The real question???

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by mark, Jan 7, 2003.

  1. mark

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    In recent threads hear Masonic organizations and smoking have been attacked. BIG DEAL. Everyone knows smoking is bad for you and is so politically incorrect. The Masons are an easy target because it is a dying organization. The real question is when will we really talk about things the church turns a blind eye. An example is Sports. In the USA sports is the tail the wags the dog. Everyone is a sports fanatic. We have a complete forum here on Sports. I love sports too. BUT one question in the sports forum concerned church plans for Super Bowl Sunday. That Sunday people will cut church or have "special" services around the game. It is ridicuous. I dare a preacher to get up and blast America's real idol from the pulpit.
     
  2. Rick Sr.

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    Hey Mark: I hear you! At our church we never make special provisions for any sports at all. Thoses who choose to skip because of a ballgame are usually the "Sunday Morning Christians". I too am a sports fan, but I have never put it in front of God. Doesn't the Bible say something about this? Rick Sr.
     
  3. Dr. Bob

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    Sports can be a problem, as can just about anything else taken to extreme. But sports per se are NOT evil.

    Tobacco IS a debilitating, filthy habit that is harmful to the body. Any addiction is. So the REAL QUESTION is - what is an idol, a "god" that is controling our church or our lives?

    Know of a baptist church that will NOT have Sunday p.m. service on Super Bowl night. Know another that will have a big "party" type night. And another that will have EXTRA services so that no one can see one minute of the game .. and show themselves more spiritual!!

    Think I'll start a poll on this one.
     
  4. ichthys

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    Watching sports, especially professional sports, seems like a drain on what could otherwise be a productive and useful day in church.

    There HAS to be a better way to draw people into church than a "Super Bowl Blast." Or is that too much to ask today? :mad:

    I don't think that sports is America's "real idol," though it gets a lot of time on television because it's easy to record and replay and follow in the papers.

    Probably anything that gets America's minds off their problems and shortcomings without actually being challenging or confrontational could fit that bill. Church is often too challenging or confrontational for most people. It's more like "diversion" or "entertainment" would be America's real idol..... :(
     
  5. Pete

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    Here in Newcastle, the knights (rugby league team) are the city's gods. A Sunday afternoon home game will get 15-30,000 people depending on the team they are playing.

    At one "church" the pastor got up and said "We are cutting the service short tonight so we can go home and watch the knights on TV." On another occasion the same bloke started a service with "Our beloved knights went down."

    At another "church" from that same denomination, the pastor got up and said the Church would buy the vacant land opposite it, build a stadium there, and the knights would make it their new home ground.

    At the home game when the team's half-back came back from time off due to injury, someone put up a sign saying "god has returned to the stadium."

    ...and all that from JUST ONE sport.

    I once heard a speaker say "Australians worship a trinity...football, beer, and the melbourne cup." He wasn't far wrong.

    Pete
     
  6. blackbird

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    True, I have known pastors AND(bear down on the word and) lay people make decisions concerning the Super Bowl in church---the preacher ain't the only bloke in the church--but by golly he ought to be the smartest one and ignore the bowl day--just go on like it were any other Sunday--no cutting the service short(I'll only do that for the rapture--although I have cut just one short in my 15 year career--I was preaching at a church in Alabama one Sunday nite--stormin' weather outside--when some man busted through the front door yellin---"Tornado comin' this way!!!" and he wasn't kiddin'--)

    anyway,---no Souper Sunday, no dismissin' early, no big screen at the church to watch the game and a sissy-fied Bible devotion during halftime---just a normal service--you wanna come, come! You wanna stay home and watch the game--stay--but those who stay will be the ones getting robbed!!

    Your friend,
    Blackbird
     
  7. Bro. Curtis

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    AMEN!!! Nobody loves football more than me, but I won't miss church to watch it. I don't want a T.V. in our church. We will have a normal service, and probably miss the first quarter, like we always do. You know what ? We have a great time anyways!!!!!
     
  8. All about Grace

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    Don't forget in all of the sanctimonious "we will not cancel church for the Super Bowl" hype that events such as the SB can be great tools for believers to build relationships with unbelievers (for the purpose of sharing the gospel).

    We could delve into the whole discussion on the biblical precedence for having or not having Sunday evening services as a whole, but that might open a can of worms larger than this thread can handle. ;)
     
  9. mark

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    Dr. Bob, Stressing first that I am not a smoker or drinker. Smoking does keep people from church the way sports can. Therefore, I'd say sports can be even more dangerous.
    However my point here is that we should maybe look, not so much at targets that are no longer hot topics, like smoking and the Masons, and focus on the things hurting the faith today( not yesterday).
     
  10. Wisdom Seeker

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    Well, my Pastor always makes a statement about Super Bowl Sunday...and how church is more important...and the way he does it...is very jokingly...but effective.

    Sports aren't a big problem at our church...Yes, there are many sports enthusiasts...but not many of them skip church to watch a game...even when it's the Super Bowl.

