The Bride of Christ

I know this will come as no great shock to you, but I would disagree with your assessment. But more importantly the Scripture disagrees with you .

If "everyone" who is a part of the body of Christ also became the bride of Christ then there would be no need for the judgment seat of Christ. That would mean that everyone would rule and reign with Christ in His coming kingdom. Neither of which are true.

The OT types tell us that only a portion of the body becomes the bride. You can see this in Adam and Eve, Isaac and Rebekah and Ruth and Orpah.

You can also see this truth in the NT as well in that many are headed to destruction and only a few will find life. That's written to and for believers not unbelievers.

Saying that everyone will become the bride of Christ and that everyone will rule and reign with Christ is merely repeating the age-old lie yea God has not said you will surely die, but just given it a different vernacular.

 

1. Does everyone here understand that there is ony ONE Gospel -- not two?

2. Does everyone here understand that the saints are saved by Grace through faith - in ALL ages - not just in the NT??

3. Does everyone here understand that the OT saints that are upheld as examples for the NT saints in Heb 11 gained acceptance with God through faith "for apart from faith it is impossible to please Him"?

The "DEAD in CHRIST" listed in 1thess 4 are therefore the saints of all ages.

The saints raised in Matt 27 at the resurrection of Christ are from among the OT saints who were all "saved by grace through faith" - there is no other way.

the saints standing with CHRIST pre-cross in Matt 17 (Moses and Elijah) were BOTH saved by grace through faith -- that was the ONLY Gospel anyone has ever had.

Is this clear to all- or do some imagine "another gospel"??

hint - in the NT -- Israel is NEVER depicted as "the harlot" or the "unfaithful bride of Christ" and Romans 9 and 11 show us why that is.

in Christ,

Bob

 

Bob I'm not sure how you can make this statement since you preach a works-based plan of eternal salvation. Any time everlasting life is conditional that is adding works into the mix.

And I'm not really sure what your post had to do with the discussion :laugh:.

 

Steaver to be perfectly honest I don't even know what Scripture you used. I read your first sentence and that was enough to know that whatever you followed that with was going to be untruth, so I'm not sure whether you have taken the Scripture out of context or misinterpreted it, but I know it's one or the other and I gave you three examples from the OT alone that shows us not everyone in the body is going to make up the bride. And I gave you at least one text in the NT. I think it was just one anyway.

But I don't suspect you will believe what I have posted any more than you have in the past. I just wanted those that read to have the whole council of God and not just the bits and pieces will clip out to use as "proof" texts.

The Biblical Truth of the matter is not every saved individual is going to make up the bride.

I would just ask this one thing of your theology . . . do you have some OT types that show that every saved individual will make up the bride?

 

you use that made-up rule as a "filter" for reading the bible and bending texts about salvation AWAY from their obvious intent. Why do you think such a made-up rule would be accepted by anyone else?

in Christ,

Bob

 

Another totally illogical - "made up" conclusion!!

The fact is that in scripture there is no division between the body of Christ and the bride of Christ. In Rev 20 the bride of Christ is the New Jerusalem filled with the saints coming down out of heaven --

Christ said "He is the door" -- Christ said "He is the good shepherd" -- your tactic of DIVIDING such terms as if one is not also the other is silly.

Romans 2 says that EVERYONE is judged -- 2Cor 5 says WE MUST ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ --

NO TEXT says "everyone in the body of Christ but not the bride of Christ" or any other such nonsense.

In fact it IS TRUE that EVERY saint in ALL AGES will be in that millennial kingdom with Christ - for they are ALL the "DEAD IN CHRIST" and they are ALL raised in the 1Thess 4 event called "THE FIRST RESURRECTION" by John in Rev 20.

You simply "prefer not to believe it" and then view your own "preference" as some kind of "Biblical proof".

Wrong! Rather it is exaulting the point of John 3:16 "That whosoever BELIEVETH in HIM should NOT PERISH but have everlasting LIFE".

Your insistence that the saints must pay their own debt of sin flies in the face of the Gospel itself!

in Christ,

Bob

 

Steaver here is your opening statement. Here you say every saved individual is going to make up the bride of Christ.

Then you agreed with me that not every saved individual is going to make up the bride of Christ. I'm confused. Do you believe that every saved individuals makes up the bride of Christ or not?

Steaver I just told you that I gave you four examples in Scripture from the OT and NT that disagrees with your opening statement. If even one Scripture disagrees with what you have said that is enough for it to be false, so the council that you have gave is not going to "rock my world," other than to knock me off course. So in that sense yes it would rock my world.

By the way I used to believe that every saved individual would make up the bride of Christ, so I'm not so "dug into my theology" as you suggest.

Yes and I told you exactly what I "know" that to be true, because other Scripture contradicts what you are saying. Therefore those are the only two options availabe. Either the Scripture has been taken out of context or it is being misinterpreted, because elsewhere in Scripture it says something totally different than what you were trying to say. Scripture can't contradict Scripture.

