The Bride of Christ

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by steaver, Aug 6, 2007.

  1. steaver

    steaver
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    Does everyone here understand that the bride of Christ is the NT church, all of those who are born of God (saved) by grace through faith in Jesus?

    I have some commentary I would like to share about this subject. I think that it often goes overlooked in many churches.

    The Marriage of the Lamb. Rev 19:7-10.

    Of all the provisions of God for man's well-being and joy on earth, marriage, God's first social institution, ranks second only to that of salvation. Both Old and New Testament give ample evidence of the importance of this symbolism. Hosea spoke of it from a traumatic experience in his own life (cf. Hos 2:19-20); Isaiah spoke glowingly of it (cf. Isa 54:5); Jeremiah dwelt on the theme (cf Jer 3:14; 31:-32); and Ezekiel portrayed it with fullness (cf. Ezk 16). The New Testament speaks of the marriage feast (cf. Mt 22:2), the bridal chamber and wedding garment (cf. Mt 22:10-11), the sons of the bridal chamber ( cf. Mk 2:19), the bridegroom (cf. Mt 25:1; Mk 2:19), and the friends of the bridegroom (cf. Jn 3:29). Paul writes of the church as the betrothed virgin of Christ (cf. 2Cor 11:2) and of the pettern of the relationship between husband and wife (cf. Eph 5:21-33).

    7. The wording of verse 7 is unusual and must not be overlooked. In normal parlance the wedding is spoken of as the marriage of the bride, but here it is the marriage of the Lamb. And rightly so, for the chief joy is His. It takes place in heaven, and no details are given. Care is to be exercised in speaking of the relationship of Israel and the church with reference to marriage, so that biblical norms are not violated. Israel is the unfathful, yet to be reclaimed, wife of the Lord in the Old Testament; the church is the bride of Christ the Lamb in the New Testament. Once the wife or bride is mentioned, there is no further reference in the book to elders as in verse 4.

    8. For this glorious occasion the bride of necessity had to make herself ready. The preparation includes: (1) acceptance of the marriage offer of the Lamb, which is regeneration; (2) the desire to be properly clothed for the wedding; (3) a willingness to receive what is given her for the joyous event. When the bride clothes herself, it is with the finest of apparel. Her basic clothing is the garment of salvation, which she received at her acceptance of the Lamb's gracious offer of marriage (cf. Isa 61:10). Now, in addition to the initial clothing, she has granted to her (still all of grace) fine linen, clean and white. It is identified as the righteous acts (Gr is plural, dikaiomata) of the saints. How has she obtained these? It is inescapable that the judgment seat of Christ has already been held in order to grant rewards to the saints for fathful service to Christ (cf. 2Cor 5:10). What a recognition day that will be!

    9. But another important element of every wedding is the guest, so John is instructed to indicate Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. These are the friends of the Bridegroom (cf. Jn 3:29); the guest are seen in another figure as the virgins, the companions of the bride (cf. Ps 45:9, 14). They are probably all Old Testament saints. All others than the church are the guests at the marriage supper.

    Charles L. Feinber, Th.D., Ph.D. (King James Bible Commentary)


    God Bless! :thumbs:
     
  2. J. Jump

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    I know this will come as no great shock to you, but I would disagree with your assessment. But more importantly the Scripture disagrees with you :).

    If "everyone" who is a part of the body of Christ also became the bride of Christ then there would be no need for the judgment seat of Christ. That would mean that everyone would rule and reign with Christ in His coming kingdom. Neither of which are true.

    The OT types tell us that only a portion of the body becomes the bride. You can see this in Adam and Eve, Isaac and Rebekah and Ruth and Orpah.

    You can also see this truth in the NT as well in that many are headed to destruction and only a few will find life. That's written to and for believers not unbelievers.

    Saying that everyone will become the bride of Christ and that everyone will rule and reign with Christ is merely repeating the age-old lie yea God has not said you will surely die, but just given it a different vernacular.
     
  3. steaver

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    Now that you have stated your position, I would expect that you could go through the OP exposition and refute some if not all of the scriptures that were given out of context or simply misinterpreted.

    You know you are batting 0 for 2 with Matt 7 and Matt 25? But that has not persuaded you yet! Go for it!

    God Bless! :thumbs:
     
  4. BobRyan

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    1. Does everyone here understand that there is ony ONE Gospel -- not two?

    2. Does everyone here understand that the saints are saved by Grace through faith - in ALL ages - not just in the NT??

    3. Does everyone here understand that the OT saints that are upheld as examples for the NT saints in Heb 11 gained acceptance with God through faith "for apart from faith it is impossible to please Him"?

    The "DEAD in CHRIST" listed in 1thess 4 are therefore the saints of all ages.

    The saints raised in Matt 27 at the resurrection of Christ are from among the OT saints who were all "saved by grace through faith" - there is no other way.

    the saints standing with CHRIST pre-cross in Matt 17 (Moses and Elijah) were BOTH saved by grace through faith -- that was the ONLY Gospel anyone has ever had.

