What does the Bible say about homosexuality?

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by Bible-boy, Jun 23, 2003.

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Is the author correct in her interpretation of the Bible?

  1. Yes, she is clearly a great Bible Scholar!

    100.0%
  2. No, she has misinterpretated the Word of God!

    0 vote(s)
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  1. Bible-boy

    Bible-boy
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    I ran across this website written by at graduate of the Pensacola Christian College. On the website she explains her interpretation of several passages of Scripture regarding homosexuality. Here is the link to the site Homosexuality and the Bible Please read through her interpretations and answer the following poll.
     
  2. Artimaeus

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    II Pet 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

    Now just sit back and watch the WWF (Woefully Wicked Folks) "wrestle" the following verses.

    Lev 22:22 ‘You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination.

    Lev 20:13 ‘If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltiness is upon them.

    Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
    19 because that which is known about God is evident within them; for God made it evident to them. 20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse. 21 For even though they knew God, they did not honor Him as God or give thanks, but they became futile in their speculations, and their foolish heart was darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures. 24 Therefore God gave them over in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, so that their bodies would be dishonored among them. 25 For they exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. 26 For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, 27 and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. 28 And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, 30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful; 32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them.
     
  3. Baptist Believer

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    While she makes a few good points here and there, she apparently does not want to consider interpretations of those "controversial" passages that are more consistent with the rest of the Christian message.

    Furthermore, she seems to have been indoctrinated when she was a child to believe that feelings of affection toward her female teachers and female friends was necessarily lesbian in nature. :eek: Boys and girls usually associate primarily with their own gender at those ages as a normal part of childhood development. They look for acceptance from each other as being male and female before the hormones start kicking in and then they start to consider the opposite sex much more interesting.

    While I certainly believe that issues of homosexuality have a biological component, there also always seems to be a matter of nuture involved (in this case, this woman believing that her normal feelings of affection for her female friends and teachers somehow made her a lesbian).

    [ June 23, 2003, 10:56 AM: Message edited by: Baptist Believer ]
     
  4. christine

    christine
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    BaptistBeliever, I agree with your assessment. At that age it is a normal emotion for a child to have, it would be "hero worship", admiration.
    There is nothing abnormal about same sex people having love for one another, it is a different type of love then male-female.
    You are also right about the hormones. Small children do not feel "attraction" syone, at that.
    Homosexuality is not ok, it is sin.
    Christine.
     
  5. Jailminister

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    Sodomy is not normal or natural. There is NOTHING productive that can come out of being a Sodomite. How can Gos bless something that he called an abomination.
     
  6. dianetavegia

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    I agree with Jailminister. God is VERY clear about how He views homosexuality.

    Diane
     
  7. John Wells

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    "just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire." (Jude 7)

    I wonder why this was not included in her exhaustive list of scriptures dealing with the sin of Sodom? It will be interesting to see how the three who have voted in her favor tap dance around "strange flesh." :rolleyes:

    The young lady is a classic case of someone who worships a god she has remade into an image that she wants rather than worshipping the God who is.
     
  8. Larry in Tennessee

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    She is using the typical "I was born this way" defense. It is sad that people who claim Jesus as Lord and Savior try to excuse sin in their lives instead of repenting.

    In a manner of speaking, "I was born this way" is a correct assesment, if we consider that homosexuality is not the real problem, sin is. We are all born with a sinful nature, and homosexuality is a symptom of that sinful nature for some people. However, we have no excuse to continue in a lifestyle of sin after we have been cleansed by the Blood.

    By trying to misrepresent God's Word in order to excuse her lifestyle, she is only decieving herself, and, unfortunately, others who read her opinions. I pray that the Lord will open her eyes, and convict her, so that she may repent.
     
