Romans 8:13....mortification of sin

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Iconoclast, Mar 13, 2016.

  1. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast
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    In a sermon series Geoff Thomas opens up this text here;
    http://www.alfredplacechurch.org.uk...ation-its-obligation-encouragement-and-means/

    Mortification: Its Obligation, Encouragement and Means


    Romans 8:13 “If by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.”


    Now the Christian is not ‘in the flesh’; he is ‘in the Spirit’ but the flesh is present in hi. He is under the happy and liberating lordship and protection of Jesus Christ through the indwelling Spirit. You understand that every Christian has died to sin, but that doesn’t mean that sin is dead and gone from any Christian. Sin remains, and it is still sin and it will never stop trying to pull us down. What has changed is not sin’s active presence within our hearts, but sin’s status. It no longer the dominant influence in our lives, dictating to us, “Disbelieve that foolish message of Jesus Christ and him crucified! Kow-tow before me!” We Christians ignore him and he no longer bullies us, thank God. The flesh no longer dominates our lives. We no longer invariably give in to its various suggestions and commands. We are no longer its slaves. What a glorious deliverance our new indwelling Master has provided for every Christian. When sin says to the Christian, “Don’t repent and don’t trust in Jesus Christ” it might just as well be talking to a dead man, because every Christian has died to the voice and commands of sin. We keep trusting in Jesus asking for his help and forgiveness.
     
  2. Iconoclast

    Iconoclast
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    Here is a bit more;

    . Let me say again that surviving sin is not reigning sin, but that it is still real sin, and so while the flesh remains, you can guarantee that the Spirit of God, operating via the new life God has given us, will continue to make war on the flesh.

    So the definition of a Christian is this, “Those who belong to Christ have crucified the flesh with its lusts” (Gal. 5:24). They have done it. Not thought about it, and planned it and intended to do it. They have done it! Of course they have done it by grace, by the help of the Spirit, but they have done it. They haven’t sat back and waited for God to do it. So temptations to sin come from both without and within.
     
  3. Iconoclast

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    pt3;
    2. THE HIGH CALLING: IT IS A POSSIBILITY AND A DUTY TO PUT REMAINING SIN TO DEATH

    Now let me set before you a mindset. Let me set out the dynamics of the Christian life, especially of this theme of killing remaining sin. I want to say three things about every true Christian.

    i] Every true Christian needs to deal with sin and kill sin because if we don’t do that sin is going to kill us, but if we do kill sin we will enjoy life far more. Paul says, “If by the Spirit you put to death the misdeeds of the body, you will live.” The commandments of God are not taking the fun out of your life; keeping the commandments make life! Our text is from Romans 8, and Romans 8 follows Romans 7. What is the second half of Romans 7 about? It’s about striving with sin. It gives us Paul’s humble confession, “The good that I would, I do not; and the evil that I would not, that I do. Oh, wretched man that I am! Who shall deliver me from the body of this death?”

    This is Paul’s autobiographical account of his own personal struggle with indwelling sin. He doesn’t do the things that he would want to do, and he does the things that he would not want to do. That’s your experience and it’s also mine. Even as Christians, even as those in union with Christ, even as those who are justified by faith alone in Jesus Christ alone, even as the children of our loving Father, even as those whose sins have been washed by the blood of Jesus, we still struggle with sin – everyone of us. Sin is a reality. Men and women, if you don’t know that, then it’s probably because you’re not a Christian. If you are restless by this theme of mortification, it probably means you are not a believer, because every believer knows that his sin is an ongoing challenge, and if we don’t kill it then it will kill us. But if we do kill it then we will live.

    ii] Every true Christian has a desire to deal with his sin. That is a mark of grace. When the apostle John in his first letter mentions different marks of a real Christian then one of them he mentions is that the born again person overcomes the world. He doesn’t let worldly attitudes and values and enthusiasms dominate his life. Pleasing God dominates his life. So we are not content with our present level of wisdom or self-control or love for God. We want to deal with the remaining sin that pulls us back. Isn’t that your testimony? Whatever the week has been like, whatever personal issues we may have been dealing with last week, my own prevailing desire, (and it’s my prevailing mindset) is that I really want to deal with sin. I want to be holy. I want to be more Jesus-like. I want to get rid of certain things that I know offend my Saviour. It is my desire, it is my motivating desire. I want to be more like Jesus. Then there is one more dynamic in the Christian life;

    iii] Every true Christian is able to deal with sin. Yes, in Jesus Christ we have the resources to deal with sin. What has Paul already said in Romans 6:11? “You also must consider yourselves dead to sin and live to God in Christ Jesus.” Every Christian here now please listen. You must not dismiss yourself as a helpless, hopeless failure of a Christian. You mustn’t put yourself down like that. You are not merely that. You are someone who has died to a former state which you were once in. It was then that sin was in control of your life, when you’d do what sin told you, when you didn’t believe in Jesus Christ or lived in obedience to him. That is what we all once were. That was our old man who acted in that way. It was the behaviour of our pre-Christian past. We are not now ‘pre-Christians,’ we are new men. We are alive in Jesus Christ. We are indwelt by the Holy Spirit. We are in a position to deal with sin. We have God given resources to resist sin. Sin is not some mysterious uncontrollable entity. No!
     