    Is this clear to all- or do some imagine "another gospel"??

    hint - in the NT -- Israel is NEVER depicted as "the harlot" or the "unfaithful bride of Christ" and Romans 9 and 11 show us why that is.

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
    #4 BobRyan, Aug 6, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 6, 2007
  5. J. Jump

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    Bob I'm not sure how you can make this statement since you preach a works-based plan of eternal salvation. Any time everlasting life is conditional that is adding works into the mix.

    And I'm not really sure what your post had to do with the discussion :laugh:.
     
  6. J. Jump

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    Steaver to be perfectly honest I don't even know what Scripture you used. I read your first sentence and that was enough to know that whatever you followed that with was going to be untruth, so I'm not sure whether you have taken the Scripture out of context or misinterpreted it, but I know it's one or the other and I gave you three examples from the OT alone that shows us not everyone in the body is going to make up the bride. And I gave you at least one text in the NT. I think it was just one anyway.

    But I don't suspect you will believe what I have posted any more than you have in the past. I just wanted those that read to have the whole council of God and not just the bits and pieces will clip out to use as "proof" texts.

    The Biblical Truth of the matter is not every saved individual is going to make up the bride.

    I would just ask this one thing of your theology . . . do you have some OT types that show that every saved individual will make up the bride?
     
  7. steaver

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    From the OP...........The Marriage of the Lamb. Rev 19:7-10.

    This is why you never learn anything. You are dug into your theology and refuse to consider any other council that would rock your world.

    This you "know" without even studying what was said and properly refuting it line by line. But you "know" what was done. This from one who does not know if God even knows him by his works!

    You gave zero scripture references that one could consider for your view.

    You must make your case with rightly dividing the scriptures, thus far you have not been persuasive.

    Nice little dig. I forgive you! :thumbs:

    Amen! We agree on something!

    How about you actually study the OP and then point out what references are flawed and what interpretations must be wrong and why?

    God Bless!
     
  8. BobRyan

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    you use that made-up rule as a "filter" for reading the bible and bending texts about salvation AWAY from their obvious intent. Why do you think such a made-up rule would be accepted by anyone else?

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  9. BobRyan

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    Another totally illogical - "made up" conclusion!!

    The fact is that in scripture there is no division between the body of Christ and the bride of Christ. In Rev 20 the bride of Christ is the New Jerusalem filled with the saints coming down out of heaven --

    Christ said "He is the door" -- Christ said "He is the good shepherd" -- your tactic of DIVIDING such terms as if one is not also the other is silly.

    Romans 2 says that EVERYONE is judged -- 2Cor 5 says WE MUST ALL stand before the judgment seat of Christ --

    NO TEXT says "everyone in the body of Christ but not the bride of Christ" or any other such nonsense.

    In fact it IS TRUE that EVERY saint in ALL AGES will be in that millennial kingdom with Christ - for they are ALL the "DEAD IN CHRIST" and they are ALL raised in the 1Thess 4 event called "THE FIRST RESURRECTION" by John in Rev 20.

    You simply "prefer not to believe it" and then view your own "preference" as some kind of "Biblical proof".


    Wrong! Rather it is exaulting the point of John 3:16 "That whosoever BELIEVETH in HIM should NOT PERISH but have everlasting LIFE".

    Your insistence that the saints must pay their own debt of sin flies in the face of the Gospel itself!

    in Christ,

    Bob
     
  10. J. Jump

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    Steaver here is your opening statement. Here you say every saved individual is going to make up the bride of Christ.

    Then you agreed with me that not every saved individual is going to make up the bride of Christ. I'm confused. Do you believe that every saved individuals makes up the bride of Christ or not?

    Steaver I just told you that I gave you four examples in Scripture from the OT and NT that disagrees with your opening statement. If even one Scripture disagrees with what you have said that is enough for it to be false, so the council that you have gave is not going to "rock my world," other than to knock me off course. So in that sense yes it would rock my world.

    By the way I used to believe that every saved individual would make up the bride of Christ, so I'm not so "dug into my theology" as you suggest.

    Yes and I told you exactly what I "know" that to be true, because other Scripture contradicts what you are saying. Therefore those are the only two options availabe. Either the Scripture has been taken out of context or it is being misinterpreted, because elsewhere in Scripture it says something totally different than what you were trying to say. Scripture can't contradict Scripture.

    I have you four references. I didn't know that I needed to give you specific chapters and verses? Genesis 2 is where you can read about Adam and Eve and it's somewhere in the middle where you can read about Isaac meeting Rebekah and taking her as his wife. Probably in the mid 20s (chapter 25-26 maybe) and then Ruth and Orpah are in the first part of the book of Ruth.

    The broad way and the narrow way is in one or more of the gospel accounts. Just go to www.studylight.org and type in the references and it will show you where they are exactly.

    Well again it's not my job to convict you of Truth. I'm just asked to share it and that's where my responsibility ends.

