The folded Napkin

Discussion in 'Baptist Theology & Bible Study' started by LeBuick, Nov 6, 2007.

  1. LeBuick

    LeBuick
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    Someone sent this to me on mail today but I guess I never knew the significance. Why is it significant that the napkin was folded?

     
  2. s8147817430

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    God is a God of order?


    Jesus was serving others. He did not want others to have to pick up and fold his crumpled napkin?
     
  3. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4
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    The word napkin is the same word used for the towel that a worker such as a carpenter would use to wipe his hands and brow during the day while he worked, much like we do today. The custom of the carpenter of this time was to fold the napkin and place it on top of the object they were working on when it was completed to communicate to others he was finished with that project.

    It is significant that the napkin was both folded and placed seperately from the other grave clothes. Jesus did what he had one for 30 years and folded and laid that napkin on His finished work.
     
  4. JamieinNH

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  5. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4
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    He didnt lay it on us. He laid it on the grave.
     
  6. JamieinNH

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    I don't think he had to lay it on us directly to make a point. Hasn't he made many points without touching you directly?

    From the link above:

    Then after 3 days, they saw an empty tomb. Not only did they see an empty tomb, but they saw a folded napkin in that empty tomb! I believe w/ all my heart that when they saw that folded napkin God spoke to them in their being and said, “He’s not finished yet…He’s coming back!”

    In my opinion, it does make sense, that he isn't finished with us yet, that he is coming back.

    In your opinion, it seems he is only saying he is finished with that 'project' the tomb. I think Jesus meant more than that.

    Jamie
     
  7. Gayla

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  8. convicted1

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    Here's an aside to this topic: The last communion I was blessed to be part of, one of the preacher's said he liked to see a folded napkin placed on the communion table because Jesus had placed it, folded in the tomb. I had never thought about it like that, but I really liked him saying this. I totally agree with him.
     
  9. LeBuick

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    Did he say why or what it meant? I read the link JamieinNH provided and spoke about not being done eating.
     
  10. AAA

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    This is the story that I was told to try to answer your question....

    I was told that the people that sat down to eat a meal will leave a sign to the people who were serving them and this sign will tell the servants if they were satisfied of not...

    The sign has to do with the napkin, if the napkin was folded then it would indicate that they were not satisfied in the way that they were treated......

    If this is all true, then Jesus was telling them that HE disliked how HE was treated during HIS earthly life.....

    Now, is this true or not? I don't know....
     
  11. Steven2006

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    Some real nice input on this thread. So far there have been three theories presented here. One that it meant He was finished, one that He was not finished, and one that He was unhappy with His treatment. They are all interesting, but obviously all can't be correct. Does anyone have a link to any type of factual historical information? It would be very interesting to know the true meaning.

    I have to say I liked the one about His not being finished, and it meaning He will return the best, but I would love to know the true meaning, if possible.
     
  12. EdSutton

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    I strongly suspect that the story and sermon illustration is nothing more than a 'spiritual' Urban Legend, although I've heard it before. I can find nothing on it as to the origin of this supposed "custom", and I don't recall reading this in The Life and Times of Jesus the Messiah, by Alfred Edersheim, or Manners and Customs of the Bible, by Freeman or finding any reference to it until recently, when it just appears, so to speak.

    The first reference I have been able to find, about this, is in a now happily adopted book of the "New Age" cult, known as The Urantia Book, which has been around some 75 years. I'm sorry, but I put less than no credence in those writings, which seem to me to be a strange mixture of Spiritism, New Age -ism, and modern day Gnosticism. And that is a less than firm foundation on which to stand, and certainly not, in a book title by Judge Paul Presser, A Hill on Which to Die.

    Ed
     
    #12 EdSutton, Nov 6, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 6, 2007
  13. 2 Timothy2:1-4

    2 Timothy2:1-4
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    [FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica][/FONT][FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica][/FONT]
    Joh 19:30 - When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghostThe work on the cross is finished.





