So Nice To Be Consistently Unethically Inconsistent

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by gb93433, Jan 22, 2007.

  1. gb93433

    gb93433
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    http://www.bpnews.net/bpnews.asp?ID=24815

    Newspaper reports tenure refusal for Southwestern woman prof

    By Staff
    Jan 22, 2007

    FORT WORTH, Texas (BP)—A woman who had held a tenure-track position was denied tenure at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in 2004, according to a Jan. 19 Dallas Morning News story.

    The professor, Sheri Klouda, was given a tenure-track position to teach Hebrew in Southwestern’s school of theology when she received her Ph.D. at the Fort Worth, Texas, campus in 2002, according to the newspaper report.

    Klouda, who also is a Criswell College graduate, now teaches at Taylor University in Indiana.

    Van McClain, chairman of Southwestern’s board of trustees, told the Dallas Morning News that the seminary has returned to its "traditional, confessional and biblical position" that a woman should not instruct men in theology courses or in biblical languages.

    McClain said the seminary was gracious to Klouda as she looked for a teaching position at another school. "The administration ... allowed her to teach a full two years after she was told that she would not have tenure," McClain told the newspaper, “... and the seminary even agreed to continue her support after her teaching responsibilities were over, so her family would have financial support. The seminary went far beyond anything that could be expressed as its duty or responsibility."

    McClain also told the newspaper, "I do not know of any women teaching in any of the SBC seminaries presently in the area of theology or biblical languages. In my estimation all of the seminaries have sought to be more consistent with most Southern Baptists' understanding of Scripture on the matter."

    Patterson declined comment on the issue, the newspaper said.

    Klouda, contacted by the newspaper, said, "I don't think it was right to hire me to do this job, to put me in the position where I, in good faith, assumed that I was working toward tenure, and then suddenly remove me without any cause other than gender."

    When Klouda was hired for the tenure-track position in 2002, Ken Hemphill was the seminary’s president. At that time, "There was not a policy where [women] would not be able to teach church history or the [biblical] languages," Hemphill told the newspaper. Hemphill resigned as Southwestern’s president in 2003 and Patterson was selected by the trustees as his successor.

    The newspaper noted that Patterson’s wife Dorothy continues to teach in Southwestern’s school of theology, with McClain explaining that she teaches courses in women's studies that are attended only by women.

    The newspaper centered much of its coverage on issues raised in a weblog by Oklahoma pastor Wade Burleson who challenged Klouda’s departure from Southwestern.

    “Sheri Klouda is not a pastor, she has not been ordained or licensed, she does not perform ministerial duties,” Burleson told the newspaper. “... The same institution that conferred her degree and hired her has now removed her for gender. To me, that is a very serious, ethical, moral breach.” Burleson is pastor of Emmanual Baptist Church in Enid, Okla., and a trustee of the International Mission Board.

    Compiled by Art Toalston.
     
  2. menageriekeeper

    menageriekeeper
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    ??? Someone is going to have to explain to me what the problem is with a woman teaching a language and also how a language becomes a Biblical language and what that even has to do with spiritual authority.

    Please?
     
  3. preachinjesus

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    I was there when this happened. I had Dr. Klouda as a prof. She is WORLD CLASS.

    This whole thing sickens me to the core. The administration "released" her while her husband was in the deep bouts of cancer and cut all her medical coverage.

    Dr. Sheri Klouda is an outstanding Christian and any high credit to institution where she serves.

    While at SWBTS she was one of the two top Hebrew professors. A passionate educator and fine classroom technician. I took Dr. Klein as well and he spoke highly her and her abilities. He too is a fine Christian educator whom I am lucky enough to sat under his tutelage.

    What has happened to her, Dr Karen Bullock, and other female and dissenting professors at SWBTS and other SBC seminaries is both unethical and, frankly, less than authentically Christian.

    Regardless of your view on whether or not women should be teaching men, we are Christians and how we treat people in need speaks volumes for our witness for Christ.

    I'm glad we're having this conversation so more will know about this tragedy.
     
    #3 preachinjesus, Jan 22, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 22, 2007
  4. gb93433

    gb93433
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    What they are doing through their lack of love clearly shows the world that they do not love one another and God is not among them.

