Sports …an important part of education?

Discussion in 'Health and Wellness' started by Benjamin, Mar 19, 2010.

  1. Benjamin

    Benjamin
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    Agree!


    We had a very devoted coach in elementary school that by his strong efforts to involve all the children in sports changed many lives. Yes, he did fix many who said, “I can’t, or I’m not able to” or in your case, “I was a complete dork, and there was no hope in my ever exceeding into un-dorkness.” :smilewinkgrin: The evidence to the contrary is that our school was wining way beyond our share of district and state competitions with the very same students who started out saying such and who “learned” that pushing themselves beyond what they thought they could do did pay off.



    The schools should do this as part of overall education, many children would no more take the initiative to enter something as important as athleticism on their own than they would than they would a spelling bee. Physical education is far too important to cast off as an elective, it should be a core curriculum, and competitive events/sports are both a measure and a motivator to work hard and excel.



    Then IMO your outlook amounts to allowing children to be lightweights, to just go through a few basic motions during PE on how to do a few jumping-jacks or something, never having the motivation to push themselves to achieve a higher level of fitness. No homework/physical training to actually achieve the knowledge and understanding of how hard exercise pays off, just get through a preliminary class and duck the rest.



    You mean throw out the baby with the bath water? We have “pay to play” which IMO amounts to “pay to learn” ...and what I’m seeing here as a root is a fundamental difference between us in the value of the importance of actually “learning” and being pushed into excelling in physical fitness.



    You are sooo mistaken here in your assessment of the value excelling physical fitness and wellness in education! Let me start with a list:

    1) A healthier body means a healthier mind, they’re related.

    2) Nothing! Compares to the learning experience of child gasping for breath, thinking they can go no further, wanting to give up and saying “I can’t” but to end up finding out that they went a little further, dug a little deeper, and made it because THEY TRIED ANYWAY.

    3) Employment benefits?! Physical fitness shines right through to present a person that is active, energetic and motivated; what do you think an employer is looking for?

    4) Have you never seen the studies of how attractive and physically fit people get better jobs, more pay, respect, etc…?

    5) BENEFIT? “Learning” to excel at sports will benefit one throughout his/her entire life, in everything they do. They learn about the benefits of the hard work exercise and training paying off. They will have more energy, less illness, feel better, look better, live longer, and have a much better chance of remaining mobile and active during their retirement years.

    6) The blood, sweat and tears it takes to “EARN” a right to claim and be part of a victory in ones life is unmatched in getting an “A” on a test in comparison for a learning experience.

    7) Who is an employer going to hire first as a physical therapist in the medical field, an overweight, out of shape, bad postured, tired looking 25 year old that obviously never learned the value and methods to achieve physical fitness for theirself, or an in shape…RIPPED! :D...50 year old??? :laugh:
     
  2. matt wade

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    Totally disagree with everything you are saying. School is for academics. There are plenty of opportunities for kids to play sports. School time, money, and resources should not be wasted on athletics.
     
  3. Salty

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    But you do need a healthy body for a healty mind. A child does need recess during the day. And organized activities will help him socially as well.

    My problem is the excessive emphasis on inter-scholastic sports - ie state champs, ect. Do we see the same amount of coverage for science fairs, spelling bees, and other academic activities?
     
  4. matt wade

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    Yes, there is a difference between recess and athletics. Athletics have no place in school. Yes, kids should get a 45-60 minute break in the day to run around and have fun.
     
  5. padredurand

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    Oh, Matt, you are so wrong. :laugh: If you were to eliminate athletics from schools underachieving parents would have no outlet to live vicariously through their children. Without athletics parents might have to spend time with their children instead of dropping them off at practice. :tongue3:

    One local high school basketball team just finished their season today by losing in a state level semi-final. They started playing in December. Practice started in September. They practiced every week night from 4:30 to 7:00. Two or three nights a week they had games that ran until 9:00 pm. As the regular season ended and it was apparent they were heading for the post-season the team started to practice on Saturday and Sunday. (Oops, I forgot the tournament while school was on break around Christmas) They played at least four games during normal school hours.

    In spite of 35 years of rabid basketball fanaticism, this school has never produced a championship nor has it sent a player on to a Division I college as an athlete. It has created an atmosphere that basketball is more important than family time, vacations, supper, homework and a social life. It has also filled the stands with maniacal parents and grandparents that drive and push their kids to perform on the basketball court. I watched a father dress down his daughter during a game. He said some things to her that would make any reasonable parent ashamed. Why every 14 year old girl ought to know not to embarrass her father at the local HS gym. 20 years ago he was a bench warming wannabe. He demanded his daughter achieve something he was not able to do himself.
     
  6. matt wade

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    Padre your heart warming story has made me see the error of my ways.

    Benjamin, I do believe we need more of this in our schools! Please, let's forget that I ever said athletics don't belong in schools.

    :laugh:
     
  7. Revmitchell

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    In all things moderation. It is not necessary to completely end sports in schools just because it is being abused by some. Such is just an excuse to do what one wants regardless of the facts.
     
  8. matt wade

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    So, you are OK with your tax dollars being spent on kids to play sports? I'm not real keen on my tax dollars going to public education, let alone kids playing sports.
     
  9. Revmitchell

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    On the federal level no. It is unnecessary and unconstitutional. On the local level I have no problem with it in moderation. The lessons learned in sports go beyond the mechanics of the individual sport.
     
  10. matt wade

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    Well, we can agree to disagree. I don't believe any tax dollars should be spent on education. Not at the federal, state, city, county, or any other level.

