Reply To An Interesting Inquiry of “From Eternity Past”

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by NetChaplain, Sep 15, 2013.

  1. NetChaplain

    NetChaplain
    Expand Collapse
    Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2013
    Messages:
    549
    Likes Received:
    21
    “So, would you then say that in effect God causes the sinner to sin the sins they sin? Thus when a man is tempted it is because God created Him to be tempted in just this way?”



    It is obvious God created man with the ability to sin, same as the angels (but they are not heirs of salvation, just messengers to those who are - Heb 1:14), or Adam and Eve couldn't have sinned. Whether this nature was antecedent of the temptation is irrelevant to me, but God’s foreknowing is. I believe one the primary similarities between the angelic and human order is autonomy, which is what I believe is the primary "likeness" of God, e.g. only man and angels have this ability.

    I believe it is this ability of choosing for self (Due 30:19) that incurs accountability, and just as the angels were created with the ability to choose, so man also has. God's "ways are past finding out" (Rom 11:33) and I believe He chose to use sin in His plan, which in my opinion does not make God to become a part of sin. To allow for the concept of man being in His "likeness" concerning choice, He "determined" this is the way, or He would have predetermined another way if it wasn't the way He desired it to transpire.

    God doesn't "cause the sinner to sin" but in order that we are like (likeness) Him in autonomy, this is His way.

    I expect there will be many who conceive of this concept to be ridiculous and my apologies, but my reason for posting all my materials is to encourage, not compete.

    -NC (Robert)
     
  2. Winman

    Winman
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2009
    Messages:
    14,768
    Likes Received:
    0
    Well, Jesus said sin was necessary;

    Mat 18:7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!

    Some say that God could have made men and angels without the ability to sin, but I believe this is false. God is love, and love cannot enslave or compel a person. I believe God must by his nature give us free will, which makes the possibility of sin necessary.

    Now, when we trust Jesus as our Saviour, we willingly choose to be born again of the Spirit that cannot sin, and in the resurrection we will not have corruptible bodies and therefore will not be tempted to sin. But we have made our choice in this life, and so we are not compelled to love and obey God, but do so voluntarily.

    And, as far as God knowing we would sin, I believe God cannot create anything equal to himself, so God cannot create anyone who is perfectly righteous as he is. All of God's creation MUST be inferior to him, as only God can be perfect in any attribute. It is impossible to be equal to God (except for Jesus).

    But again, when we are born again (by choice) we then partake of the divine nature that cannot sin.

    1 Cor 6:17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.

    2 Pet 1:4 Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

    1 Jhn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

    This is my view.
     
  3. Herald

    Herald
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 29, 2011
    Messages:
    1,600
    Likes Received:
    0
    First, I concur with you that God does not cause anyone to sin. James writes, 'Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God"; for God cannot be tempted by evil, and He Himself does not tempt anyone. But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust" (James 1:13-14). The reason man sins is not because God allows man to imitate His autonomy but because man is a slave to sin (Romans 6:6). In other words man is in bondage to sin. Man sins because it is in his nature to do so.
     
  4. Winman

    Winman
    Expand Collapse
    Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2009
    Messages:
    14,768
    Likes Received:
    0
    This is the exact opposite of what scripture says. Jesus says when a man sins he becomes a servant or slave to sin.

    Jhn 8:34 Jesus answered them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin.

    Jesus said the person who sins is the servant of sin. All experience shows this. No one is born addicted to cigarettes, but when a person freely chooses to smoke and continues to smoke they become addicted and a slave to tobacco. No one is born with a bottle of Jack Daniels in their hand, but when a man chooses to drink and continues to do so he can become addicted.

    This holds true with any sin, the first time you commit sin is the most difficult, after that it becomes easier and easier to commit that same sin, and the stronger the addiction to that sin becomes.

    Paul said the same thing.

    Rom 6:16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

    Men do not sin because they are slaves to sin, men become slaves to sin when they yield themselves to sin.

    But even a servant or slave can disobey his master, a slave can even run away. Likewise, men can (whether) obey the gospel and become servants to righteousness.

    Rom 6:17 But God be thanked, that ye were the servants of sin, but ye have obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine which was delivered you.
    18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

    Paul taught that Christians "were" servants to sin, but they obeyed the gospel and became servants of righteousness.

    This teaching that men MUST sin because they are born slaves to sin is the EXACT OPPOSITE of what scripture truly says.
     
    #4 Winman, Sep 15, 2013
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 15, 2013
  5. Yeshua1

    Yeshua1
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2012
    Messages:
    17,023
    Likes Received:
    47
    james says that we all sin, by obeying the lusts and desires of our flesh, Paul said that in the flesh is corruption and no good thing, and jesus said that before being saved, we are slaves to the sin nature, that ONLY those whom the Sin has set free is free indeed!

    Your theology is novel but not biblical!
     

Share This Page

Loading...