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Unequally Yoked

Discussion in '2000-02 Archive' started by HappyBaptist, Feb 11, 2002.

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  1. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

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    What do you mean about Joseph and his wife. Wasn't he unequally yoked? If my child wanted to marry an unsaved person and I believed that God wanted Joseph to marry an unsaved person, my child will have a case, so to speak.

    So, you are saying that Nicodemus should have already known about salvation before Christ actually died on the cross? That is how I am understanding you. Which, I agree with.

    HB, no one has a case if they want to marry an unsaved person. Scripture forbids it in the N.T. and the O.T. Joseph lived prior to the law but the principles of marriage were already in place. Lamech (just a few generations from Adam) took two wives and violated God's law. I think it is an assumption to say that Joseph's wife was lost. I realize she had a pagan name, but Daniel did too (Belteshazzar?), along with Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego.

    I am saying that Nicodemus should have known about being born-again. Read John 3 again. Jesus said something to the affect of: Are you not a teacher in Israel, and you do not know these things? The prophets said that one must be washed by the Spirit. Moses said that one must be circumcised in heart. That is the same description one finds in the N.T. writers.
     
    #21 Daniel David, Feb 12, 2002
  2. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
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    I think clearly that OT saints knew about being "born again." There is no doubt about that. It is the relationship of "born again" to "believe in the Messiah to come" that is at issue.
     
    #22 Pastor Larry, Feb 12, 2002
  3. Glory Bound

    Glory Bound New Member

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    I think it's a bad idea to take these "types" too far. While Joseph may exhibit a number of characteristics of Christ, and thus be called a "type", these things only go so far. Otherwise, Joseph would have to be perfect, like Christ.

    I wouldn't get too hung up over this. I get hung up over too many other things as it is! :D
     
    #23 Glory Bound, Feb 12, 2002
  4. HappyBaptist

    HappyBaptist New Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Pastor Larry:
    I think clearly that OT saints knew about being "born again." There is no doubt about that. It is the relationship of "born again" to "believe in the Messiah to come" that is at issue.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    I have assumed that at least the disciples thought that Jesus would reign in Isreal during thier life time. Although the Saviour was promised I cannot be sure that it was revealed to the Christians of Christ's day. I think that it was not revealed to them because for a specific reason. I am not sure that I am explaining this right. I believe that the OT Christians look for thier Saviour but that the Christians in the day of Christ did not understand fully. Again, when I have a moment, I will look more thoroughly into the Scripture. Thank you for the challenge!

    [​IMG]
     
    #24 HappyBaptist, Feb 12, 2002
  5. HappyBaptist

    HappyBaptist New Member

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    GloryBound,

    Thank you.My entire point is that too much emphasis is being put on Joseph. He was a sinner saved by grace just like the rest of us. Either he made a mistake in this marriage or by some miracle (in her culture) his new wife was saved! :cool:
     
    #25 HappyBaptist, Feb 12, 2002
  6. HappyBaptist

    HappyBaptist New Member

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    It is the relationship of "born again" to "believe in the Messiah to come" that is at issue.-Pastor Larry

    I don't know how anyone could read Isaiah 53 and not realize that their trust is in Him. His discription as the Messiah to com is very clear to me. I understand that what you are looking for is 'I am the way...' which I guess you might see when Moses asked 'who should I say sends me?' and God replied 'I AM' and I believe that the same answer came from the burning bush.

    MY FATHER SHARED WITH ME:
    Most O.T.references are pictures and shadows
    of Christ to come. Romans 4 shows that Abraham believed God and it was counted to him for righteousness. When God clothed Adam and Eve with "Buckskins" of course
    that was a Blood sacrifice. Goes with 2 Cor.5:21,plus other verses in that chapter. I believe that when Abraham went up on the mountain to offer his beloved son as a sacrifice and Issac said,Where is the lamb for a burnt offering? Abraham said,God will provide "himself" a lamb for a burnt
    offering.(Gen.22:7-8) John 8:56,Your father Abraham re-joiced to see my day;and he saw it and was glad.