    It wasn't intended as a dig and I apologize if I have offended you!
     
  11. J. Jump

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    Okay I read over the material and it is just as I suspected. It is commentary supporting your OP that every saved individual makes up the bride of Christ. Therefore what I said in the beginning still holds true. The OT types of Adam and Eve, Isaac and Rebekah and Ruth and Orpah tell us this isn't true.

    And the NT text of the broad way and the narrow way tell us this isn't true.

    Being a part of the bride of Christ is equated to life in the age to come. It has to do with His coming kingdom.
     
  12. Cutter

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    Jump, nowhere in scripture is it taught that all of the saints will not take part in the reign of Christ millennial kingdom. There are many types and anti types in the Bible, but the examples you have used to support your false doctrine are lame at best and preposterous at worst. Why you want to base your theology totally on types and anti types is beyond me. Don't you think if what you believe is true, i.e. a portion of the Bride will be subjected to exclusion from the company of Christ at any time after they are saved, it would have been explicitely said so in scripture?!
     
  13. J. Jump

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    When Scripture says that the majority are going to chose the broad way that leads to destruction and few will find the narrow way that leads to life, that's pretty explicit to me.

    By the way I want to build my theology on types and anti-types because that is the way Scripture is laid out.

    Jesus said that those He was preaching to wouldn't believe Him, because they didn't believe Moses and Moses wrote about Jesus. The only way that is possible is through type.

    Scripture explicitly says Adam is a type of Christ.

    Christ opened up the entire OT and revealed Himself to the disciples on the road to Emmaus. He is throughout the OT in type.

    Therefore that's why I want to know what the types are and what they mean and what the NT anti-type is and means.

    This is one of the checks and balances of Scripture. If you have a NT teaching that you can't find an OT type for then your thoughts on the NT are incorrect.

    You will not find anything in the New that you don't find in the Old. That's one of the amazing things about Scripture.

    By the way I agree with you that Scripture never says all the "saints" will not partake in the coming kingdom. However Scripture doesn't claim that all "saved" people are "saints" either!
     
  14. Amy.G

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    Saints:
    Testament (Greek)
    G40 hagios hä'-gē-os holy, saints, Holy One, misc

    Paul refers to all believers as saints. Not because they are holy in the flesh, but because they have been declared holy by their faith in Christ. Because of their faith, they have been sanctified (set apart by God) in Christ. Their holiness comes from Him and not of themselves.

    A NT saint is not someone who has been designated as such because of good works. That is what the Catholics do.

    Your theology reeks of Catholocism.
     
  15. Cutter

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    Majority of people, Jump, people!
    Do you not agree that Christians are in the minority and that the majority are in the broad way that goes to hell.

    Christians are not in the broad way, but the narrow way, Jesus Christ. The Only Way, Truth, and Life. Not works, not heritage, not lineage, not in name, nothing else other than that Name which is above every Name. There is none other Name under heaven whereby we must be saved, than that of Jesus Christ!

    The few that find the narrow way are those that call upon His Name, trust in His finished work, and are saved by His amazing Grace.

    They find it because the Holy Spirit directs them to it and in it.

    John 16:13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, [that] shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come.
     
  16. J. Jump

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    And your refutes reek of emotionalism.
     
  17. J. Jump

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    Well let's just let at the text Cutter and see if that is true.

    13 "Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14 "For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.

    Okay here is the text. Jesus is telling someone to enter through the narrow gate. So who was the audience of this text? It was the disciples. So Jesus is telling the disciples to enter through the narrow gate that leads to life, so even though they were saved (they were disciples - can't be a disciple without being saved) they still had to enter through the narrow gate tht leads to life.

    Many will enter through the gate that leads to desruction. It doesn't say anywhere in that text that this is reference to all people. And the fact that the disciples (saved people) are still in need of entering there is no way that this contextually can be talking about everlasting life. The disciples already had that and didn't need to enter into anything to get something they already had.

    I think that is a logical statement. However that is not contextually what this text is talking about. So while your statement is true you can't apply it to this text.

    This is a true statement as well, because Christian means Christ-like in behavior. So Christians are not on the broad way that is very true. However not all saved people are Christians. You need just read this board for a few days and you can see that not all saved people behave in a Christ-like manner.

    This is a statement that is also written to "saved" individuals. Wonder why "saved" people would need to be "saved" by the name of Jesus Christ?
     
  18. steaver

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    You are all out of whack brother! The NT is written to believers so that they may understand their salvation, not to get them saved from a temporary hell. It is also written for the lost, that they may read about salvation and receive Christ. You put limits on God's word and it's all consuming power towards the lost and the saved alike so as to prop up your view. That is just plain wrong!

    God Bless! :thumbs:
     
  19. Amy.G

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    I think they reek of truth. And you don't like it.
     
  20. steaver

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    I pray to God you are not given a teaching post in any church to put forth any of this confusion onto anyone.

    God Bless! :praying:
     

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