    And for us personally...my family that is...we don't watch sports on the tube...it just never occurs to us. My husband is the first man I've ever met who wasn't into it...He plays, he'll go to a game...but he won't watch it on T.V....isn't that weird? [​IMG]
     
  11. mark

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    I wrote this in the Mason Organization thread, but I think it fits better here.
    Every Sunday in the fall and winter 66,000 people in St. Louis and the surrounding area "tithe" $39 to $47 to worship their Rams and their high priest, Kurt Warner (who is a Christian). They arrive hours before the service to fellowhip with their brother and sister Rams fans. Tens of thousands more faithfully follow the worship service on on TV, while millions every Sunday tune into their local "services" from the Meadowlands, Pro Palyer Stadium and Arlington Stadium. I, myself, am often a participant in this worship. Sports is the true religion of America, but you all go ahead and worry about this handful of old men meeting in secret and enjoying a chili dinner together once a month. I can see they are the true threat to Christendom. SARCASM ALERT!
     
  12. Bro. James Reed

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    I hear what you all are saying. I would never miss church so I could watch a football, baseball, basketball game.

    My dad will miss once in a while if the Cowboys are playing earlier than noon on a Sunday, but he is not a member of the church.

    I think the bigger problem for us is NASCAR.

    People WILL miss in order to watch NASCAR.

    My question is, why do they knowingly put these events on TV during church hours, i.e. 9am-12pm, roughly.

    They know most people will be in church. They would get more viewers if they had sports on later than that.

    Whatever happened to the days when stores weren't even open on Sundays?

    I hate to see people get so busy and caught up in the world that they think they don't have time to go to church.

    Jesus died for our sins so we could have eternal life. Yet, many people can't find 1-2 hours per week to devote back to Him for His sacrifice. That is a shame.

    If He happens to come back on a Sunday morning, I hope He finds me in a church house giving praise to His name, not sitting in front of the TV cursing at the wide receiver for missing the ball.

    God Bless. Bro. James
     
  13. mark

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    Bro James, I thought about bringing up NASCAR because I watch more races than football too, but you are understanding my point exactly. Thanks for the post.
     
  14. Dr. Bob

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    Am I missing something?

    How do we equate "watching a ball game" with "worship" or church?

    Apples and oranges. If I go to see a ball game, I am NOT worshiping a team, setting up a QB as high priest, et al.

    When I go to the symphony tomorrow night, I will not be going to "church" and lauding a conductor!

    Apples and oranges and not even a good debate.
     
  15. mark

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    I disagree, Dr. Bob, I think it is an important debate, given the recent threads lambasting (is that spelled right?) involvement with the Masons. Many postings here talk about the Masons as a dangerous religion. I maintain that the Masons are not a religion and certainly not dangerous. A bunch of men meet once a month and have a meeting. They pay dues of maybe $50 a year and its just a dying organization. On the other hand, as I pointed out in the earlier post, many more people are totally dedicated to their teams. Maybe you experience is very difference from mine, but I know more people people who are devoted and loyal to their team than to their church. I certainly know more people totally dedicated to their team than to their lodge. Sports in America is more than "just watching a game".
     
  16. Scott J

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    When I moved to Missouri about this time last year, I went out looking for a place to visit church on Super Bowl Sunday night. None of the Baptist churches in town were open. None of them stayed on my list of potential churches... not because Sunday nigth service is a Bible command but because I considered it an indication of their faithfulness. Afterwards, a deacon of one of the churches confirmed my thought when he said bluntly that they wouldn't have enough people show up to have a service.

    I love football but seldom watch the NFL because I find parity boring. I didn't watch the NCAA championship game and probably won't watch the SB either.

    [ January 10, 2003, 12:15 PM: Message edited by: Scott J ]
     
  17. mark

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    Thank you Scott for making my point, an idol is something you put before the one true God.
     
  18. Bro. James Reed

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    Dr. Bob, I don't think your understanding the point exactly.

    Mark is saying that we shouldn't put these things in front of our church.

    If we are missing church to stay home and watch the game or to go see the game in person, what are we devoting our time to?

    I don't think most people out and out worship sports, but when we put things before God and the church, we are getting about as close to committing idolatry as you can get.

    He's not saying to give up sports, but he IS saying that to give up church for sports is wrong.

    I think you would agree with this.

    God Bless. Bro. James
     
  19. Artimaeus

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    I certainly agree that sports is more important to some people than church and if it is then they are ones who need to respond to Elijah and "Choose you this day whom you will serve?" There is a reason the first commanment is "Thou shalt have no other gods before me." Because if God isn't first then nothing else matters. I applaud your efforts to get people to get their priorities in order. I would just add that I will not be made to feel guilty because I want to watch my kid play little league or even that I enjoy watching my favorite college basketball team whip up on your favorite college basketball team. [​IMG] Too musch of most things is not good, especially if it interferes with your Christian priorities.
     
  20. mark

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    Well Artimaeus
    I believe in special dispensation for Kentucky fans. If they were my team instead of Iowa and Iowa State and Drake (an all star team of all 3 would struggle against Kentucky) I would not feel guilty either. ;) I think I have probably beaten this horse long enough. Lets all agree not to go to Mason Meetings and to tape our favorite teams and not miss church! Rah!
     

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