The Promises to Abraham – the Promise of the Land

You need to answer these questions so that I can continue showing you from the scriptures that we have conscious spirits that live on after the death of our physical bodies.

 

Gen. 1:20 ¶ And God said, Let the waters bring forth....

Gen. 1:24 ¶ And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature.....

Gen. 1:26 ¶ And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:

Col. 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:


Gen. 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.




Contemplate verse 20 and verse 24 in distinction to verse 26 carefully. The waters and the earth brought forth creatures with physical bodies, breath and life as the constitutent aspects of their nature and yet those constituent elements of their nature did not make them in "our image, after our likeness" because they were made in "the image of the INVISIBLE God."

Note in Genesis 2:7 that the dust of the ground and the body formed was not invisible. Being able to BREATH was no different than what the waters and the earth brought forth and that did not make them in the "image of God." Becoming a "living soul" was no different than what was brought forth by the waters and the earth.

God is a SPIRIT (Jn. 4:24) and that does not mean he is "wind" or oxygen. God imparted to man something of Himself and what was imparted was more than physical life as all creatures possessed that equally with man.

The image of God consisted in what God Himself imparted as the source of man's creation rather than what the waters and earth brought forth.

What made them like God "our image and our likeness" was that God himself "breathed into his nostrils the breath of LIVES" - Hebrew plural not singular!

He imparted into man something that neither waters or earth could impart and both could impart PHYSICAL LIFE. He gave them PHYSICAL LIFE but God is not PHYSICAL but SPIRITUAL. He gave them what He IS by nature - SPIRITUAL LIFE in the sense that God is a SPIRIT not a breath of air, or oxygen! It is this imparted SPIRITUAL nature that is like God. He gave them a SPIRIT that can fellowship with God who is SPIRIT.

 

Trevor,

Just answer on your own from your beliefs those questions I asked about how the dead are raised to eternal condemnation if they never heard of Jesus.

 

That is a lie what you say about me.

Do you have something against debating? The scriptures tell us Paul debated. The scriptures also tell us Paul and Barnabus went in to sharp dispute and public debate. The scriptures tell us of other times Paul spoke boldly arguing persuasively. We are supposed to defend and confirm the gospel. We are supposed to command others not to teach false doctrines. We are to correct, instruct, and rebuke. We are to refute others who oppose sound doctrine. We are to contend for the faith. Do you know what contend means? A contender is a fighter. Now if you would stop reading all that material you read from men, and start reading the Bible, then maybe you would know the Truth.

See Acts 9:29; Acts 15:1; Acts 19:8; Philippians 1:7-8; 1 Timothy 1:3-4; 2 Timothy 4:2-4; Titus 1:9. And, Jude 3.

Now do you want to tell me how someone who lived and died before Jesus even came to earth can reject Jesus and be raised at the resurrection to eternal punishment.

 

Sorry, but the Hebrew expressions are not the same in the passages you give. The passages dealing with animals simply say "nishmath chayyim" whereas Genesis 2:7 says "nishmath ruach chayyim." In both Genesis 2:7 and Job 33:4 "chayyim" is characterized by something directly from God being imparted.

Furthermore, the subject verb agreement in Genesis 1:30 and Genesis 7:21-22 calls for the plural as it has a plural subject not so in Genesis 2:7.

Job 33:4 has man not animals in view and it is the "chayyim" of the Almighty and The Almighty does not have lungs and air but refers to His own Spirit.

Finally, the image and likeness of God is not merely physical in regard to the brain because man can die spiritually without physical brain death. God said that in the very day he sinned "dying he would surely die." Ephesians 2:1 speaks of man being very much BRAIN ALIVE but yet having been DEAD spiritually as Jesus told Nicodemus what is born "OF SPIRIT IS SPIRIT" and what is born of flesh is flesh. Hence, Adam suffered another kind of death in the day he ate other than BRAIN death and a BRAIN LIFE sinner needs to be "born of the Spirit."

Therefore, SPIRITUAL LIFE was what God imparted to man as one aspect of the image of God and that SPIRITUAL image is what is "renewed" by new birth - born of Spirit is spirit.

The human "spirit" did not cease to exist when Adam sinned but ceased to be a medium for fellowship with God. They that worship God must worship Him "in spirit for God is Spirit." What that aspect of human nature became was a medium for demonic fellowship (Eph. 2:2-3). Death is not cessation but separation.

What your failure and all who believe like you is, is that you attempt to make man no different in essential nature than animal life. However, Solomon says the spirit of animals goes down while the spirt of man goes up. God is Spirit and God can exist in and out of a physical body as demonstrated by the incarnation and man was made in God's SPIRITUAL image and thus has the ability to exist in or out of a physical body. That is precisely why Paul calls the body our "taberncale" or "tent" in which we live and we can be "absent" or "present" in that tabernacle but either way always present with the Lord as the Lord indwells our body and when we leave the body we are "present with the Lord" not anihilated or complete cessation of being.