  4. Iconoclast

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    pt4;
    Paul cuts through this humbug in his wonderfully devastating fashion: he says this to the Colossians; “Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: ‘Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!’? These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings. Such regulations indeed have an appearance of wisdom, with their self-imposed worship, their false humility and their harsh treatment of the body, but they lack any value in restraining sensual indulgence.” (Cols 2:20-23). Paul says, “The heretics that have entered your church life in Colosse, who are rubbing your consciences raw, and clubbing you with these rules, they are behaving in just the way all the world’s religions act, by giving you a rule book. What you’ve got is simply human commands and teachings. They are an appearance of wisdom. This is false humility. They urge harsh treatment of the body in fasting and denial, but they don’t help you to gain victory over your base instincts and lusts.”

    The Colossians were being told, “There are these things you’ve go to do; you have to starve your physical body, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.” Paul tells them that if they believe that error then they’ve been taken prisoner of false teachers, “through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ” (Col. 2:8). John Owen put his finger on the issue when he wrote: ‘Mortification from self-strength, carried on by ways of self-invention, to the end of self-righteousness, is the soul and substance of all the false religion of the world.’ If we build our religion on man-made rules (“Don’t do this; don’t go there; don’t touch this; keep away from that”) we are living under the delusion that we’ve learned the secret of profoundly dealing with indwelling sin, when in fact we are merely adjusting and rearranging some outward behaviour. This is no lasting foundation, and when the crisis of the ‘day of evil’ comes (Eph. 6:13) we’ll find ourselves on sinking sand.
     
  5. Iconoclast

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    Here is preceptaustin;
    Romans if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live. (NASB: Lockman)

    Greek: ei gar kata sarka zete (2PPAI) mellete (2PPAI) apothneskein, (PAN) ei de pneumati tas praxeis tou somatos thanatoute (2PPAI) zesesthe (2PFMI) Amplified: For if you live according to [the dictates of] the flesh, you will surely die. But if through the power of the [Holy] Spirit you are [habitually] putting to death (making extinct, deadening) the [evil] deeds prompted by the body, you shall [really and genuinely] live forever. (Amplified Bible - Lockman)
    NLT: For if you keep on following it, you will perish. But if through the power of the Holy Spirit you turn from it and its evil deeds, you will live. (NLT - Tyndale House)Phillips: Indeed that way of living leads to certain spiritual death. But if on the other hand you cut the nerve of your instinctive actions by obeying the Spirit, you are on the way to real living. (Phillips: Touchstone)Wuest: For, assuming that you are living habitually under the dominion of the sinful nature, you are on the way to dying. But, assuming that by the Spirit you are habitually putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live. (Eerdmans) Young's Literal: for if according to the flesh ye do live, ye are about to die; and if, by the Spirit, the deeds of the body ye put to death, ye shall live;

    FOR IF YOU ARE LIVING (habitually) ACCORDING TO THE FLESH: ei gar kata sarka zote (2PPAI): (Ro 8:1,4, 5, 6; 6:21,23; 7:5; Gal 5:19, 20, 21; 6:8; Eph 5:3, 4, 5; Col 3:5,6; Jas 1:14,15)
     
  6. Iconoclast

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    Hey iconoclast....did they offer anymore on it? yes they did-
    Die (599) (apothnesko [word study] from apo = away from, indicates separation + thnesko = die) means literally to die off. Literally apothnesko refers to natural death in which one's vital, life sustaining functions cease (Mt 22:24).

    So Paul is not speaking of physical death but eternal death in hell! This is fascinating because Romans 8 goes to considerable lengths to emphasize assurance of our salvation, even ending with the phrase that nothing can separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus! (Ro 8:39, cp Ro 8:30 - called, justified, glorified = you are absolutely secure!) But here in Romans 8:13a Paul says, be careful, because if you don't kill the deeds of the flesh and instead live according to the flesh, you are going to hell! John Piper feels that in light of passages like this, every pastor should at times look out on their congregation and say that they could go to hell! Piper goes on to explain that "Pastors who don't create a sense of urgency in their people -- what their lives mean, what's at stake in their lives -- aren't doing their job!" (Reference - quote at about 21 minutes)

    Apothnesko is also used figuratively to refer to not responding to something due to separation from it and thus having no part in. It can also mean to become dead to something. For example, in Romans 6, Paul teaches that since we have "mystically" but in a very real sense died with Christ when He died on the Cross, we have died to the power of sin in our life -- we are dead to sin. In Gal 2:19 Paul teaches believers have died to the Law, for Christ's death fulfilled the Law perfectly and we are in union with Him and stand before God in His perfect righteousness. In a similar way in Col 2:20 Paul says we have died to the elementary principles of the world and are free from the need to obey decrees having to do with Asceticism (a rigid outward self-discipline, by which the spirit strives after full dominion over the flesh, and a "superior" grade of virtue).

