The Deity Of Christ In The NIV And KJV

Discussion in 'Bible Versions/Translations' started by Rippon, Feb 27, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Rippon

    Rippon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    17,403
    Likes Received:
    328
    There has been a lot of nonsense said about modern versions downgrading biblical doctrines such as the Deity of Christ .So I am about to set the record straight one item at a time .

    Since the NIV is such a favorite whipping boy I thought I would list several passages from each . Compare the clarity . ( BYW , the first citation will be from the TNIV instead of the NIV .) Other modern versions also do a good job of clearly comunicating the Deity of Christ .

    John 1:18 : No one has seen God , but the one and only [ Son ] who is himself God and is in closest relationship to the Father , has made him known .( TNIV )

    No man hath seen God at any time ; the only begotten Son , which is in the bosom of the Father , he hath declared him . ( KJV )

    Romans 9:5 : Theirs are the patriarchs , and from them is traced the human ancestry of Christ , who is God over all , forever praised ! amen . ( NIV )

    Whose are the fathers , and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came , who is over all , God blessed for ever . Amen . ( KJV )

    Philippians 2:5,6 : Your attitude should be the same as that of Jesus Christ : Who , being in very nature God , did not consider equality with God something to be grasped , ( NIV )

    Let this mind be in you , which was also in Christ Jesus , Who , being in the form of God , thought it not robbery to be equal with God KJV )

    Colossians 2:9 : For in Christ all the fullness of the Deity lives in bodily form ,( NIV )

    For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily . ( KJV )

    Titus 2:13 : while we wait for the blessed hope -- the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior , Jesus Christ , ( NIV )

    Looking for that blessed hope , and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ ; ( KJV )

    2 Peter 1:1 : Simon Peter , a servant and apostle of Jesus Christ , To those who through the righteousness of our God and savior Jesus Christ have received a faith as precious as ours ; ( NIV )

    Simon Peter , a servant and an apostle of Jesus christ , to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ : ( KJV )

    Jude 4 : ... They are godless men , who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord . ( NIV )

    ... ungodly men , turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness , and denying the only Lord God , and our Lord Jesus Christ . ( KJV )
     
    #1 Rippon, Feb 27, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 27, 2008
  2. TCGreek

    TCGreek
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 12, 2006
    Messages:
    7,373
    Likes Received:
    0
    Nicely done, but I'm sure that those who are Anti-MVs will find some way to object .
     
  3. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    I'd like to pint out that the NIV makes allowance for those who do not believe in the same God as Christians rightfully do, the phrase "who is God over all" leaves it open for discussion "Who is God?" "Do I believe that Allah is also God?" "I believe Confusious is God and Christ, so why should I accept the Christian doctrine?", etc., etc.

    While the KJB makes the distinction: Christ being the "who is over all" without any conjecture, arguement, or room for doubt "who" is over all except it be Christ! Regardless of belief, it makes the outright statement no mater what anyone believes.

    I'll look at it more, but this is the first that DOES leave the door open to belief rather that doctrine.
     
  4. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    The NIV is simply confusing here as if being God could be "grasped":laugh:

    A simple research into Phil. 2:5,6 in the KJB will show that Christ in his humanity did no harm in that He was God in the fact that He IS God!:godisgood:
     
  5. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    The NIV opens up that Christ died in bodily form and the fullness of the Deity died with him.

    KJB? :jesus: is all the fulness of the Godhead bodily that shows the agreement of Father, Son, Holy Ghost. The father sent the Son. The Son died. The Holy Ghost uses the Death, Burial, and Ressurection to bring sinners under conviction and offer salvation. The Father never died, the Holy Ghost never died. The Son did die, but rose again!:godisgood: :godisgood: :godisgood:
     
  6. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    The NIV's use of the comma could make it understood that Jesus Christ only "said" this and opens things up to question the authority of the word of God here.
     
  7. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    Being you offered so many examples, I had decided to address each one individually, but here both also do the same type of harm to the word of God and to the reader:

    1. Is Jesus "Saviour" or "savior"?

    2. Just calling Jesus "Lord" and not the only "Lord God" leaves it open to those who would argue that Jesus "isn't actually God, but only 'Lord' "
     
  8. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    You're suspicions hold true, and RIGHTFULLY so!:wavey:
     
  9. Rippon

    Rippon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    17,403
    Likes Received:
    328
    Sal , you are grasping at straws here regarding the NIV's rendering of Romans 9:5 .
     
  10. Rippon

    Rippon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    17,403
    Likes Received:
    328
    As usual , the above rant of yours makes no sense . At least you are consistent Sal .

    TNIV has ... did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage .

    But the NET Bible has "grasped" like the NIV .
     
  11. thomas15

    thomas15
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2007
    Messages:
    1,456
    Likes Received:
    0
    This further proves my theory that some of the KJVO folks do not know the rules English grammer and apply them.
     
  12. Rippon

    Rippon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    17,403
    Likes Received:
    328
    Here in Col. 2:9 I'd like you to differentiate between "fullness of the Deity" and "fulness of the Godhead" . ... Waiting ... O , "nothing" you say . That's right !
     
  13. Rippon

    Rippon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    17,403
    Likes Received:
    328
    More silly thoughts brought to you by Sal . How much sillier you can become the BB will wait and see .

    BTW , TNIV has : while we wait for the blessed hope -- the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior Jesus Christ .
     
  14. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    In applying them, your theory remains a theory and not a fact.
     
  15. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    face value doesn't even resemble straw.
     
  16. rbell

    rbell
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2006
    Messages:
    11,103
    Likes Received:
    0
    I've seen some silly KJVO arguments...but this just might take the cake.
     
  17. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    It goes back to the distinction you like to overlook that according to the NIV all died in Christ.

    The NIV makes the distinction contrary to the KJB.
     
  18. Rippon

    Rippon
    Expand Collapse
    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2005
    Messages:
    17,403
    Likes Received:
    328
    1) Do you want to be taken seriously ? Does the British spelling of a word lend more authority to a word than the American spelling ? come on !

    2) "our only Sovereign and Lord " makes it rather clear . Why do I dignify your remarks with commentary ?
     
  19. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    Go read Matthew Henry's Commentary on this subject, it helped me, it will also offer help to you.
     
  20. Salamander

    Salamander
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2005
    Messages:
    3,965
    Likes Received:
    0
    Honestly, I don't know why you started this thread unless you were open for criticism and closed only to agreement.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

Loading...