I have you four references. I didn't know that I needed to give you specific chapters and verses? Genesis 2 is where you can read about Adam and Eve and it's somewhere in the middle where you can read about Isaac meeting Rebekah and taking her as his wife. Probably in the mid 20s (chapter 25-26 maybe) and then Ruth and Orpah are in the first part of the book of Ruth.

The broad way and the narrow way is in one or more of the gospel accounts. Just go to www.studylight.org and type in the references and it will show you where they are exactly.

Well again it's not my job to convict you of Truth. I'm just asked to share it and that's where my responsibility ends.

It wasn't intended as a dig and I apologize if I have offended you!

 

Okay I read over the material and it is just as I suspected. It is commentary supporting your OP that every saved individual makes up the bride of Christ. Therefore what I said in the beginning still holds true. The OT types of Adam and Eve, Isaac and Rebekah and Ruth and Orpah tell us this isn't true.

And the NT text of the broad way and the narrow way tell us this isn't true.

Being a part of the bride of Christ is equated to life in the age to come. It has to do with His coming kingdom.

 

Jump, nowhere in scripture is it taught that all of the saints will not take part in the reign of Christ millennial kingdom. There are many types and anti types in the Bible, but the examples you have used to support your false doctrine are lame at best and preposterous at worst. Why you want to base your theology totally on types and anti types is beyond me. Don't you think if what you believe is true, i.e. a portion of the Bride will be subjected to exclusion from the company of Christ at any time after they are saved, it would have been explicitely said so in scripture?!

 

When Scripture says that the majority are going to chose the broad way that leads to destruction and few will find the narrow way that leads to life, that's pretty explicit to me.

By the way I want to build my theology on types and anti-types because that is the way Scripture is laid out.

Jesus said that those He was preaching to wouldn't believe Him, because they didn't believe Moses and Moses wrote about Jesus. The only way that is possible is through type.

Scripture explicitly says Adam is a type of Christ.

Christ opened up the entire OT and revealed Himself to the disciples on the road to Emmaus. He is throughout the OT in type.

Therefore that's why I want to know what the types are and what they mean and what the NT anti-type is and means.

This is one of the checks and balances of Scripture. If you have a NT teaching that you can't find an OT type for then your thoughts on the NT are incorrect.

You will not find anything in the New that you don't find in the Old. That's one of the amazing things about Scripture.

By the way I agree with you that Scripture never says all the "saints" will not partake in the coming kingdom. However Scripture doesn't claim that all "saved" people are "saints" either!

 

Saints:
Testament (Greek)
G40 hagios hä'-gē-os holy, saints, Holy One, misc

Paul refers to all believers as saints. Not because they are holy in the flesh, but because they have been declared holy by their faith in Christ. Because of their faith, they have been sanctified (set apart by God) in Christ. Their holiness comes from Him and not of themselves.

A NT saint is not someone who has been designated as such because of good works. That is what the Catholics do.

Your theology reeks of Catholocism.

 

Majority of people, Jump, people!
Do you not agree that Christians are in the minority and that the majority are in the broad way that goes to hell.

Christians are not in the broad way, but the narrow way, Jesus Christ. The Only Way, Truth, and Life. Not works, not heritage, not lineage, not in name, nothing else other than that Name which is above every Name. There is none other Name under heaven whereby we must be saved, than that of Jesus Christ!

The few that find the narrow way are those that call upon His Name, trust in His finished work, and are saved by His amazing Grace.

They find it because the Holy Spirit directs them to it and in it.

John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.

 

And your refutes reek of emotionalism.

 

Well let's just let at the text Cutter and see if that is true.

13 "Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14 "For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

Okay here is the text. Jesus is telling someone to enter through the narrow gate. So who was the audience of this text? It was the disciples. So Jesus is telling the disciples to enter through the narrow gate that leads to life, so even though they were saved (they were disciples - can't be a disciple without being saved) they still had to enter through the narrow gate tht leads to life.

Many will enter through the gate that leads to desruction. It doesn't say anywhere in that text that this is reference to all people. And the fact that the disciples (saved people) are still in need of entering there is no way that this contextually can be talking about everlasting life. The disciples already had that and didn't need to enter into anything to get something they already had.

I think that is a logical statement. However that is not contextually what this text is talking about. So while your statement is true you can't apply it to this text.

This is a true statement as well, because Christian means Christ-like in behavior. So Christians are not on the broad way that is very true. However not all saved people are Christians. You need just read this board for a few days and you can see that not all saved people behave in a Christ-like manner.

This is a statement that is also written to "saved" individuals. Wonder why "saved" people would need to be "saved" by the name of Jesus Christ?

 

I think they reek of truth. And you don't like it.