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Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by Rufus_1611, Jun 25, 2007.
"BY MOLLIE ZIEGLER HEMINGWAY
For many Americans, Sunday is unlike any other day of the week. They spend its luxurious hours curled up in bed with the paper, meeting friends for brunch, working off hangovers, watching golf, running errands and preparing themselves for the workweek ahead. But Sunday is also, for many, the Sabbath--a special day for religious reasons. Not that you would notice.
"Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy," we are told in Exodus. Of all the gifts Jews gave the world, that of a weekly day of rest is certainly one to be cherished. And yet the Sabbath is now marked more by its neglect than its keeping. Or so says Christopher Ringwald in his new book "A Day Apart."
Mr. Ringwald notes that in the late 18th century, states banned entertainment, hunting or unnecessary travel on Sundays. The Second Great Awakening in the early 1800s spread Sabbath-keeping to the frontiers. Church membership doubled, Sunday schools proliferated and long sermons dominated the morning. It was unthinkable that the general store would remain open on the Sabbath. "Nothing strikes a foreigner on his arrival in America more forcibly than the regard paid to the Sabbath," Alexis de Tocqueville wrote in 1840. "Not only have all ceased to work, but they appear to have ceased to exist." The so-called blue laws that were a part of American culture--closing down bars and preventing the sale of liquor on Sunday--were commonplace well into the 20th century.
But the Sabbath today is at odds with commercial culture. To generalize shamelessly from personal experience: My brother-in-law, who manages a national retail store in Colorado, works on Sundays, following church. He was shocked recently to find out he is now required to open the store on Easter Sunday. Easter used to be the one Sunday each year when retail stores closed. No longer."
Never mind the errors, like the two basic ones in this phrase: "Of all the gifts Jews gave the world, that of a weekly day of rest is certainly one to be cherished." (The Jews did not give the Sabbath. God did. And neither the Jews nor God, gave a "gift" "of a weekly day of rest". God says "The Seventh Day the Sabbath OF THE LORD YOUR GOD". That is something vastly different!
Where does 'Sunday ... unlike any other day of the week', come from?
But most important and relevant, What causes your concern about this 'sabbath'? Why worry about it? Why do you want to 'observe' it? What for, and for what?
I can't answer for Rufus, but I can answer for myself.
Call me legalistic, but I believe that if God "rested" on the seventh day, He did not do so because He needed the rest but as an example for us.
I do not believe in observing THE Sabbath day (sundown Friday to sundown Saturday) but in observing A Sabbath day.
I choose the Lord's Day. It's vital for Christians to have a day to recuperate from the previous six days of strife with this old world. I believe there is something significant about God resting on the 7th day.....seven being a number meaning "completion".
It's my personal opinion that to ignore this special communing with God via rest of one's body and mind and drawing extremely close to Him is not healthy.
Does it have to be on Sunday?
No....Sundays, for many Christians because of our warped ideas about "playing church", are the busiest day of our week and ironically a day when we can be the most grouchy and over-stressed.
But..and this is just my opinion, we need to set aside a day of the week where we strip ourselves of the previous week's "worldliness" and spend a good portion of the day in spiritual "bathing" and in putting on spiritually "new clothes" in preparation for being the best servant that we can be for the upcoming week.
Excellent post Scarlett. I completely agree with you. :wavey:
"Call me legalistic, but I believe that if God "rested" on the seventh day, He did not do so because He needed the rest but as an example for us.
I do not believe in observing THE Sabbath day (sundown Friday to sundown Saturday) but in observing A Sabbath day."
You identify yourself a legalist; blame no one else of saying you are. The worst kind of legalist, who, instead of the letter of the Law and the express Command of God, obtrudes his own preference in place of God's preference, esteeming his corban superior to respect for Divine Authority.
I choose the Lord's Day.
You choose ... even if you chose right, God accepts that which He chose, which He sanctified, which He willed - not you or I. For the sheer reason it's our wills', God wills it not. Saul offered what God willed he should not. God rejected both him and his offering.
The Lord's Day. That is good! The Day belonging to the Lord Jesus being the Day of His Lordship. Make sure which Day that was, because God made very sure.
"I do not believe in observing THE Sabbath day"
I don't believe in observing the Sabbath day; I don't believe in the Sabbath day. But I believe the Sabbath Day; I believe to observe it is God's will; I believe it a truth of the Scriptures and of the will of God. I believe in God, only.
That's why I'll never believe in Sunday supposed to be the Lord's Day; for that or it never had anything to do with the will of God or His worship, or with the Scriptures. Not a word in it about it - nowhere - sultz. The stillness of the grave as far as the Sunday-Lord's Day is concerned.
What is the Scriptures full of though?
"It's vital for Christians to have a day to recuperate from the previous six days of strife with this old world. I believe there is something significant about God resting on the 7th day....."
What is there "significant about God resting on the 7th day"? That "it's vital for Christians to have a day to recuperate from the previous six days of strife with this old world"? And then, NOT NO NEVER ON THE Seventh Day, but on any day but it! So what IS, so "significant about God resting on the 7th day.....""? Not perhaps, that He rested ON THE SEVENTH DAY? No no no! not that, not even though it is "God resting on the 7th day"!
Please, I find it impossible to understand your Sunday-logic. Actually, I take exception.