 

No, you did not answer the question. The question is how do you explain people are raised to condemnation for rejection of Jesus WHEN THEY NEVER HEARD OF JESUS.
Please explain soon, because I would love to tell you what the Word of God says.

 

Our Spirits Live On After The Death Of Our Body

http://christiandefenseofthetruth.wordpress.com/2011/07/12/our-spirits-live-on-after-death-of-the-body/

Faith in Jesus Christ makes those belonging to God perfect, even those who died before Jesus’ ministry on earth. The Old Testament righteous people who died before Jesus came to earth, they did not in their time get to see the promised salvation through Jesus Christ, the grace that was to come (1 Peter 1:10-12; 2 Peter 1:19; Romans 16:25-26; 1 Corinthians 4:1). Paul says about the faithful in the Old Testament times, “These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised. God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect.” God’s grace through faith in Jesus made the spirits of the righteous, those who had died before Jesus, they in the spirit were made perfect together with Paul and the other first Christians (Hebrews 12:23; 11:39-40). The Old Testament faithful were alive in the spirit watching from heaven. Paul says, “Therefore, since we are surrounded by such a great cloud of witnesses…” Jesus also tells us Abraham waited to see his day, Abraham saw it and was glad (John 8:56). Abraham died, yet was alive in the spirit.

There were those who disobeyed and died before Jesus came to earth, though they were dead their spirits went to a prison, unlike the spirits of the righteous. After Jesus was crucified, he preached to those who were dead, he preached to the spirits in prison, the spirits of those who had died and disobeyed long ago (see 1 Peter 3:18-19). Those people who disobeyed and died before learning of Jesus…Jesus preached the gospel to them, so that they might be judged according to men in regard to the body, but live according to God in regard to the spirit (1 Peter 4:5-6). For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring us to God, even those who lived and died before Jesus.

You see, Jesus came to earth and taught those on earth. Then Jesus descended to the spirits in prison to preach to them, to those who disobeyed long ago. Jesus then ascended higher than all the heavens. Jesus filled the whole universe (see Ephesians 4:10).

These scriptures show we have living, thinking spirits that live on after the death of the body. Some spirits go with those who disobey, and spirits of the righteous live in heaven. These scriptures show that our spirits live on, and how Jesus filled the whole universe.

Rejoice at Jesus saving us, and rejoice at knowing without a doubt that the Word of God tells us we have spirits that live on.

 

Trevor, you are missing the point. No one denies that both man and animals share in common PHYSICAL NATURAL life. However, man is created with the capability of SPIRITUAL SUPERNATURAL life.

However, no animial shared in common with man direct origin of his spirit with God. God's "spirit" is not the same as the animal "spirit." God's "soul" is not the same as the "soul" of animals. God is described as a "spirit" and "soul" that exists without a physical body and thus without physical life but is "spirit" and is sustained by SPIRITUAL life. Only man is made in the "image" and "likeness" of God and receives his inner nature directly from God. All other physical life originated from the "waters" or from the "earth. Man's body came from the earth but his spirit came directly from God.

Second no animal "spirit" or "soul" can worship and fellowship with God as they do not have the "spirit" capacity. Worship of God must be done in "spirit" for God's is a "spirit." That is not speaking of oxygen. That is not speaking of attitude but that is speaking an aspect of human nature unlike animals because when Jesus says God is "a spirit" he is defining the substance of God's nature not his attitude or breathing ability. When Paul says "our spirit bears witness with His Spirit" he is not describing oxygen or breathing ability but describing a common substance and nature that makes man and God able to fellowship one with the other. It is in this common spiritual substance or nature where man is renewed in the image of God by regeneration and where he previously was spiritually dead while physically alive. Hence, this cannot refer to oxygen or ability to breath air as the lost condition of man breathed air but was dead spiritually. Death spiritually is not cessation of spirit but separation from God's Spirit, no spiritual union with God, but there was previous spiritual union with demons (Eph. 2:2 "now worketh IN the children of disobedience").

You are confusing a change in the body with the immaterial nature of man. Our physical body is the soul's vehicle of expression to the outer physical world and it is designed to interact with the physcial natural world (five senses; natural drives - sex, food, pleasure, etc.) while our spirit is the vehicle of expresssion to the spiritual world.

The spirit of man has been regenerated but not his body because "what is born of Spirit is spirit" (Jn. 3:6). It is our "inward man" that has been begotten of God not our outward physical body. Our spirit is in union with God and therefore has "eternal life" now in our spirit and that is why the believer shall "never die" even when the physical body dies.

Adam was made a "living SOUL" meaning that his body depended upon NATURAL sustenance for life. His body became subject to death and corruption. In the resurrection our physical body will no longer be subject to corruption and death and therefore no longer derive its life from NATURAL sustenance but will derive its life from the same source that our spirit now derives its life - SPIRITUAL - union with God.

