Should churches withold Fed tax...

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Salty, Dec 10, 2007.

  1. Salty

    Salty
    Expand Collapse
    20,000 Posts Club
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2003
    Messages:
    22,085
    Likes Received:
    218
  2. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    All employers are required to withhold federal taxes. Churches are no different.
     
  3. LeBuick

    LeBuick
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2006
    Messages:
    11,537
    Likes Received:
    0
    I didn't know this. No taxes are with held from my support check but I do file and pay at the end of the year..
     
  4. Salty

    Salty
    Expand Collapse
    20,000 Posts Club
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2003
    Messages:
    22,085
    Likes Received:
    218
    If you are a pastor, it is beacuse the govt considers you an independent contractor. That also means you pay the full social security and medicad.
    (in an employer-employee relationship, the employer pays 1/2 of FICA and Medicade)

    Salty
     
  5. PK

    PK
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    0
    It all depends on if you think that God's house should be run like a buisness or not? Is Jesus the Lord of the New Testament Church or is president of the 501c3?
     
  6. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Pastors are not generally considered independent contractors by the IRS, though it can be complicated. The legal definition of an employee includes the pastor.

    If your church considers you an independent contractor and does not withhold taxes, they could be liable not only for taxes not withheld, but also for penalties.

    http://www.irs.gov/businesses/small/article/0,,id=99921,00.html
    http://www.elca.org/treasurer/congregations/relationship.html
    http://www.allbusiness.com/personal-finance/individual-taxes-tax-deductions/698801-1.html
     
  7. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Actually, it depends on whether or not you think Romans 13 is the command of God or an option that we can reject at our own discretion. Withholding taxes for clergy in no way compromises the lordship of Christ over the church. It rather demonstrates it, since our Lord commanded us to obey the government. If we refuse to withhold taxes appropriately, we have rejected the Lordship of Christ.
     
  8. PK

    PK
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2005
    Messages:
    216
    Likes Received:
    0
    I do not disagree with your statement in part. We (citizens) should pay taxes but not the church. I know, "Render unto Ceaser what is Ceaser's and to God what is God's", but when confronted with this question himself, Jesus did not tell Judas to pay out of the money bag but to go and get it out of the fishes mouth.
     
  9. tinytim

    tinytim
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/tim2.jpg>

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Messages:
    11,250
    Likes Received:
    0
    Witholding taxes through the year would help the pastor when it came time to file... He may even get a return...

    I trust H&R Block to do ours... I would go crazy if I didn't!!!
     
  10. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    The church is not paying taxes. The church is withholding taxes from the individual, and mailing them in on his behalf. It is how the government runs until tax time.

    Even with withholding, I still have to pay quarterly taxes in addition to what I have already paid through withholding.
     
  11. LeBuick

    LeBuick
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2006
    Messages:
    11,537
    Likes Received:
    0
    I think I will inquire about this because I have to save every year just to make the Apr 15th deadline. I've even had to file extentions because having to pay Fed, SS, Medicaid/care etc... It's tough...

    Does H&R charge much for this advise?
     
  12. Salty

    Salty
    Expand Collapse
    20,000 Posts Club
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2003
    Messages:
    22,085
    Likes Received:
    218
     
  13. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry
    Expand Collapse
    <b>Moderator</b>
    Moderator

    Joined:
    May 4, 2001
    Messages:
    21,763
    Likes Received:
    0
    Not only that, but if your church doesn't withhold, and you dont' pay estimated tax, or if your church doesn't withhold enough and you don't make it up through estimated tax payments each quarter you will be charged interest and penalties.
     
  14. tinytim

    tinytim
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/tim2.jpg>

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Messages:
    11,250
    Likes Received:
    0
    Honestly, I can't quote you a price... they take it out of my refund.
    I was taking my business to an accountant that only charged $35 to work up my taxes... but I couldn't get the instant refund... plus we moved half a state away!! lol
    I have been blessed enough to not have to pay... because of the Earned income credit has always been enough to offset the taxes I owe...

    But I am dreading the yr all my kids turn 18...
    Not only will I have to pay taxes but college tuition as well!!!

    Even so, come Lord Jesus come... QUICKLY!!!!
     
  15. annsni

    annsni
    Expand Collapse
    Administrator
    Administrator

    Joined:
    May 30, 2006
    Messages:
    20,159
    Likes Received:
    368
    LOL - We're at this point in life Tim and it's NOT fun.

    Our church does the withholding and now as DH being a full time pastor with 4 kids, we get it all back at the end of the year. LOL! It's a nice bonus to help pay off the home equity line of credit. :)
     
  16. tinytim

    tinytim
    Expand Collapse
    <img src =/tim2.jpg>

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Messages:
    11,250
    Likes Received:
    0
    Some churches give the Pastor a Social Security Offset... a little extra that is designated to help pay his taxes...
    I am not sure how it works, or if it is taxable... I think it is.. .but I remember one church gave the pastor I think it was $2500 to offset his taxes...
     
  17. rbell

    rbell
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    That is taxable $$.
     

Share This Page

Loading...