The basis of God's choice

To quote Dr. Bob,

"Jesus knows me, this I love"

 

I understand your point brother. I will make a statement to your post and also a correction to my previous post to you about 'No Arminian'.
The Correction First:
I should have stated No Reformed Arminian (historical) Arminian nor historic Wesleyian not just all Arminians in general. However there are other forms that I acknowledge do believe that man is some way or other does in fact 'deserve' to some degree.

The statement to your post:
I think Web is right in that the word 'deserve' isn't a good one to use here.
Many/Most don't believe they 'deserve' the opportunity based upon them or what they have done but believe the 'deserving', as you state it, is based upon God's promises to allow all men to the opportunity to believe or reject. It is for this reason the word 'deserve' does not accurately convey the meaning that is being expressed and can be somewhat misunderstood if used in this way.

May the Lord our God richly bless you Archangel :godisgood:

 

100% wrong. Nowhere in scripture does it ever say that a man is regenerated by the Holy Spirit to have the ability to believe.

Man did not lose the abililty to believe God in the garden of Eden as Calvinsim teaches. God did not curse man's moral nature. And you will not find this curse anywhere in scripture.

As for the verses shown from Romans, those were verses taken from both Psalms 14 and 53. It is not speaking of all men, and the Jews to whom Paul preached knew this. I will show you.

Psa 14:1 [To the chief Musician, A Psalm of David.] The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.
2 The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God.
3 They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.
4 Have all the workers of iniquity no knowledge? who eat up my people as they eat bread, and call not upon the LORD.
5 There were they in great fear: for God is in the generation of the righteous.
6 Ye have shamed the counsel of the poor, because the LORD is his refuge.
7 Oh that the salvation of Israel were come out of Zion! when the LORD bringeth back the captivity of his people, Jacob shall rejoice, and Israel shall be glad.

God is speaking of the wicked here, men who have rejected God. But he is not speaking of all men as shown in verse 4 where he refers to "my people". And in verse 6 he speaks of the poor whom seek refuge in the Lord. In vs. 7 he speaks of "his people".

And you can see this throughout the Psalms, the scriptures are always contrasting those who are wicked verses those who trust in God. It is never saying that 100% of men are wicked.

Psa 10:1 Why standest thou afar off, O LORD? why hidest thou thyself in times of trouble?
2 The wicked in his pride doth persecute the poor: let them be taken in the devices that they have imagined.
3 For the wicked boasteth of his heart's desire, and blesseth the covetous, whom the LORD abhorreth.
4 The wicked, through the pride of his countenance, will not seek after God: God is not in all his thoughts.
5 His ways are always grievous; thy judgments are far above out of his sight: as for all his enemies, he puffeth at them.
6 He hath said in his heart, I shall not be moved: for I shall never be in adversity.
7 His mouth is full of cursing and deceit and fraud: under his tongue is mischief and vanity.
8 He sitteth in the lurking places of the villages: in the secret places doth he murder the innocent: his eyes are privily set against the poor.
9 He lieth in wait secretly as a lion in his den: he lieth in wait to catch the poor: he doth catch the poor, when he draweth him into his net.
10 He croucheth, and humbleth himself, that the poor may fall by his strong ones.
11 He hath said in his heart, God hath forgotten: he hideth his face; he will never see it.
12 Arise, O LORD; O God, lift up thine hand: forget not the humble.
13 Wherefore doth the wicked contemn God? he hath said in his heart, Thou wilt not require it.
14 Thou hast seen it; for thou beholdest mischief and spite, to requite it with thy hand: the poor committeth himself unto thee; thou art the helper of the fatherless.
15 Break thou the arm of the wicked and the evil man: seek out his wickedness till thou find none.
16 The LORD is King for ever and ever: the heathen are perished out of his land.
17 LORD, thou hast heard the desire of the humble: thou wilt prepare their heart, thou wilt cause thine ear to hear:
18 To judge the fatherless and the oppressed, that the man of the earth may no more oppress.

Paul was not speaking of all men when he said none is righteous in Romans. He was quoting Psalms 14 & 53 which the Jews he was preaching to were very familiar. These Psalms contrast the rich and wealthy especially, those who take advantage of and exploit the poor especially. The Psalms show those who were afflicted and exploited by these wicked men trust God and seek him as refuge. This theme is shown dozens of times throughout the Psalms especially, but the Lord himself preached this.

Matt 5:3 Blessed are the poor in spirit: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
4 Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted.
5 Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth.
6 Blessed are they which do hunger and thirst after righteousness: for they shall be filled.

The doctrine of Total Depravity as Calvinists teach it is error. Yes, all men are sinners, but man is not so morally depraved that he cannot seek after God, and the scriptures show that men do seek after God. I have posted several examples, the rich young ruler being a great example, because he went away unsaved, which proves he was not regenerated to desire and seek God, which he plainly did.

Calvinists pull scripture out of context to attempt to prove their doctrine. In Romans, Paul spoke of those who seek God.

Rom 2:7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;
10 But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:

You cannot overlook these verses. Paul was never saying that 100% of mankind is utterly wicked and never seeks God.

 

Sure it does Winman! In your self righteousness you simply refuse to believe them!

Total depravity does not mean that mankind is utterly wicked. It simply says that man of his own accord will not seek God. Allah perhaps but not God!