Understanding Jesus as God...

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by jcf, Feb 11, 2005.

  1. jcf

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    Understanding Jesus as God

    To understand Jesus as God we will start with the first commandment.

    Exodus 20:3 Thu shalt have no other gods before me.

    Notice how our heavenly Father says no other gods with an "s", this means there are other gods out there.

    2 Corinthians 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

    Don't think of the word god as being a person but rather think of it as being a title or position of authority.

    Our Father is telling us in the first commandment not to have anyone or anything rule in our lives in His place.

    To have someone or something rule in our lives other than the one true God means it has authority over us, in other words, it controls us and we allow it to.

    Our Father tells us in the first commandment that this should not be so.

    The only authority we should have governing our lives is the authority of our heavenly Father, the one who created us.

    Now, we know our heavenly Father is Spirit.

    John 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

    Spirit has to do with thoughts, thoughts have to do with words, words express will.

    When our Father speaks words these words carry His authority.

    When our Father anoints someone or something to speak His words, that person is given the title (god) whether he be an angel or a man.

    John 10:34-35 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods? If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

    If you are called by the Father to bring His word, He gives you the title of authority to act and do His will.

    Our Father has even given this title to angels who are standing in for the Father at certain times.

    Exodus 23:20-22 Behold, I send an Angel before thee, to keep thee in the way, and to bring thee into the place which I have prepared. Beware of him, and obey his voice, provoke him not; for he will not pardon your transgressions: for My name is in him. But if thou shalt indeed obey his voice, and do all that I speak; then I will be an enemy unto thine enemies, and an adversary unto thine adversaries.

    Our Father gives His name or authority to whom He uses to bring His word and do His will.

    Jesus was given this title of authority because He did His Fathers will, He spoke His Father's words.

    John 7:16 Jesus answered them and said, "My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me.

    John 14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

    Jesus learned obedience through the things that He suffered which gave Him the right to the title given to Him by His Father.

    Hebrews 5:8 though He was a Son, yet He learned obedience by the things which He suffered.

    Acts 2:36 "Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly that God has made this Jesus, whom you crucified, both Lord and Christ.''

    Jesus' Father made Jesus Lord and Christ.

    John 20:17 Jesus saith unto her, Touch me not; for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren, and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father, and your Father; and to my God, and your God.

    Jesus has a God, it's His Father.

    Ephesians 1:20-22 Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places, Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come: And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

    The Father and God of Jesus gave Jesus authority over all names, dominions, powers and principalities. God the Father of Jesus put all things under Him in other words, Jesus is given the title and position of authority.

    Why would the Father give Jesus authority over all things?

    1 Corinthians 15:27-28 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith, all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is accepted, which did put all things under him. Now when all things are made subject to Him, then the Son Himself will also be subject to Him who put all things under Him, that God may be all in all.

    The Father put all things under the authority of Jesus so that Jesus, being under His Father's authority, could restore His Father creation unto Him. Notice that Jesus is still under the Father's authority even after being resurrected and being seated at His Father's right hand. This nullifies the co-equal doctrine of the co-eternal doctrine.

    So you see, Jesus is God because He was obedient to the Father's will in being a vessel used by the Father to do His will and bring His word to us because of this, He was given a name above all names through His inheritance.

    Hebrews 1:4 having become so much better than the angels, as He has by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.

    How was Jesus able to bring the truth about our heavenly Father to us? Because Jesus was given the Spirit without measure.

    John 3:34 For he whom God hath sent speaketh the words of God: for God giveth not the Spirit by measure unto him.

    Jesus is the only one the Father is pleased to have rule in our lives and the Father is the only one who rules over Jesus' life.

    1 Corinthians 11:3 But I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.

    To have Jesus rule as God in our lives is not idolatry because God our Father calls us to do this so when we obey Him He still holds His place as the ONE TRUE GOD.

    Jesus is not the Father and the Father is not the Son. The Father and the Son are one in will and in purpose in bringing about restoration.

    John 10:30 I and my Father are one.

    They are one in will and in purpose just as we can be one with Jesus and the Father in will and purpose, this is why Jesus came.

    John 17:20-22 "I do not pray for these alone, but also for those who will believe in Me through their word "that they all may be one, as You, Father, are in Me, and I in You; that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me. "And the glory which You gave Me I have given them, that they may be one just as We are one:

    Jesus is our Father in the sense that He is the Father of everlasting life, He authored it.

    Hebrews 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

    Jesus is the Father of everlasting life because He brought it about, in other words, He is the father of it.

    Isaiah 9:6-7 For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, the everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace. Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even forever. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.

    Notice these verses in the Old Testament telling us that Jesus shall be called, Father of everlasting, mighty God, because it is not yet so.

    Jesus is the father of everlasting life because He authored it just like the devil is the father of lies because authored it.

    John 8:44 "You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.

    Jesus is the Father of everlasting life, He is mighty God not Almighty God.

    2 Corinthians 5:19 that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

    God was in Jesus working through Jesus, Jesus had to be obedient.

    Acts 2:22 "Men of Israel, hear these words: Jesus of Nazareth, a man attested to you by God with mighty works and wonders and signs which God did through him in your midst, as you yourselves know--

    Jesus is the Christ (anointed) a man anointed of God, God was with Him.