    [FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica]Easton's Bible Dictionary[/FONT]
    [FONT=Arial, Geneva, Helvetica][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Napkin[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica][/FONT] (Gr. soudarion, John 11:44; 20:7; Lat. sudarium, a "sweat-cloth"), a cloth for wiping the sweat from the face. But the word is used of a wrapper to fold money in (Luke 19:20), and as an article of dress, a "handkerchief" worn on the head (Acts 19:12).


    [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Strong's Number: 4676[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica] Browse Lexicon[/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Original Word[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Word Origin[/FONT]soudavrion[FONT=Arial, Helvetica]of Latin origin[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Transliterated Word[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]TDNT Entry[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Soudarion[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]None[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Phonetic Spelling[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Parts of Speech[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]soo-dar'-ee-on [​IMG] [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]Noun Neuter [/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica] Definition[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]
    1. a handkerchief
    2. a cloth for wiping perspiration from the face and for cleaning the nose and also used in swathing the head of a corpse
    [/FONT] [FONT=Arial, Helvetica] King James Word Usage - Total: 4[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica]napkin 3, handkerchief 1[/FONT]



    Nothing about the grave leads to any resonable indication that God is not finished with us but gives every indication both reasonable and complete that Christ finished His work of redemption.

    [/FONT]
     
  14. npetreley

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    Well, if Jesus is finished with me, I have to say He did a lousy job.

    What is "it" in "it is finished"? Doesn't that matter?
     
  15. EdSutton

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    This is also consistent with what I posted above. One thing that is missing is any reference to this "soudarion" as a "dinner napkin". Rather, it was a handkerchief or a "sweat rag". We might more liken it to a bandana, today.

    Ed
     
  16. Steven2006

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    I suspect you are right. I also went to Edersheim's Life and Times, as well as his Sketches of "Jewish Social Life", and didn't find anything.
     
  17. Steven2006

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    The one thing I did read that makes sense, is that the cloths laid in the appearance that they hadn't been unwrapped and Jesus would have had to pass through them. The napkin lay there separate from the clothe of the body folded as it had been around his head. Just as it would be when He was risen.
     
  18. convicted1

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    LeBuick,

    He didn't go into a whole lot of detail, best I can remember. I think the point he was making about having a folded napkin on the table is that the representation of His Blood and Body are on the table as unleavened bread and the "Fruit of the Vine". So I guess he wanted the napkin folded on the table because His body was "represented" on the communion table. This is the way I took it, anyways. The napkin was folded when the Apostles entered the tomb, so I guess this why he wanted it? I liked that very much! I hope this helps.

    Willis
     
  19. David Lamb

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    Surely it is evidence against the lie put forward by the Chief Priests that the body had been stolen. Grave-robbers would hardly be likely to waste time and effort leaving things tidy.
     
  20. EdSutton

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    Agreed, a bit perhaps. However, I actually see two things here, of significance in this account. First, and foremost, the Lord arose, as the testimony of the wrappings, indicate. They were just as they had been around the Lord Jesus' body, and were undisturbed.

    Hence, his resurrected body had "passed through" them, in a non-material way. Recall Lazerus, where Jesus told those around to "Loose him, and let him go!" They had to remove the grave-clothes from Lazerus, for although Jesus 'raised Lazerus from the dead', Lazerus did not have a "resurrected body", but one that was still a "fleshly body".

    That was not the kind of body, the resurrected Lord had. His was different, and a 'spirit' body. But He was more than just a 'spirit', in the resurrection. He was also with a physical body, albeit a different kind than a "fleshly body". A 'spirit' would not have folded the napkin that had been around the head. So the folded napkin gives us evidence of this, as well. Pace Jesus eating on the shore of Galilee.

    That is why John "got it", upon looking and contemplating what he saw.

    Peter and most of the others, "missed it", as to the significance of the two things, together, IMO.

    Ed.
     
    #20 EdSutton, Nov 7, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 7, 2007

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