    I believe in community education, but I believe that it should be done by a group of private individuals (made up of parents and other concerned community members) pitching in to educate their children. Once the government forces people to pay for other people's education we have a problem.
     
  11. Salty

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    I totally agree with RM! As i said before, there is no need to have State Championships. Here in NY, Syracuse is generally considered the center of the State. If State championship are held here, it could take 6 - 8 hours for some teams to arrive in the Salt City. And if you travel that far, you prob ally will need to arrive the day before, so that ends up being a three day trip. ( + expenses)

    If the travel time in NY is bad, think what it would be like in Texas, or Calif!

    And as Padre said, there were practices on Sat and Sunday -

    Moderation is the key.
     
  12. Benjamin

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    Okay, that’s fine that you disagree, ah, but you didn’t address the points?



    Academics relates to education, sports is an important part of formal training in the art of physical fitness.


    Which opportunities are/would be ignored for the large part by a society who does not take the responsibility to curb a growing rate of childhood obesity which is totally out of control. Sports should be a mandatory part of scholastic education for a healthier society.



    You have offered no evidence that athletics is a waste while having neglected the issues of benefits.
     
  13. Benjamin

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    A rhetorical and extravagant overstatement, exaggerated for effect, leading to a false dilemma that amounts to a perfectionist fallacy. With a horse laugh at the end? Is that all you got?
     
  14. Benjamin

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    Yes, they do, sports offer many important life lessons that help develop character, enforces commitment, provides team spirit, teaches one to strive for goals and to actually realize physical fitness achievements.
     
  15. Salty

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    When I was a professional driving instructor, I found that across the board, athletes and those who played in the band were better drivers. My theory is that they were well disciplined.

    There was one big problem. When I went to schedule a road test, I would often try to get a 2 or 3 pm test, so they wouldn't miss (much) school. But when I did that I had football players tell me that if they missed practiced, they could not play in the Friday night game. So I ended up having to schedule a 9 am test - which meant they missed most of the morning classes :tear:

    Salty

    last test of the day was 4 pm and none on Sat (might have had something to do with the state union)
     
    #15 Salty, Mar 20, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 20, 2010
  16. mcdirector

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    I've never been a huge fan of school sports, mainly because students missed a lot of class AND I got pressured by coaches whining for poor students/good athletes during the various seasons. BUT I've not been an opponent either.

    However, I heard an administrator talking to a student about sports in secondary schools and she made a good point. Sports keeps some students in school who would otherwise drop out because they care about the sports and not their educations. They keep up with the education to continue to play. Gave me some food for thought.

    Although, I do not want the kids being taken out of class for sporting events. Schedule them some other time please. It is nearly impossible to get them back into the room for the lessons missed.
     
  17. padredurand

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    Moderation. There is only one problem with this answer. How does it get implemented? I'm not talking about the multi-billion dollar industry we call collegiate athletics. I'm talking about local school districts that start priming the pump in the fourth grade in order to groom teams eight years down the road. Our district has them. They've existed so long that the programs are untouchable when it comes to budget cuts. I have attended school board meetings where the same parents called the purchase of new computer equipment for classrooms unnecessary and cutting the position of a modified (5&6th grade) sports coach damaging to the education of his children.

    Purely anecdotal but I believe this student's perspective is typical. We have a young lady in our church who runs her parents ragged. The girl is on the swim team at school. There are very few schools in this area with swimming pools so you can count on at least 3 hours of travel on swim meet nights. She is a diver. In spite of her being as graceful as a brick her folks drive her 75 miles one way every Sunday afternoon for private diving lessons. She is also in marching band, chorus and band. She posted on Facebook last week that she had been suspended from swim team for one week because her English grades had dropped below the threshold. She said that she was doing endless worksheets on verbs instead of fun stuff and concluded, "English? Ptttt! When will I ever use this stuff?" Yes, that is a direct quote from her post! Honey, you speak English!

    Somewhere along the way we forgot the primary purpose of school was academics. Never once, in the days when I was hiring folks for the businesses I managed, did I ask a potential employee if they could play a stick or ball sport. I didn't need employees that held single season rushing records. I needed ones who could write cohesive sentences and perform simple math.

    Moderation? It does not exist in high school sports. Google Massillon Tigers (Ohio) and see how many hits you get.

     
  18. Benjamin

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    Sports can also often be a motivating factor for kids to try harder in school because they “do” have to make the grades to play. Not all coaches are buffoons that only get hyper about what grades the teacher will give so their star player can play, but I believe most coaches emphasize to “all” the players to make sure they keep up on their studies whether they are the star or not.

    As for the extra time spent, or time away from school, a little added responsibility on a kid to make sure he/she gets the assignments and uses his/her time wisely to make all ends meet will be good experience for later in life. Often the most devoted players are also straight “A” students, or become that way, because of the discipline they learn from the parents, teachers and coaches who help guide them through these challenges.

    Ahh, the poor parents that have to put forth more time to help their busy and active child achieve the above and beyond! Might have to actually get off the couch and sacrifice some of that "family time" to help their child be an achiever. Or worse yet, have a few of their tax dollars go for someone else's kid so that they can learn the value of working hard for physical fitness, developing a competitive nature, and reaching a higher degree of achievement.
     
  19. Revmitchell

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    It get's implemented the same way moderation gets implemented in anything else. Desire and reason. Just because there are abuses is not evidence that the subject is wrong or needs to be axed. Such is an over reaction.
     
  20. matt wade

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