The "Dog's Life" of Calvinism

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by skypair, Aug 6, 2008.

  1. skypair

    skypair
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    TC suggested I open this thread. I had posited on another thread that the Calvinist view of salvation is very much like my own view of a man going to a kennel and "electing" one of its poor, mangy, soon-to-be-euthanized canine tenants. Here are some of the things I see in common:

    1) At the point of "election," neither man nor dog has any knowledge of his Master.

    2) His "election," man or dog, is strictly "monergistic" with no thought to "merit" seeing as how both are in the same state as other equally as undeserving "mutts" at the point of "election." Both might be said to be "irresistibly drawn."

    3) The dog, and man, both operate on instinct/sin nature as "beasts" and are, thus, "totally depraved," having no "God consciousness." "Moral guidance" is "inoperative" in both.

    4) Both dogs and Calvies have incomprehensible vocabularies. And some may snicker at this but its hard to teach a dog or Calvie about their master's "program" without actually speaking their language rather than the master's!! Indeed, right here on this board and this thread we are going to see that we don't speak the same "language" among ourselves!!

    5) Even once "elected" and "taken home," neither really knows his Master. They both know that they get rewarded for doing good, punished for doing bad. Both can learn "behaviors" without ever understanding their purposes. Here's a few examples:

    a) Calvies, and dogs, "behave like" they are "elect"/saved though they cannot comprehend how they were "chosen."

    b) Calvies will go to the (mission) field knowing that God is going to save whom He will (the "elect") anyway. But they do it, they say, because "God commands it" or "God has ordained to send them out for whatever reason." That's about all a dog knows about the "tricks" (even sheep herding) his master has him perform, isn't it? I think we call it "blind faith."

    c) Calvies pray even though they KNOW that God never changes His mind. Even a dog knows this is not true.

    I believe the point to be made is this: Humans do something (like get saved) because the know and understand something. Dogs do not. Men are not dogs. If you never know nor understand God, you can never rise above being His "best friend" but a "brute beast" nevertheless.

    skypair
     
    #1 skypair, Aug 6, 2008
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  2. Goldie

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    Oh drat - duplicate post : deleted.
     
    #2 Goldie, Aug 6, 2008
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  3. Goldie

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    Meow? (meaning I'm not a calvinist) :thumbs:
     
  4. ReformedBaptist

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    Another useless thread. :BangHead:
     
  5. jcjordan

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    o.k...wow....I had a response all written out and I decided it just wouldn't be kind. Brother skypair, this is just so uncalled for. There's just one big problem with your analogy...that mangy dog hadn't done anything wrong to its master. That mangy dog is much more deserving of salvation than I am.
     
  6. ReformedBaptist

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    Agreed. Mark 7:28
     
  7. skypair

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    Not necessarily, RB. It may seem obnoxious but that doesn't make it untrue. The Pharisees thought Jesus was obnoxious, too, didn't they?

    What about the Calvie perception of the human state do you find different from a domestic animal's?? Do you find that the animal chooses its master? That it understands what its master is trying to accomplish? and how? and why? that its master hears it "begging?" that its master speaks the same language? does the animal know what it is doing in the field? Isn't a Calvie just "wagging" his "tail" at God like a faithful "best friend" who just wants more attention?

    As I have recorded on other threads, what Calvies and dogs have in common is that they are missing is a SOUL -- God awareness/conscience/divine guidance.

    skypair

    [This post is in violation of the BB Posting Rules 3 & 4 and is under the consideration of the BB Admin Council.]
     
    #7 skypair, Aug 6, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 6, 2008
  8. skypair

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    Neither had the sinful infant. Neither had the one who was "elect" who was chosen "from the foundation of the world" sinned yet. Neither son (Jacob nor Esau) had "done anything wrong" when God chose Jacob to be "saved." Even the usual Calvie "proof" -- Rom 9:13 -- shows neither had been born much less sinned and yet God hated Esau. So there is no difference between "election" and "shelter dog choosing."

    That is very humble of you, jordan. You no doubt have a "guilty conscience/soul" to admit that. But let's be honest, shall we? If you take that dog home and all he does is attack you, what do you do?? Was he really more deserving?

    skypair
     
  9. ReformedBaptist

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    Thank God your not Jesus.

    "But Jesus said unto her, Let the children first be filled: for it is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it unto the dogs. And she answered and said unto him, Yes, Lord: yet the dogs under the table eat of the children's crumbs." Mark 7:27-28

    I was a dog, but now I am a child. I was a worm. But now I am beloved. By the Grace of God Alone, through Faith Alone, in Christ Alone, to the glory of God alone.
     
    #9 ReformedBaptist, Aug 6, 2008
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  10. webdog

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    Unless you are a jew...you are still a dog (gentile). A redeemed dog, but a "dog" none the less.
     
  11. Jarthur001

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    Not really. Man will not come to God unless he is made alive. The dog may or may not come to the man...when the man slaps his hands and says..." come here boy."

    Not really. Just because you do not understand, does not mean Calvinism is incomprehensible. Also to a dog,,,it has no vocabulary. Maybe its time you stopped listen to dogs.


    Its clear you don't know anything about dogs. A dog will listen to his masters voice. But this has nothing to do with Calvinist

    Who is we? :) If you don't understand, please don't blame others.

    A Calvinist would never say we are rewarded for doing good. Its not by our works, that we are saved. Just showing you still have not a clue what Calvinist believe.

    You said above it was because we are good. Have you changed your mind already? I do know why God choose, I just don't understand why He choose me

    Not so my dear feathered one. We understand the church is the tool God has chosen to get out the gospel. Does this mean he needs the church? Not at all. He could do it many ways, but he has chosen to use the church most of the time. So ..you are wrong again...which shows you have not a clue what Calvinist believe.

    God changes his mind? So, can God change and say forget it...you all are going to Hell?

    Why are you saved and others are not? Are you smarter?
     
  12. Jarthur001

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    Do you agree with Sky's OP?
     
  13. jcjordan

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    Brother RB, in your opinon, is this better or worse than being called "worse than muslim"?
     
  14. JustChristian

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    Ever been bitten by a dog? I was twice when I was a kid.
     
  15. Jarthur001

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    do you agree with this...

    Calvies are missing a soul?
     
  16. webdog

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    I responded to ReformedBaptist's statement he was once a dog.

    Skypair is trichotomous, I'm dichotomous...so no, I don't agree with the OP.
     
  17. Jarthur001

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    thanks...

    What I was asking was this.

    Do you think Calvinist are like dogs and more then you may thing all of mankind are dogs?

    As Sky has said in his OP :)
     
  18. webdog

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    To be honest, I don't understand what he is saying or implying. I only know he's "tri", I'm "di", and a soul separate from spirit plays into the analogy somehow.
     
  19. Dr. Bob

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    The op is a lie and a vile attack on believers who believe in a sovereign God who is in charge of salvation and not a man-centered false Gospel.

    If I were close to skypair, I'd bite him. But I'm afraid of getting rabies ;)
     
  20. webdog

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    ...and how is this not a veiled attack on non cal's?
     

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