    Apothnesko as used in Ro 8:13 is a reference not to literal death but to spiritual death and ultimately the loss of eternal life (cp use of apothnesko in the spiritual death believers experience with Christ in Ro 6:7, 8, 9 - see notes Ro 6:7; 8; 9). In this case the spiritual dying results in the separation of the soul from God and this equates with the loss of eternal life.

    And so here in Ro 8:13 the death Paul describes does not refer to physical death but to spiritual, because even those who live according to the Spirit will die physically (if the Lord should tarry).
     
  7. Iconoclast

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    That is all well and good but do you have the scriptures showing that...yes;
    Paul constantly reminds us that living after the dictates of the flesh ends in death. The voice of the fallen flesh deceives one into thinking that the flesh offers "real life" (like the commercials "grab all the gusto you can get!" or "you only go around once!"). What a habitual lifestyle of obedience to Sin and the flesh does sometimes offer is short term "gain" which ultimately brings long term loss... loss of eternal life!

    Apothnesko - 100x in NT - Mt 8:32; 9:24; 22:24, 27; 26:35; Mk. 5:35, 39; 9:26; 12:19, 20, 21, 15:44; Lk 8:42, 52, 53; 16:22; 20:28, 29, 31, 32, 36; Jn. 4:47, 49; 6:49, 50, 58; 8:21, 24, 52, 53; 11:14, 16, 21, 25, 26, 32, 37, 50, 51; 12:24, 33; 18:14, 32; 19:7; 21:23; Acts 7:4; 9:37; 21:13; 25:11; Ro 5:6, 7, 8, 15; 6:2, 7, 8, 9; 7:2, 3, 6, 10; 8:13, 34; 14:7, 8, 9, 15; 1Co. 8:11; 9:15; 15:3, 22, 31, 32, 36; 2Co. 5:14, 15; 6:9; Gal. 2:19, 21; Php 1:21; Col 2:20; 3:3; 1Th 4:14; 5:10; He 7:8; 9:27; 10:28; 11:4, 13, 21, 37; Jude 1:12; Re 3:2; 8:9, 11; 9:6; 14:13; 16:3
     
  8. Iconoclast

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    Anything else?
    Yes...look here;
    2289) (thanatoo from thanatos = death) means literally to kill, to cause to be put to death, to mortify, to give up to death, to condemn to death or to deliver over to death. And so in the NT some uses are literal (Mt 10:21, 26:59, 27:1, Mk 13:12, 14:55) and mean to cause cessation of life as by condemning to death or delivering/handing one over to be killed.

    In the context of Ro 8:13 Paul is using thanatoo in a figurative sense (metaphorical), meaning to mortify or subdue the evil desires and deeds that emanate from those desires. To reiterate, by using the present tensePaul is calling for a sustained effort on the part of believers to "search and destroy" these death dealing deeds. Remember that "death" speaks of separation so what a believer (enabled by the Spirit) is to do is to separate day by day, even moment by moment from the evil deeds of the fallen flesh nature. For example, if a man is tempted to look at pornography, he can plead in the Spirit "Turn away my eyes from looking at vanity, and revive me in Thy ways." (Ps 119:37-note, and he can put into practice Ps 101:3-note and the resolve of Job 31:1-note) In this life, we will never achieve perfection. Paul is not calling for perfection but direction! Is your lifestyle, your habitual practice, one of generally killing sin or is it one of sin generally killing you? The former direction is toward Heaven (by grace, unmerited favor); the latter is toward Hell, "for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die." (Ro 8:13) Do not lose heart beloved, but keep pressing on, and as the writer of Hebrews exhorts, "consider (aorist imperative = Don't delay! Do this now and do it effectively! Do it depending on the Spirit, for only He can enable us to successively keep this command! The verb is analogizomai and means to think or reason with thoroughness and completeness on) Him (Jesus - Heb 12:2-note, cp 1Pe 1:13-note) Who has endured such hostility by sinners against Himself, so that (Whenever you see this "purpose clause" pause and ponder and practice interrogating it) you may not grow weary (faint) and lose heart (become so tired and weary as to give out). 4 You have not yet resisted (stood in opposition against in line of battle, picturing an army set in line ready for battle) to the point of shedding blood in your striving (antagonizomai = struggling against, engaging in an intense struggle) against sin." (Heb 12:3-4-note).
     

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