    What Patterson did was unethical. Patterson is confused and does not know right from wrong many times. He is worldly and does not know it. He enjoys having a martyr complex and is proud of it. So many credit him with turning around the SBC but the fact is that it was the professors at SWBTS long before anyone knew who he was who had the conviction that something needed to be done. It is obvious that while Patterson lives lavishly and with plenty of money he chose to take the low road and not to compensate Klouda financially for any wrong that was done to her. Why should that surprise us when the trustees are many of the same people who lied when Dilday was fired. At the time Dr. Dilday was fired the chairman of the trustees was also shacking up with two ladies in his congregation. The trustees lied because they did not want to be invaded by the media. They got exactly what they did not want.
    Patterson has been good at manipulating people and getting what he wants. He persuaded the trustees to add onto the president’s home while there are students who would love to just have a bicycle. He brags about his trophy animals while people in those same countries hardly have enough to eat and walk everywhere they go. Servant leaders elevate others by serving them and putting them first. We do not see that in Patterson. If he needed more rom for all of his books then why did he not donate them to a library so they could be used by students and not just him.

    When someone knows the truth about what the trustees and Patterson has done just smacks of lies, manipulation and lack of ethics. Isn't it amazing how many of the IMB trustees wanted to remove Burleson from his position because of openly telling the truth? Why would they have so much to hide?

    Those who have nothing to hide, hide nothing.
     
  5. Tom Bryant

    Tom Bryant
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    Preaching Jesus - Thanks for your perspective. Patterson makes a mess of most everything he tries, but he keeps failing upwardly.
     
  6. gb93433

    gb93433
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    That is because people will usually follow someone who seems to know where they are going even if it is wrong. Most people do not try to verify what has been said. Why do you think we have so many false teachers on TV? Often even the world sees through the nonsense. They often check their brains at the door and let themselves be controlled by someone else.

    When I was pastoring I often heard people after a sermon tell me to just tell them what they need to know. Most often that happened after I would lead them through steps on how I arrived at what I told them.
     
  7. Martin

    Martin
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    ==I love how this rather lame excuse is dragged out every now and then to justify such actions. The fact is that the Bible says nothing about women teaching men Biblical languages or theology outside of the church. The passages this McClain gentlement would reference are refering to the church, not a school. Southwestern's actions, if based on the above "excuse", are unBiblical.
     
  8. Martin

    Martin
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    Totally off topic but I believe that hunting for "sport" is immoral. It is a violation of the duty God gave humanity in the garden. Hunting and farming for food, or resources, is fine but not hunting for sport. When I was at Southeastern I had a chance to visit in Dr Patterson's office. It was freaky. All of those dead eyes staring at you from his wall. Made me nervous.
     
  9. Predestined

    Predestined
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    I have no words.
     
  10. preachinjesus

    preachinjesus
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    I'll suggest that Dr. Patterson did help with the turn around of the SBC as a whole and Southeastern Seminary specifically. I appreciate his commitments to biblicism and missions.

    One thing to mention before I continue I'll also say that I have seen when a fellow student and friend of mine was killed in Iraq while serving with the IMB (several other missionaries died in this incident.) I went to the chapel service and very much appreciated Dr. Patterson's personal passion and love for his students that he expressed in that service. We can disagree, heartily, about many administrative choices and so forth...but before the assembly I'm more than happy to stand up and give a good testimony for his heart for the nations and for those being trained at his seminaries.

    While at SWBTS I there during the regime change and was deeply troubled, along with other classmates, with the massive additions onto the mansion. We were simply dismayed that several of our mutual friends were eating ramen and sharing textbooks while this massive $100k plus project was going on in plain site. I ust think we could have been better stewards.

    While I disagree with the fiscal positioning in building this new addition, I do understand a man wanting to have his personal library available to only him. For what it's worth I sympathize at that point...but I have a massive library and have some of it in storage as we speak and don't want it in widespread cirrculation.

    There is something to be said for transparency and honesty in leadership. I think the SBC is going through a crisis that parrallels the Congressional Republicans since their takeover in '92. The Repubs squandered their majority and got to work not for the American people but to pilfer the treasury and line their pockets and their friends' pockets. They held onto power and didn't listen to the electorate. They initially took on reform, then became the party needing reform the most. The parrallels are astounding. From the NAMB situation, to Bro. Burleson's dilemmas, etc. there is much that should happen.