  9. Word Traveler

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    Hi guys, Let's suppose . . . And I am only supposing! . . . that some girls are born with some gene that makes them more masculine, and some guys have some gene that makes them effeminate. SO WHAT? We all have a hard row to hoe in life! Some of us have a very short temper, but that doesn't excuse our lashing out at others, even committing murder in some instances! Sin is sin. And tendencies toward homosexuality doesn't excuse giving in, and committing the act of "abomination" God says it is! In Christ, WT
     
  10. Bible-boy

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    Thank you all for your posts. I must say that I agree with almost everything that you all have stated. However, I would really like to hear from one of the five BB members (so far) who voted that the young lady is a real biblical scholar and that she used sound hermeneutics and solid exgesis.

    Thanks,

    BibleboyII
     
  11. John Wells

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    The whole "I was born with this genetically controlled tendency" does not hold water. I was born with a genetic "high risk" of becoming alcoholic. Does that give me a right to become an alcoholic? Does it give me free reign to practice being a drunk?

    We cannot be postive about what the Apostle Paul's thorn in the flesh was, but we can draw from his attitude about it:

    But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness.” Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ’s power may rest on me. That is why, for Christ’s sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong. (2 Corinthians 12:9-10)

    In the same way, I am obligated as a believer to trust in God's power to overcome my weaknesses (genetic and personality deficiencies). Though I couldn't overcome alcoholism without Him, I have with Him!!! If a practicing homosexual loved Jesus more than themselves and their desires, they too could overcome their "thorn in the flesh!" I have met quite a few who have and have a strong testimony! ;)
     
  12. Major B

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    I have no particular inclination to sexual sin, but I have a temper.

    I have a friend who is gentle and even tempered, but he really has to watch his dealings with women...

    We all have our tendencies, our "besetting sins," but those are not excuses.

    Jesus says "follow me." Anyone who does not understand that this includes an ethical and behavioral aspect just doesn't get it.
     
  13. Felix

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    Would you really want to have a debate with someone who views hermeneutics and exegesis 'that' way? I would not. I am not even sure if I could have a meaningful conversation with them.

    Anyway. I think it is the author of that article who voted there 5 times with different ID's. [​IMG]

    Pardi [​IMG]
     
  14. Bible-boy

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    Okay, so far five people have voted that they agree with the young lady who authored that web page. However, not one person who agrees with her has even attempted to post a response stating why they agree with her or attempting to support their beliefs from a biblical prospective. We can't have much of a discussion on this topic without those who agree with this young lady's interpretation of the Bible posting something. How about it?
     
  15. Elnora

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    I voted with the other 28. You have to do a lot of twisting to come to her conclusion.
     
  16. latterrain77

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    Hi John. You can't have a "nation" of people through homosexual union. The populated Sodomite Nation existed as a result of HETEROSEXUAL union (obviously).

    The phrase "strange flesh" (Jude 1: 7) hardly qualifies as a definition of "homosexuality." That phrase could mean something else; including other forms of sexuality (including those abominable ones outside of humanity). The phrase could also mean something as innocuous as the consumption of unclean animal foods! The Greek word for "strange" in Jude 1: 7 is "heteros" which means "other or different." Human beings, whether male or female, are still HUMAN BEINGS (i.e. NOT different).

    Furthermore, the Jude text is referring to Sodom & Gommorah AND other cities around them - not just Sodom (different). All of these nations were POPULATED, proving without a doubt that heterosexuality was rampant.

    1 Kings 15: 12 is a more accurate picture of Sodomite abomination - IDOLATRY. Ezek. 16: 49-50 also is specific. Homosexuality is NOT among that list.

    Given the populated state of the Sodomite nation, it is logical (and biologically FACTUAL) that heterosexuality was heavily practiced Sodomite behavior. Of course, it is likely that homosexuality also existed in Sodom because it has always existed in EVERY nation throughout time.