Hence, Paul is dealing with the very change of our MATERIAL nature from a NATURAL derived subsistance to a SPIRITUAL derived subsistance in keeping with our spirit that has already been born of the "Spirit" and is thus being sustained by union with God and therefore we now have SPIRITUAL LIFE which is ETERNAL LIFE within our IMMATERIAL nature and thus unable to die spiritually when our physical body dies. However, in the resurrection the MATERIAL aspect of our human nature will derive its LIFE not from that which is NATURAL but from that which is SPIRITUAL or the same source as our Spirit and therefore will never again be subject to corruption and death because it is no longer dependent upon NATURAL means to sustain its life.

The plural "lives" is grammatically necessary when the subject is plural as in Genesis 7. However, in Genesis 2:7 there is a SINGULAR subject and yet plural "lives." That is the pecularity of the plural in Genesis 2:7. Additionally, this plural "lives" comes directly from God breathing into man these "lives." God does not possess lungs and oxygen and so what is imparted directly from God to man is not AIR but complex lives that originates from God that makes man distinct and different from all other physical living beings. He not only has soulish life or life dependent upon natural substances (food, air, water, comfort) but he has spiritual life dependent upon spiritual union with God.

Man is the only creature made by God that lives on a DUAL plane of both NATURAL and SPIRITUAL and consists of a MATERIAL and IMMATERIAL natures that can fellowship with the EXTERNAL seen physical world as well as the INTERNAL unseen spiritual world. Man is created like God who can subsist in as well as outside of a physical body as clearly seen in the incarnation of the Son of God. Hence, his "spirit" and "soul" are like God's "spirit" and "soul" that return to God but the "spirit" and "soul" of all other material beings are strictly limited to lower natural life and therefore return at death to lower natural sources.

 

In other words, regardless of the Biblical evidence contrary to your beleif, you will continue in your belief!

Hebrews 4:12 along with 1 Thessalonians 5:23 both distinguish between the material and immaterial aspect of human nature and both make a clear distinction in the immaterial aspect of human nature that demand that "spirit" and "soul" are not snynonomous except they are both spirit in substance in contrast to physical in substance and that they do not represent "wind" and "life" but two seats of consciousness within man (self-consciousness; spirit world consciousness).

Hebrews 4:12 is presented by the writer to prove that nothing is hid from God's Word and that the Word of God can distinguish between things that differ.

12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.


Wouldn't you agree there is a valid distinction between the "joints" and "morrow" and "thoughts" versus "intents" of the heart?

In order for you to deny a valid distinction between "soul and spirit" you will have to equally deny there is a valid distinction between "joints and morrow" and "thoughts and intents"!

Hence, there is no valid basis to deny that Hebrews 4:12 clearly states that the "spirit" of man must be distinguished from the "soul" of man.

Now, 1 Thessalonians 5:23 demands that all three aspects of human nature "spirit" and "soul" and "body" are all objects of sanctification by the Spirit of God.

1 Thes. 5:23 ¶ And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Don't you think it is a little bit absurd and rediculous to pray that "breath" and "life" be preserved "blameless" in regard to SANCTIFICATION unto the coming of the Lord?

Hence, sanctification cannot be interpreted merely as being set apart to be preserved as far as duration but rather Paul is demanding a MORAL separation and preservation of "spirit and soul" when he uses the term "sanctify" with "blameless."

In Genesis 2:7 God imparted spiritual substances in the same sense as He himself is attributed a "soul" and "spirit" by the Scriptures WITHOUT A BODY. He does not possess "wind" or "breath" and his "life" is ETERNAL and can exist in and outside of a physical body as proved in the incarnation.

Likewise Paul demands that the body is nothing more than a tent, a house for the human spirit that can exist inside this house or he can depart from this house and continue to exist in the presence of the Lord in heaven.

2 Cor. 5:6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord:
7 (For we walk by faith, not by sight
8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.9 Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him.

Paul uses two Aorist infintives above to show identical action with no time lapse between being absent from the body and present with the Lord.

The Bibilical and grammatical evidence against your position is overwhelming. You simply do not have a single solitary proof text to support your position which cannot be easily demonstrated by its context to have been twisted in order to make it fit your theory.

 

Is there a possibility that what you have been taught is wrong?

These scriptures only teach that the "body" returns to dust not the immatieral part of man as the Bible explicitly says that the spirit of man returns to God but the spirits of animals does return to dust:

Ec 3:21 Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?

Ps 90:10 The days of our years are threescore years and ten; and if by reason of strength they be fourscore years, yet is their strength labour and sorrow; for it is soon cut off, and we fly away

Lu 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham’s bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried;

2Co 5:8 We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

Php 1:23 For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better:

Technically only the "body" is said to return to dust! The spirit of beasts go downward to dust but man's spirit does not. David speaks of flying away when he is "cut off" from the land of the living. Paul says that he will be present with the Lord when he leaves the body.

Paul's langauge speaks of something living in a house and leaving that house and going to be present with the Lord.

 

The scripture does NOT say the spirit of animals go downward. The scriptures says Who knows...
Solomon in Ecclesiastes is speaking through out Ecclesiastes about earthly things. The New Testament speaks to us about spiritual things.

Remember, many of the Jews missed the Messiah because they were expecting a King for an earthly reign. The New Testament has the revelation about what is spiritual.