their program. It is recognized, it is researched based, it is rigorous, and IT IS CHEAP!!!!:wavey:

    How about it Dr. Grover, can you lend a comment to our discussion?

    Although these two school choices do not meet your "Baptist persuasion" criteria, some of my very best learning was done in two of my degrees outside of the "Baptist circle."

    "That is all!"
     
    #8 Rhetorician, Dec 17, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2008
  9. Havensdad

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    Rhet,

    I am currently doing work at SATS. I like them very much! But something in it that is lacking for me is the personal interaction. I wish to do a large chunk of my work through distance ed. (for reasons of expedience), but not ALL of it. I would really like to look into something where I could do some one or two week intensives/ J terms, etc., to get some face to face time.

    I thought of doing some non enrollment classes at schools like "NOBTS", and transferring them to SATS, but unfortunately they only (from what I can see) offer such classes in online formats, which defeats the purpose.
     
  10. Rhetorician

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    HD Response #3

    HD,

    After your response above, I really think you need to look at The University of the South @ Sewanee.

    Check it out!:thumbs:

    "That is all!"
     
  11. Havensdad

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    Episcopal, AND over 700 bucks per CH! :eek:
    Thank you, brother, but I couldn't afford that...

    Any more?
     
  12. Havensdad

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    #12 Havensdad, Dec 17, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2008
  13. Rhetorician

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    HS Reponse #?

    HD,

    Read closely what it says:



    Master of Theology
    The mission of the School of Theology is to produce world changers. We want to develop men and women, called by God, apprenticed to Jesus, empowered by the Spirit, who are . . .
    1. Passionately evangelical: who are passionate about God’s good news in Jesus Christ and who have a strong desire for others to experience life in him;
    2. Rooted in the story: who love God’s powerful Word and who in community with others are learning, knowing, trusting, and following the Sacred Scriptures which are able, from beginning to end, to show the way to salvation in Jesus Christ;
    3. Church-connected: who have a high view of the local church, but whose field of vision does not limit ministry to within the “four walls” and who see the local church as a base from which to go out into the world;
    4. Servant leaders: who are of high moral character and kingdom heart; who are developing Jesus’ qualities of servant leadership and who in turn develop servant leaders under them;
    5. Spiritual entrepreneurs: who are creative, energized by the possibilities of what God and faithful persons together can do; builders who start with nothing and see spiritual dreams take shape; inventors capable of reinvention to maintain effective ministry; and
    6. Partners in an enduring fellowship: who make an impact for Christ during their student days; alumni who display an abiding love for and commitment towards the University; brotherhoods and sisterhoods, forged at CU, that are fruitful for ministry well beyond graduation.
    The academic and research portions of study are designed to support growth and excellence in the actual practice of ministry in the churches, institutions of the churches, and other missional endeavors sponsored by the churches.
    The M.Th. degree is a thirty-nine hour program of study that includes an eighteen-hour emphasis in one of four areas.
    • Biblical Studies
    • Educational Ministries
    • Pastoral Ministries & Counseling
    • Theology/History/Philosophy
    In addition, each student will be supervised in a three-hour ministry internship, which has as its primary goal providing the student an experience of and model for reflective, interactive, and effective leadership. Course Requirements
    The standard course outline of the M.Th. is as follows.
    1. Two seminars in each of four areas of ministry study (24 hours).
    • Biblical Studies, (2, three hour seminars)
    • Theological/Historical/Philosophical Studies, (2, three hour seminars)
    • Pastoral Ministry Studies, (2, three hour seminars)
    • Educational Ministry Studies, (2, three hour seminars)
    1. An additional four seminars in one of the four areas above (12 hours; combining to make an 18-hour emphasis in one area). The student select from two formats.
      1. Either: Four additional seminars in one of the four fields of study above concluding with a written Comprehensive Essay in his or her chosen field of study.
      2. Or: Two additional seminars (6 hours) in one of the four fields of study above and then completion of a 75-page minimum thesis that focuses on some aspect of the student’s area of emphasis. This “Thesis Option,” available only by professor/supervisor approval, includes the preparation and faculty approval of a thesis prospectus, and 2, three hour thesis writing seminars).
    2. Supervised Practicum (one semester, 3 hours). Each student, in consultation with his or her advisor, will select an appropriate ministry placement, secure a journeyman minister as a field supervisor, and will engage in a semester-long experience of supervised ministry.
    FYI!