    In any event, anger or venom directed at anyone (including homosexuals) is sinful (Matt. 5: 21-22). If Christians were REALLY interested in the salvation of homosexuals (and they should be), then they should point them to the Cross. But so few do that. It is more common to hear church folks ragging on homosexuals rather than trying to bring them to salvation. Thanks! latterrain77
     
  17. John Wells

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    Your defense of "strange flesh" begs:

    3For the time will come when men will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear. 4They will turn their ears away from the truth and turn aside to myths. (2 Tim 4:3-4)

    Rather than heterose*xual I would argue bi-se*xual.

    Also, I have never suggested being un-Christlike to these people. But they do need to be frankly confronted with the truth and their sin.
     
  18. latterrain77

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    Hi John. Thank you for your comments. So it's your position that the Sodomites were NOT homosexual? - but rather bisexual?

    You said; Your defense of "strange flesh" begs:

    I don't think so. The Greek for "strange" flesh ("heteros") does NOT mean homosexuality. It means "other or different." The Greek word for "homosexual" is an entirely different word ("malakos") - 1 Cor. 6: 9. latterrain77
     
  19. John Wells

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    A bi-sexual person, when having sex with a same sex partner is engaging in a homosexual act. There are many homosexuals who hide behind a wife and children, but it doesn't change or excuse their deviant sexual orientation. Some may have been bi, others were homosexual. They didn't seem too interested in Lot's virgin daughters.

    Before they had gone to bed, all the men from every part of the city of Sodom—both young and old—surrounded the house. They called to Lot, “Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us so that we can have sex with them.” (Genesis 19:4-5)

    Now realizing that these are the passages that Jude 7 is referring to, what does "strange flesh" mean in context? Here's what biblical scholars thought!

    7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities about them, having in like manner with these given themselves over to fornication and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the punishment of eternal fire.
    ASV
    7 We should also be warned by what happened to the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah and the nearby towns. Their people became immoral and did all sorts of sexual sins. Then God made an example of them and punished them with eternal fire.
    CEV
    7 just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural desire, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
    ESV
    7 Likewise, Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities near them, which like them committed sexual sins and engaged in homosexual activities, serve as an example of the punishment of eternal fire.
    ISV
    7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
    KJV
    7 Likewise, Sodom, Gomorrah, and the surrounding towns, which, in the same manner as they, indulged in sexual promiscuity and practiced unnatural vice, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
    NABWRNT
    7 just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire.
    NASB95
    7 Also remember the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah and the other towns around them. In the same way they were full of sexual sin and people who desired sexual relations that God does not allow. They suffer the punishment of eternal fire, as an example for all to see.
    NCV
    7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.
    NIV
    7 as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities around them in a similar manner to these, having given themselves over to sexual immorality and gone after strange flesh, are set forth as an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.
    NKJV
    7 And don’t forget the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah and their neighboring towns, which were filled with sexual immorality and every kind of sexual perversion. Those cities were destroyed by fire and are a warning of the eternal fire that will punish all who are evil.
    NLT
    7 Likewise, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which, in the same manner as they, indulged in sexual immorality and pursued unnatural lust, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
    NRSV
    7 just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding cities, which likewise acted immorally and indulged in unnatural lust, serve as an example by undergoing a punishment of eternal fire.
    RSV
     
  20. John Wells

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    I think you meant something other than 1 Kings 15:12 . . . it doesn't relate.

    Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy. They were haughty and did detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you have seen. (Ezekiel 16:49-50)

    Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman; that is detestable. (Leviticus 18:22)

    Here's the connection of references relating Sodom to idolatry and other sins:

    For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.

    Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.

    Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

    Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. (Romans 1:21-31)

    This Romans passage describes the progressive degeneration of sin. Sodom and her surrounding communities had run the full gammut of this progression, to the point that "all the men" assembled in mass in broad daylight and demanded to have sex with the two men (angels). When you think about it, unnatural sexual lust (hetero or homo) is idolizing sex and the human body . . . it's idolatry!

    An hour or two of television (programs and commercials) will clearly show that idolizing sex is alive and sadly well! :eek: Many frequent TV watchers do not even realize the "spell" they are subjected to.
     

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