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Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by Revmitchell, Oct 20, 2015.
Doesn't seem they were all that interested in remaining a member.
Can't see anything wrong with the decision.
Do we follow the traditions of Men or scripture... If Timothy 3:1-7 was not in the Bible then there might be cause for argumentation... Since it is, it is a closed matter... The husband of one wife closes the matter as that is one of the qualifications of a Bishop... Women will be ordained but again it's not scriptural and will split many a church... And we know who is behind scattering the children of God... Yeah! Hath God said?... Brother Glen
Eh, much to do about nothing. Hadn't financially supported the association in six years, didn't even have elected messengers.
Wish the new pastor and church all the best in their new direction.
I used to actively pursue this subject (by that I mean I sought out women pastors and those who supported them). I had every argument down pat. I used Greek and Hebrew, pointing out that the Prophetess Deborah was to shame the cowardice men of Israel at the time (both in ministry and in the military). How Priscilla and Acquila may have been a team consisting of minister and hostess (which is a ministry of deacons). That Junia was outstanding among the apostles was merely the estimate of the apostles regarding her and not saying she was herself an apostle. Then I proceeded to point out that the spirit of Jezebel in Revelation deceived her followers by her teaching meant by the fact that it was a woman doing the teaching...
Then the Holy Spirit collared me. "Then it would be better that the Gospel message did not get out at all if it meant that women would teach or usurp authority over men?"
I was undone.
He was right. I was wrong. Every time there was shortfall of males (for whatever reason) God sent women. Deborah, the woman at the well, the women who discovered the empty tomb, Rhoda who saw Peter released from prison...
Then it began to come clear to me that Christianity suffers from an identity crisis mainly due to the fact that most believers buy into the unbiblical division of clergy and laity. We are ALL called to be priests before God in the New Covenant. The division of clergy and laity was Old Covenant after what happened in Exodus 32. In Exodus 19:6 God intended all Israel to be a kingdom of priests. But they blew it in the wilderness so badly that 3,000 people were slaughtered at the LORD's command. Never underestimate what happened there. And learn from the example that sin is to be avoided if for no other reason there are times when God is trying to make an important point and to be caught in sin at that moment is to draw severe judgment. Like when Moses was strickened from leading the people into the Holy Land for striking the rock twice. God was making a prophetic example that Moses blew. The rock was symbolic of Jesus who would be struck (crucified) only once.
1 Peter 2:3–9 (AV)
3 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord is gracious.
4 To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,
5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.
6 Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.
7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,
8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.
9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
The Greek version of the Hebrew kingdom of priests:
Revelation 1:6 (AV)
6 And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Revelation 5:10 (AV)
10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
Estimates are that there are some 1 billion Christians on earth. There is nowhere near that many people in Christian ministry. So as long as we are in such a shortfall, we haven't the moral grounds to give grief to women pastors. And if we cannot abide them then we ought to step up into the pastorate ourselves fellows!
Many times in scripture the Woman... Virgin... Bride... Chaste is representative of the church... The church is the bride and the bridegroom is Christ... The Apostate Church is also representative of a Woman... Whore, Jezebel and the daughters of a whore, unchaste and any other designation you might want to add of a fallen woman... So if the bride usurps the authority of the bridegroom who is Christ what women is she?... Brother Glen
The number of Christians in the world has nothing to do with who God calls to be pastor. There is no division between laity and pastors. Not sure where people get this stuff from.
I have two grown-up daughters and have educated them extensively and expensively. I have encouraged them to take on any honourable profession they wish, be it doctor, lawyer, teacher, politician. But preaching and pastoring have been reserved by God for men. Women preaching in churches does not lead to a malaise, it is the sign of that malaise- that the church or denomination in question has already departed from the word of God.
'Sir, a woman preaching is like a dog walking on its hinder legs. It is not done well, but you are surprised to see it done at all' (Dr. Samuel Johnson).
Hopefully this sheds a little more light on the situation. IMO, it was handled the only way it could be handled.
Absolutely. When this issue arises, I always ask are there any men in the congregation or is the woman trying to pastor have a husband?
God is a God of ORDER.
He doesn't create confusion. Man's opinion does.
God HAS NOT called a man to be head of his household( in which his wife submits to him) to turn around and go to God's house and be in submission to his wife. That's just crazy. And again, God does NOT author confusion.
He may not be the author of confusion, but how do we explain you and your views? I know he doesn't make mistakes, but then there's you?
Just kidding with you but you did leave yourself open for the above. God loves us all, and He used women throughput the old and new testaments. So if you don't like women preachers, you can simply not attend that church. Just don't judge the message based on hormonal make up, or DNA!
You're liberal side is showing on this Dude. We all know you have no problem with divorced pastors and now you think women pastors are OK too? Typical California liberal.
God has used women greatly all through the history of His kingdom - but not once did He install one as a spiritual leader of the church. That His word clearly gives us the qualifications for a pastor/elder and that includes being a man. Yes, women are able to be pastors - when we disobey the word of God. For those God has gifted greatly in this area, women don't have to sit at home disregarding these gifts but there are a GREAT number of positions women can hold without holding the title of pastor. I'm grateful for those women in my life who have been a mentor/teacher to me and I have learned so much from them.
I remember this line from a movie I saw... A mother was talking to her daughter before she got married... Remember dear the Mother said the Man is the head of the family but she said the Woman is the neck that turns the head... Which bears this question and then I will bow out of this discussion... What neck or necks turned what head or heads... Remember King Solomon?... Brother Glen
I see your point on divorced men and the role of pastor. Divorce is SIN.However, I think that we both agree that a sin confessed is a sin forgiven. And if that premise is followed, then a remorseful man of God can be forgiven and restored to the role of pastor.
As for a woman, if the church is willing to allow them to teach their children and youth, but deny them the opportunity to serve as a pastor, then that seems a little hypocritical.
A remorseful and restored man of God should go back and be reconciled to his wife if she is alive.
12But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. 1 Tim. 2:12 Clearly says MAN and not boys or children.
That's kind of tough to do if the ex spouse is remarried.
It is a closed case issue when one considers there were no female pastors in the New Testament.