Tim Warner

Discussion in '2005 Archive' started by Seeker Of Truth, Apr 2, 2005.

  1. Seeker Of Truth

    Seeker Of Truth
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    Tim Warner of www.lasttrumpet.com is a fundamental baptist. He is a post-tribulationist and is a progressive dispensationalist.

    In the last few years it seems to me that he is falling away from biblical truth.

    He rejects the doctrine of eternal security and he holds to a form of baptismal regeneration.

    As of last year he now hold to this position on water baptism. He believes it's necessary for salvation. I try emailing him many times but I never got a response.

    Is he a pastor of a church? He has debated on different topics before I would like to see him debate his views on this board.

    Any comments about him would be appreciated.
     
  2. gopchad

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    He is a false teacher from what I have found on his website. Not because of his eschatology, but because of his soteriology. He definitely believes baptismal regeneration, and goes on to say that man does not receive the baptism of the Spirit at the moment of salvation, but when he is baptized in water. He came out of the Plymouth Bretheren, and was ordained an Independent Baptist in 1992, now he sounds like he belongs in the Church of Christ. I'd stay away from this guy if I were you.

    Chad
     
  3. Paul33

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    If you understand where he is coming from, what are you so afraid of?

    I don't know if you assessment is true, but if he believes baptism is the moment in time when the Holy Spirit regenerates, well, then he and I would disagree. But now I have to stay away from him? Why?

    I bet you believe that saying a prayer to ask "Jesus into your heart" is the moment in time when the Holy Spirit regenerates. Am I right? If so, should I stay away from you? The Bible never says "asking Jesus into your heart" saves you. It says, "Confess with your mouth, Jesus is Lord!"

    Do I need to stay away from you?
     
  4. gopchad

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    I do, and am not afraid, but I don't know where the poster is spiritually. If he is seeking, I don't think it is wise for a seeker to spend alot of time on a false teacher's website. It's called using good sense.

    I would read his website for yourself. You would see if my assessment was true and not spout off as you did in ignorance. I never said for you to stay away from him, I recommended that SEEKER of TRUTH stay away. A person seeking TRUTH should spend time on websites that contain the TRUTH.

    A simple perusal of my recent posts would have shown you what a foolish statement you just made. If I do not know much about a poster, I read his recent posts. Had you done this, you would have seen that I recently posted strongly against easy believism. Faith and repentance yield regeneration. Faith and repentance are shown as you say in confessing Jesus as Lord. Confessing here meaning to the say the same thing about. Seems to me that we are on the same page in our soteriology.

    No, I'd stick around if I were you. You may learn something. :D

    Chad
     
  5. Brutus

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    In looking at his doctrinal statement I see nowhere the mention of baptismal regeneration. I didn't ake the time to read any of the posted articles. But his statement of faith is right on with what most people on here believe.
     
  6. Paul33

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    I have read Warner's site, too. And I also have not seen what was alleged about Warner. So I have read his site but was being humble. Maybe I missed something.

    I'll stick around Chad as soon as I get out of the hospital from the beating you gave me. [​IMG]

    You're really rough when you spout!
     
  7. Paul33

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    The offending doctrine (from Warner's site):

    5. Salvation - God is ready and willing to save anyone who obeys the Gospel. Obeying the Gospel requires hearing the Gospel, believing the message of the Gospel, turning from sin (repentance) to Christ, and being baptized. The moment he obeys the Gospel, God forgives and sets him free from sins, adopts him into the family of God, and baptizes him in the Spirit. Salvation is ultimately of the whole person, spirit, soul, and body. But, salvation of the body awaits the resurrection of the flesh "at His coming." Perseverance in our faith unto the end of life is necessary for our salvation to be complete.

    Sounds like Church of Christ doctrine.

    I believe God regenerates by His Spirit so that we believe, repent, and confess that Jesus is Lord. Then, upon being saved, we give evidence of it to others publickly by being baptized. Do I think Warner is wrong. Yes. Would I separate from him. No.

    He thinks the moment in time when salvation occurs is at the baptism. I think that it is at confession, which results in baptism. He believes that baptism is that confession.

    As to perservence. I agree. Only true saints perservere to the end.
     
  8. tfisher1

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    I think I read somewhere on his site that he is a lay person and owns an autobody shop or something, I could be wrong...

    Regardless, I have read the articles on his site several times as they seem to make alot of sense. I've been studying alternate end-times views after being raised pre-trib. For whatever reason I keep coming back to his site, and a leaning towards a post-tribulational view.

    Todd
     
  9. Seeker Of Truth

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    I agree that Tim Warner view on water baptism is more like the church of christ than baptist. You guys overlooked the fact that he rejects the doctrine of eternal security. He believes in conditional security like the church of christ.

    The reason I visited his site because I also lean to the post trib rapture view like Tim. But it appears to me like he is falling from orthodoxy with his belief that baptism is necessary for salvation. I believe James White has a response at his website.
     
  10. Paul33

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    He probaby take his position from Acts 2.

    I think he is right on about end times.

    From his doctrinal statement he seems to believe in "perseverence of the Saints."

    I think that true saints persevere and others fall away. However, some don't even give an indication of falling away and are still told by Christ, "Depart from me, I never knew you."

    True faith works! So if I am truly regenerated, I will persevere to the end.

    I'm only going by one sentence that he put in his doctrinal statement.
     
  11. gopchad

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    A man who says that baptism is required for one's salvation is a false teacher. A man who adds baptism to faith is not saved. He is depending on a work of the flesh and not on Christ alone.

    I believe that true believers will persevere and can even be restored to fellowship from a backslidden condition because they are sealed by the Holy Ghost.

    Paul... sorry I went so hard on you. Actually you seem from your comments to be more Calvinistic than I lean. I still think your wrong about Warner. There is no way I'd not separate from him.

    Chad
     
  12. Dr. Bob

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    Have not seen any post-trib'er that I would classify as "fundamental". Just my opinion.
     
  13. gopchad

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    I agree. They always seem to have what I consider other problem areas. While it may be possible to find one, I just never have.

    Chad
     
  14. Seeker Of Truth

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  15. Paul33

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    Presbyterian Church of America is fundamentalist and post-trib and/or amill.
     
  16. Paul33

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    Fundamentalism of the 20s didn't require a pre-trib, dispensational theology, though some were pushing for it, and it eventually became a "fundamental" among independent Baptists!
     
  17. Seeker Of Truth

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    Bible Presbyterians are fundamentalists and post-tribbers. I would like to see Warner debate someone on line on baptism. Since he has debated before on the timing of the rapture and preterism, why not on baptism? Let's email him and see if he is willing.
     

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