    Acts 10:38 how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and with power; how he went about doing good and healing all that were oppressed by the devil, for God was with him.

    Who is a liar and antichrist is one who denies that the Father has a Son who is an anointed man.

    1 John 2:22 Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ (anointed)? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son.

    Jesus, the Christ/anonited man, is the mediator between God and men.

    1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

    Peace, love and joy in Christ,
    John
     
  2. jcf

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    Read this post and it will answer most of your questions regarding how Jesus is God.
     
  3. ONENESS

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    Do you not believe that Jesus is God?
     
  4. jcf

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    Hi Oneness,

    Do I believe Jesus is God?

    God as far as being judge, ruler, authority over all things as His Father gave to him, yes I believe Jesus is this.

    Do I believe Jesus is YAHWEH, eternal, immortal-unable to die, unseen and who dwells in an unapproachable light, no and neither does He.
     
  5. KeeperOfMyHome

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    Isaiah 9:6 clearly teaches that He (Jesus) is the everlasting Father. How can you argue against that?

    Julia
     
  6. El_Guero

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    JCF

    Do you believe that Jesus is the angel Michael? Or do you believe that He is the Eternal Creator?

    In the Name ... of the Creator
     
  7. ONENESS

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    Hi Oneness,

    Do I believe Jesus is God?

    God as far as being judge, ruler, authority over all things as His Father gave to him, yes I believe Jesus is this.

    Do I believe Jesus is YAHWEH, eternal, immortal-unable to die, unseen and who dwells in an unapproachable light, no and neither does He.
    </font>[/QUOTE]Isa 43:11 I, [even] I, [am] the LORD; and beside me [there is] no saviour.

    There is only One God. In your terms, there is only One YAHWEH. And we know him as Jesus.

    Mat 1:23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

    Deu 6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God [is] one LORD:

    The bible declares there is Only ONE Lord. Eph 4:5.

    There's not two people in heaven declaring to be God. There is only One in Heaven, and that is our Father, the Lord Jesus Christ.
     
  8. Marcia

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    Jesus is not the God the Father. This is a heresy.

    I've posted the info on Is 9.6 before. This is from the NET Bible:
     
  9. Marcia

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    More info.
     
  10. Marcia

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    Jesus is God the Son and is not God the Father.
     
  11. jcf

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    Do you believe that Jesus is the angel Michael? Or do you believe that He is the Eternal Creator?

    In the Name ... of the Creator
    </font>[/QUOTE]I do not believe Jesus is Michael the archangel and neither do I believe that Jesus created the world we now see and live in and neither do the Scripture teach this.

    Jesus is the promised Messiah, the Christ, the Son of the living God.
     
  12. ONENESS

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    </font>[/QUOTE]COOL...Col 2:9 says For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

    Everything that God is is found in the Person of Jesus Christ.

    We can get into a oneness debate if you would like, but that would be another topoic or we could pull up the "oh hidden archives". Lots of good stuff in there. Right Lorelie? LOL...can't wait to chat with you again. Feels like old times almost.

    Thanks.
     
  13. Marcia

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    One more:
     
  14. ONENESS

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    </font>[/QUOTE]
    Show me one verse in the entire bible where Jesus is referred to as "God the Son"? There is a diffrence b/t the phrases "Son of God" and "God the Son"

    Over 50 times you will see he is referred to as "The Son of Gode" never once does it mention anything abou t him being called "God the Son".

    Lord Bless
     
  15. Marcia

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    Col 2.9 does not mean Jesus is God the Father, but that he is God. Jesus and God share the same divine nature but are distinct persons in the Godhead.

    I've already debated this several times in this forum with MEE and others who defend the anti-Trinitarian view. I would prefer not to give Oneness people further platforms with which false views are propagated.
     
  16. KeeperOfMyHome

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    Yes, I suppose that was a bad way to word that. I am not of the Oneness camp. [​IMG] I'm very much an independent Baptist who sometimes trips over her own two feet. ;)

    Julia
     
  17. ONENESS

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    Col 2.9 does not mean Jesus is God the Father, but that he is God. Jesus and God share the same divine nature but are distinct persons in the Godhead.

    I've already debated this several times in this forum with MEE and others who defend the anti-Trinitarian view. I would prefer not to give Oneness people further platforms with which false views are propagated.
    </font>[/QUOTE]Well, then don't. I'm not asking you too. I can show you time in time again where the Apostles baptized in the Name of Jesus. Can you show me once where they were baptized with titles Father Son and Holy Ghost?

    Mat 28:19's fullfiillment = Acts 2:38.

    Sorry for the short repsonce, trying to get ready for work.

    See you all later today.
     
  18. El_Guero

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    Whoa there hotrod!

    What group do you identify with?

     
  19. jcf

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    </font>[/QUOTE]I hope I'm a Chevy hotrod. [​IMG]
     
  20. DHK

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    </font>[/QUOTE]I hope I'm a Chevy hotrod. [​IMG] </font>[/QUOTE]More acurately you are in heresy. Denying that Christ is the Creator is one of the most grievous heresies one could post.

    Col.1:16 "For by him (Christ) were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: ALL things were created by him, and for him.
    17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist."

    John 1:3 All things were made by him (Christ); and without him was not any thing made that was made.

    You either believe the Bible or you don't. Apparently you don't.
    DHK
     

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