    I still say we should sell off all the denominational, move into less than lavish accomodations and put all the profit into missions and missionaries.

    I'm still glad that word about this travesty is getting out. Dr. Klouda is a fine person and educator. We lost much when she was "released."
     
  11. rbell

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    Southwestern sends me requests for money monthly. After the Presidential Biltmore Mansion was upgraded to the Taj Mahal, (especially considering the squalid seminary-owned rodent-infested dump we lived in) I no longer throw those "requests" away.

    I sent the postage-paid envelope back this time, with a letter expressing my concerns over their apparent lack of stewardship.

    I doubt anyone ever read my letter.
     
  12. gb93433

    gb93433
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    A man demonstrates his love not so much by what he says but by what he does. His actions and what he does with his wallet demonstrates his real heart.

    Sometime ask was the last registrar was removed when he called them on their substandard academics.
     
    #12 gb93433, Jan 24, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 24, 2007
  13. DQuixote

    DQuixote
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    Tragic. Beyond words.
     
  14. Jhaerlyn

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    I like the title of the thread :)

    it's something that has been consistent with the Southern Baptist association, if you consider it's policy towards Slavery and the expansion into Native-owned lands .... It's hard for me to comprehend how people with such a clear vision of Christ's word( and we know they had it by their actions in other areas of life) could ignore the countries actions against the Native Nations and SUPPORT the abuse and denegration of African Slaves, both foreign and American Born.


    So, seeing how we were able to "justify" those horrors, how difficult can it be to convince yourself that a woman shouldn't teach Hebrew, despite her claims on you as her "boss"?
     
  15. DQuixote

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    I'd prefer the SBC establish K thru Junior College for our youngsters. Open up all those buildings and all our local church buildings to educate our kids, using volunteer staff & teachers. Get them out of the horrible public school system. If we don't, we'll raise generations who have zero interest in missions.
     
  16. gb93433

    gb93433
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    You would be surprised at how many I shared my faith with when I was a young student who were members of Baptist churches and not Christians.

    So are you saying that there is more evangelism and discipleship going on as the result of Christian schools than at the secular schools and universities.

    If you believe that then take a trip to a university where they have a group of Navigators and see how the Christian colleges compare to their committment. Personally when I pastored I saw a lot of weak babies in the church while young people at the secular universities were sharing their faith and discipling people.

    Form my college days I do not know of one person who was in the Navigators stray from their faith while I have seen pastors and others who grew up in the church stray or completely leave the faith.

    All you would have to do to answer your position is to ask yourself if the Christians are stronger in countries where the Christians are persecuted or where life is easy.
     
  17. Scarlett O.

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    Speaking as one of those who teaches for the "horrible public school system" who is "raising generations not to believe in missions"....

    ....we are not all spawns of the devil. Just some of us. :rolleyes:
     
  18. preachinjesus

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    well the ATS (Association of Theological Schools...the accreditation body that works with Southwestern) has had a formal complaint about this whole business. Sadly this complaint came from neither a current professor or Dr. Klouda herself...but from a part time student who probably should have no business filing the complaint imho.

    We'll see how this works out, though I wish the complaint would have been filed by two of the above sources (particularly since I know several faculty that were appaulled about this series of events), and hope that this never again happens to a fine educator who is beloved by her students.

    And let us not forget that this also happened to Dr. Karen Bullock just a mere 6 months before Dr. Sheri Klouda. Both were two of the finest profs I had at Southwestern.
     
  19. preachinjesus

    preachinjesus
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    I mean no offense to you personally when I say but this is exactly the kind of reasoning that is suffocating Christianity in our current generation.

    We need to be fully plugged into society and not shrinking back into our holy huddles. The church isn't for Christians so we can never be involved society, but it is to equip us as we are going to reach everyone with the peace of the Gospel and so we can continually commission ourselves to reach everyone all the time.

    Again no offense, this is a different mindset for ministry I guess. Also I disagree that our public schools are horrible...rather I find most of them better than any Christian school I've ever heard of. Blessings on your journey.
     
  20. gb93433

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    The fact is that in some states some of the students who have been kicked out of the public schol end up in the Christian school because they are not welcomed anywhere else.
     

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