    rd
     
  14. Havensdad

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    I guess I just thought the degree programs were a little more standardized than that. Typically a degree such as one described here would be called a "MATS" degree or a M.T.S. (such as the similar degree at Liberty), rather than a MTh. I have not seen any other school call such a program a "MTh"or "ThM".
     
    #14 Havensdad, Dec 17, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 17, 2008
  15. Rhetorician

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    HD Reponse # (Who Knows?)

    HD,

    If I have understood properly:

    1. Ther ThM or MTh is built upon the old Bachelor of Divinity. It assumes the Biblical Languages.

    2. It is "kinda Sorta" hung around since the BD was changed out for the newer model Master of Divinity.

    3. It is now known as the "second theological degree" with the MDiv being the "first theological degree."

    4. And again, it assumes the graduate level Biblical Language study.

    5. Because the MDiv is a practitioner degree it allows (or assumes) a narrow approach to the disciplines that would point to the PhD/ThD degrees. One can specialize with the Master of Sacred Theology before doing grad school proper. It is an academic degree.

    6. It is to be distinguished from the MAR, for this degree is like a truncated MDiv professional or practitioner degree.

    7. It is also to be distinguished from the Master of Theological Studies (MTS) which runs in the area of 60 hours or two years to complete. This also can be done so the holder can go straight to the PhD/ThD at the university without havng to do the extra time for the MDiv.

    8. Basically the Master of Sacred Theology brings one up to the 120 hr range that Dallas Theological Seminary has held as their standard for all these years.

    9. Basically also, the ThM/STM is the degree that will open up the opportunity to do PhD/ThD at the seminary and is line with the MA from the university. It prepares/allows the holder to apply for the terminal research degree at the university.

    Now all of these are the meanderings of an "old academic." I welcome "angry exhortations" and corrections. And we all know and it has been discussed here at length on the BB that the "degrees" have been controverted and convoluted for a long time in the American system.:laugh:

    Opinions Welcome!!

    "That is all!"
     
  16. Rhetorician

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    HD Response

    Hello!

    I do not know if it came up in the mix or not, but I find it very interesting that one does not have to hold the MDiv for admission into the Master of Theology program. They seem to be taking a lot for granted like say-the Biblical Languages. Am I reading this correctly?:laugh:

    "That is all!"
     
  17. Havensdad

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    Your funny. :applause:

    Although I think the Liberty requirement of 9 credits in BOTH Greek and Hebrew is a bit excessive for entrance into a STM (I cannot find anyone else that requires over 6 in each). For instance entrance into Southern Baptist Seminaries PhD program, requires only one year in each of the Biblical languages...

    Rigor is not a bad thing though. And I have a head start on them.

    Who here has extensive training in both Greek and Hebrew? I have taken Basic Greek, but I am curious whether I could handle taking a Hebrew and Greek class concurrently: seems it might get "confusing". Thoughts?
     
  18. Rhetorician

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    HD "Thoughts" Response

    HD,

    Seems to me that I (we) have been missing something in the conversation. This Masters does not require an MDiv for entrance? Does it? Why would they want to do that? Seems to me to be following the British model?

    I have misunderstood something? Or is that the way that you see it too?

    Thoughts? Comebacks?:wavey:

    "That is all!"
     
  19. Havensdad

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    That was my point. Although they do require an undergraduate degree with a minimum of 18 hours of Biblical studies.

    Perhaps it is an aversion to the languages...are they "KJV ONLY"??

    My question is: would this MTh get you into a PhD/ThD program at a different school? Certainly not, right?
     
  20. Martin

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    ==Did you check into Liberty's Masters of Sacred Theology program? They also have a ThM but it is on-campus only.
     

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