    The O.T.Tabernacle is a picture of Christ. John 1:14,the word "dwelt" is the word "tabernacled". There are several books
    on the Tabernacle which show that every aspect and article,within and without,pictured Christ. The book of
    Hebrews deals with the Tabernacle and priesthood. Read Heb.9:11-12. The show bread in the Tabernacle,Jesus said,I am that bread. The lamps,Jesus said,I am the light.
    The veil in the Tabernacle and later in the Temple was a type of Christ.It separated the most holy place where the glory of God was from the room where the high priest
    ministered.He entered the most holy with blood once a year. When Christ died on the cross the veil was torn from top to bottom thus signifying that we have access to God
    through Christ.Heb.9:7-8 & Mt.27:51 & Heb.10:20
    Psa.22 is very prophetic. Some
    are pictures,some are types,some are prophetic. Isaiah 53 is very prophetic. No one person could fulfill all the prophecies
    except Christ.The odds that it could happen can't find enough numbers. Not even one in a trillion. There are not enough trillions. How could someone know that soldiers would roll dice for His garment? How could they know He would be placed in a borrowed rich man's tomb? How could they know He would be betrayed for 30 pieces of silver. Even Jesus
    had no human control over those things. For the many things prophecied to happen it would be utterly impossible except
    the Bible is God's word and is true.It all was fulfilled in Christ. But, all was prophesied in the OT.
     
    #26 HappyBaptist, Feb 12, 2002
  7. Speedpass

    Speedpass Active Member
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    Didn't Hosea marry a woman who did not know the Lord?
     
    #27 Speedpass, Feb 16, 2002
  8. Chris Temple

    Chris Temple New Member

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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NewBeliever:
    How can Joseph be born-again when Jesus has not yet lived and died for our sins? I know that the Jews were saved by God, but they needed to make sacrifices to Him to atone for their sins. Isn't being born-again a NT concept? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    OT saints were saved in the same manner as are all of God's people in all ages- by grace, through faith. The OT saints were regenerated (born from above, or born again)so that they would have faith.

    The PT sacrificial system never saved anyone - they were put in place in order to show that sins had to be forgiven by substitutionary blood atonement - eventually to be fulfilled in Christ.
     
    #28 Chris Temple, Feb 16, 2002
  9. Pastor Larry

    Pastor Larry <b>Moderator</b>
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    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HappyBaptist:
    I don't know how anyone could read Isaiah 53 and not realize that their trust is in Him. His discription as the Messiah to com is very clear to me.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    But you have the benefit of the NT. Where in Isaiah 53 is "belief" in this person commanded? It is not there.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I understand that what you are looking for is 'I am the way...' which I guess you might see when Moses asked 'who should I say sends me?' and God replied 'I AM' and I believe that the same answer came from the burning bush.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    What led you to think that this was about salvation through Christ? It is not in the text. That is about who was giving Moses the authority to lead the Israelites out of bondage. It is not about belief in Christ for salvation.

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Most O.T.references are pictures and shadows of Christ to come. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    First, I disagree; second, it is not the issue. No one denies that the OT has prophecies of Christ. It is the requirements for salvation that are at issue. Abraham believed God and it was counted to him for righteouness. In the context, it has to with the promise of a numerous seed that would come from his own body. It did not have to do with Messiah who would take away sins. Adam and Eve did have a blood shed to make them coats but there is no indication that they were to believe in what that sacrifice represented. This is what I mean by reading into Scripture something that is not there.

    Abraham and Isaac is a misinterpretation. The text does not say "God will provide himself" but rather "God will proved for himself." It is a grammatical issue in the Hebrew text.

    All the pictures of the OT (though I think many of the ones you list are wrong) do not commande belief and that is the issue.

    Chris is right that all OT saints were saved just like everyone else -- by grace through faith. However, the content of that faith is different in different ages as revealed to us in Scripture.
     
    #29 Pastor Larry, Feb 16, 2002
  10. Bible Believing Bill

    Bible Believing Bill <img src =/bbb.jpg>

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    Chris thanks for the to the point answer to my question. It basically confirmed what was forming in my mind from many of the post in this thread, but its good to see someone put it into words.

    Bill
     
    #30 Bible Believing Bill, Feb 18, 2002
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