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"The Message" revisited

Discussion in 'Bible Versions & Translations' started by Boanerges, May 15, 2006.

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  1. Linda64

    Linda64 New Member

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    Your questions have been answered 1,000 times over but you refuse to acknowledge the answers because you are looking for someone to agree with you. Why don't you simply accept the answers which are given, move forward, and grow up.
     
    #41 Linda64, May 17, 2006
  2. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    Let's face it. The Message's rendering (rending?) of John 1:4-5 is terrible. The verb "was" (In Him was life) is an imperfect indicative. A Greek imperfect indicates a past action that is continuous.

    The best way to translate the Greek is "In Him life was, and the life was the light of men, and the light in the darkness shines, and the darkness did not overtake it."
     
    #42 TCassidy, May 17, 2006
  3. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    I do not believe the word 'overtake' is the proper translation of 'comprehend'.

    Comprehend is better translated as 'understand'.
     
    #43 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
  4. Boanerges

    Boanerges New Member

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    There goes T Cassidy being all "condescending" again. :D

    Oh how they hate it when you present facts. I can't believe that anyone would still try and defend this fantasy book.Anyone care to discuss the "doctorates" of the translator? I think that T Cassidy's is valid, how about the other guy? :confused:
     
    #44 Boanerges, May 17, 2006
  5. Boanerges

    Boanerges New Member

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    The Word of God is not some cheesy dime store novel. If it isn't accurate to the original languages, then it is dangerous. We will all be judged on the Word.This could be someones eternity at stake.
     
    #45 Boanerges, May 17, 2006
  6. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    Duh! "Overtake" is not a translation of "comprehend." It is a translation of κατελαβεν which means "come upon" or "overtake." The meaning of the verse is that the darkness did not enclose or encompass the Light! The Light could not be enclosed or encompassed by the darkness!

    Your problem is that you don't understand what "comprehend" means in the KJV. It does not mean "understand" it means "surround" or "encompass" or "enclose" or "come upon" or "overtake." The word "comprehend" is built from two words you might be familiar with. The first is "com" which means to surround. It is the word we get our word "compass" from. The other is "prehend" which is a form of "apprehend" which means to stop or arrest. When we combine them we get the meaning of "stopping or arresting by surrounding." Buy a dictionary!

    You just have to do some study before posting. When you post such foolishness you become more like william, [personal attack snipped]

    [ May 17, 2006, 05:13 PM: Message edited by: C4K ]
     
    #46 TCassidy, May 17, 2006
  7. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    the greek word has one more meaning TC,

    perceive. which means understand or grasp.
     
    #47 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
  8. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    one also has to look at that word comprehend in this light.

    When you physically grasp something, do you say, 'I comprehended this?' No, you say, 'I picked this up.'

    Comprehend is a mental word. 'I comprehend the statement that was made.' 'I do not comprehend the meaning of that word.'
     
    #48 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
  9. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    I am so sorry [personal attack snipped]

    [ May 17, 2006, 05:14 PM: Message edited by: C4K ]
     
    #49 TCassidy, May 17, 2006
  10. Boanerges

    Boanerges New Member

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    c'mon now TC. No need to get personal. :(
     
    #50 Boanerges, May 17, 2006
  11. TCassidy

    TCassidy Late-Administator Emeritus
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    How else can it be accomplished? I have explained what the Greek word means and what the English word means, but because the KJV uses another word (in an archaic way so that today's meaning is different from the meaning in 1611) standingfirminChrist refuses to hear it. I have done all I can to try to enlighten a willfully ignorant man, but he, and C4K, seem determined to allow the darkness to overpower the light. It seems rather odd to me that the Lord can be accused of deceptive leading but when the person making that personal attack against the Lord is confronted it is I who gets edited. Kind of tells you where the BB stands, doesn't it?
     
    #51 TCassidy, May 17, 2006
  12. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    Boanerges,

    It is understandable. When one does not like the message, that one tends to go overboard and attack the messenger.

    James 3:8-10 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison. Therewith bless we God, even the Father; and therewith curse we men, which are made after the similitude of God. Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren, these things ought not so to be.
     
    #52 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
  13. Scott J

    Scott J Active Member
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    SFIC, Why will you not accept the facts that Dr Cassidy lays before you? He isn't speaking from conjecture or an a priori assumption. He is speaking from direct and intimate knowledge.

    You have demonstrated yourself to be unteachable. I don't know why Doc still cares enough to try to draw you out of the darkness. Hopefully good will come out of it as many see that his opinions are based on Bible and fact while yours are based on nothing but your own insistence that God had to have preserved the Bible by the means you demand of Him.

    [ May 17, 2006, 07:18 PM: Message edited by: Scott J ]
     
    #53 Scott J, May 17, 2006
  14. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    I am not in darkness. I am a child of God and therefore in the Light. I see there is another accuser of the brethren in the thread.
     
    #54 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
  15. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    I am accused of being in darkness and attacking the Word of God when it is others who are attacking the Word of God in me.
     
    #55 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
  16. Scott J

    Scott J Active Member
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    KJVOnlyism is darkness. It is not true. It is not supported by scripture. It is not supported by objective fact.

    You may well be in the "light" regarding your salvation but you are most certainly clinging to the "darkness" concerning KJVOnlyism.

    As for this victimhood defense you've assumed, it won't fly. The Bible commands us to stand against error and to correct those among the brethren who are taken in a fault.

    Dr Cassidy has shown you that KJVOnlyism isn't biblical. He has shown you that you are wrong on this issue and that while the KJV remains doctrinally true it is not technically true on this particular point. That fact is a direct and complete refutation of the whole KJVO concept.

    My "accusation" was based on your demonstrated behavior. You refuse correction and instead use a counter accusation that parallels myself and Dr Cassidy with Satan... and very falsely so.
     
    #56 Scott J, May 17, 2006
  17. Scott J

    Scott J Active Member
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    When you refuse the truth what else can be the conclusion?
    Not a single time have we attacked the Word of God... What do you mean "in me"? Are you claiming that whatever spirit it was that told you KJVOnlyism was true is as authoritative as the written Word of God?
     
    #57 Scott J, May 17, 2006
  18. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    Again, another attack by the accuser of the brethren. I have nowhere stated that I am KJVO. I have stated I am convinced the KJV is the most accurate version, but nowhere have I stated I am KJVO.

    Again, understandable. satan wants to discredit God's people because he knows the Word of God will stand.
     
    #58 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
  19. DesiderioDomini

    DesiderioDomini New Member

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    Linda,

    Once again, you lie. I asked a yes or no question, and SFiC answered with a question.

    Just what does your twisted mind think and "answer" is?
     
    #59 DesiderioDomini, May 17, 2006
  20. standingfirminChrist

    standingfirminChrist New Member

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    having said that, I wlll now refrain from answerings your attacks, as I can see who is behind them.
     
    #60 standingfirminChrist, May 17, 2006
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