You see, I take exception because of resonings like this, "Does it have to be on Sunday? No....Sundays, for many Christians because of our warped ideas about "playing church", "
"because of our warped ideas about "playing church" ---
To me, BEING "the Body of Christ's Own" - BEING the Church - "The People of God" - THERE'S WHY! "THERE'S WHY there remains for the People of God keeping of the Sabbath Day". Jesus Christ the Head; the Church the Body; the Sabbath Day, the Lord's Day, His Day of Worship-Rest. Not the worship of another kind of rest (idolised); but the 'rest' "in Christ" found in the Communion of the Saints; found in the worship of their Lord and Saviour Master, jesus Christ, "Sabbath after Sabbath", "Sabbaths' feasting". Scriptural; punctional; faithful.
"GOD THUS CONCERNING THE SEVENTH DAY SPAKE: AND GOD THE SEVENTH DAY RESTED."
God thus spake through and in and by "the Son"; "in these last days". It's a NEW Testament Word of God - no Old Testament law! It's THE NT Word of God Himself "THUS" 'speaking'; "concerning" "the Sabbath of the LORD your God the Seventh Day". It's the same God still. But a foreign and strange day out from the cold --- believing you.
"But..and this is just my opinion, we need to set aside a day of the week where we strip ourselves of the previous week's "worldliness" and spend a good portion of the day in spiritual "bathing" and in putting on spiritually "new clothes" in preparation for being the best servant that we can be for the upcoming week."
Not a Buddist or Hindu could improve on your opinion!
GE - I have apparently struck a very sensitive nerve with you. I seem to be doing that a lot in that last 48 hours here at the BB and elsewhere. I'm sorry. :flower:
Certainly D.L Moody shares the concern and main point of the OP.
(Quotes from his well published sermon on the Ten Commandments available for posting here upon request -- as always).
But it is your point that "the Jews gave us the gift of Christ the TRIUNE God of Exodus 20:1-4"??
I hesistate to go here - since Scarlett O is usually right. (A point I have made several times so far). But here goes...
Is it your position that an exegetically sound reading of Exodus 20:8-12 will show the text to command us to "Remember A Sabbath day"?? Are you saying that THIS was the intent of the text as spoken by God and shown in the book of Exodus?
Are you saying that Exodus 20 or Rev 1 or ... declares some "other day" other than THE seventh day to be "The Holy Day of the Lord" or that Christ said He is "The Lord of week-day-one" or that any text refers to week-day one as "The Lord's Day"?
OR are you saying that whether this is actually in the Bible or not -- should not matter?
On "THE" Seventh or on "A" Seventh day?
Is it your position that Christ before the Cross attended worship on THE Seventh-day or "A" Seventh day (Matt 4 comes to mind).
So you are saying that if one is too busy on week-day-one they could select "THE Seventh day" instead and it would be fine?
Excellent post Scarlett.
This has also made me dredge up from the depths of my memory something I remember reading that in some countries, the Lord's Day isn't observed on Sunday, but on another day of the week. I don't remember where it is - the Middle East is coming to mind, but I don't know why. We would observe the Lord's Day with everyone else wouldn't we? And that would mean us working on Sunday. (I do wish I could remember the particulars of this memory!)
You have posted seven back-to-back posts directed at Scarlett. I must direct you to re-read the BB Posting Rules specifically rules 3 and 4 and then abide by them. Your recent posts here have come across very harsh, lacking grace, and here you have compared Scarlett with Buddists and Hindus. Cool your rhetoric and debate the issues without resorting to name calling and failing to show grace to your fellow BB poster. Otherwise, you may find yourself facing the action of the BB Administrative Council.
Yours in Christ,
I appreciate the kind words, but "usually right" doesn't even come close to describing me. It's more like "usually doing the best I can like everyone else."
No, the intent of Exodus 20 was to keep THE sabbath day holy. Sundown Friday night to sundown Saturday night.
But Jesus, Himself, said that He came to fulfill the law, that is to make it complete.
He took part of the 10 commandments from Exodus 20 and other parts of the law and showed the people in His sermon on the mount that there was a greater "spirit" to the law than a "letter" of the law.
The "letter" of the law is confining in its incompleteness. Thou shalt not kill. Thou shalt not commit adultery. Eye for eye and tooth for tooth. Remember the Sabbath and keep it holy. That sounds simple enough to understand, but Jesus said that there was more.
The "spirit" of the law is freeing. Jesus said don't even hate. Don't even think about what it might be like to be with someone you are not married to. Don't seek revenge. If your neighbor needs help on the Sabbath, then help him.
I can't explain it any differently than I already have. And I can only speak for myself. And I certainly don't mean to offend people.
You say that "thou shalt not murder" is to confining but "you shall not hate" gives us much more freedom??
Isn't it more correct to say that "you shall not hate" is EXPANDING the scope of the commandment so that it is far MORE restrictive on what we are allowed to do. I.e no hating-yet-not-murdering.
It would be like saying of THE Seventh-day Sabbath "NNLY MUST you NOT work on Sabbath BUT you MUST ALSO call the Sabbath a DELIGHT and cease from speaking your own word".
In other words the broader deeper - EXPANDING direction would be to view the "no work" restriction as the very LEAST requirement which MUSt be kept (just as not murdering is STILL a requirement that is fully met WHILE ALSO not hating).
Or did I miss something there?
Jesus did not worship idols and so FULFILLED the LAW in that regard but he also did not serve false gods any way at all - going far beyond simply not using their images in worship.
How very different that would be from "select any god you want not to worship - the rest are ok to worship as long as you pick one NOT to worship".
No, you didn't miss anything. Expanding and restrictive are a better choice of words.
I was thinking along the lines, in terms of the word freedom, that if one does not allow hate to take seed in his heart, then the physical act of murder may never come to fruition. And likewise with adultery and so on....
Freedom in the sense that if the root of the problem (the heart) is taken care of first then all of the behaviors will, most of the time, fall into their proper place of being acted on or not being acted on.