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Discussion in '2006 Archive' started by UnchartedSpirit, Apr 8, 2006.
To have left it this dejected? SF Chronicle Article
Besides cutting and running, we have done nothing. Now, the question is, what would you like for us to do?
I don't know, I'm not Jesus. Yet I call to question the way he's currently working in Somalia
What have 'we' done? Begging your pardon, but Somalians were trying to starve out each other long before 'we' got there.
Somalians can help themselves by trying for peace instead of believing the only way to win is to kill the other guy. Jesus is the way, but they dont want to hear that either. What a shame.
Let's see... we could have gone in and smashed all organized resistance, and then set up an interim government, and then fought off various terrorist groups (including existing ones moving in from elsewhere to take advantage of our mistake) And then lost 60 good troops a month for an indefinite period.
But who would be stupid enough to do that?
Well, our State Department has brought in thousands of Somalians, given them free health care, public assistance, homes, cash, and furniture and dumped them in places like Atlanta and Maine, for starters.
Sadly, once they are in this country, they don't seem too interested in the Gospel, either, only interested in building mosques.
The same could be said about those who come here from Israel and other non-Christian nations. They are not too interested in the Gospel, either, only interested in building Temples and Synagogues. Of course, this is pretty much true of all totally depraved non-Christians. They are not interested in nor are the seeking the Gospel. They are seeking that which interests them and their sin nature.
We would have been in the right if terrorists from there had already declared war on us, and proved they meant it by bombing New York City and Washington DC.
1) Its not a mistake to defend ourselves against demons from hell who have declared war on us 1st and then bombed New Yourk City and Washington DC.
2) Our president has made clear that this is not a war just against the demonic Taliban, but against terrorism in general and anyone who harbors the ones who bombed New York City and Washington DC
(I keep saying that because some people have a very short memory regarding...1) Who started it 2) They bombed New York City and Washington DC)
Ahhh, yes. Let me see if I have this correct.
In revolutionary war people died.
In the civil war people died.
In WWI people died.
In WWII people died.
In the Korean War people died.
In the Vietnam war people died.
But in this war people shouldnt die.
I wish nobody would be killed in any war on either side, but its going to happen.
People---unfortuently---have died in every war we have been involved in but the world is a better place because of the United States of America and our willingness to do the right thing when there is absolutly no other choice.
Regarding the current situation, we had no choice. The enemy declared war on us 1st, not us, by clearly declaring their intention to destroy the USA, and then proceeding to bomb New York City and Washington DC.
No...we would have the courage and moral good sense to do that.
In fact, the terrorists were Saudis, Yemenis, etc. Not Iraqis. And not a Baathis among them. You were suckered on that one. Saddam had nothing to do with 9/11. In fact, the guys who were behind it were claiming Saddam should be killed.
True. And we went to Afghanistan and defeated them. Then, Bush lost his focus, let them get away, and turned on Iraq instead. Big mistake.
You're claiming Iraq bombed New York City and Washington? Or are you claiming Somalia did? Either way, you're completely wrong.
And then lost 60 good troops a month for an indefinite period."
For our freedoms.
To hold the Union to gether (and later to free slaves)
Because the Kaiser would not stop torpedoing our ships.
Because the Japanese attacked us.
To stop communist aggression.
Over a mistake. A big one.
We should never have started it in the first place. If Bush had focused on the people who actually attacked us, we might have gotten Bin Laden by now, and we certainly would have been more successful against them.
The current situation is, we are now largely ignoring the people who attacked us, because Bush decided to improve his re-election chances by getting us into war against people who did not attack us.
But who would be stupid enough to do that?
Sounds neither brave nor moral to attack those who didn't attack us.
And you said...
Well, it would seem that way to anyone reading only your post.
However, it appears that you responded to every one of my points, except one. I believe its the only one you didnt quote. And then you responded to my post as if you were responding to my entire post.
Here is what you chose not to quote...
Thats the reason why we are taking the fight to other places where they have earned the right to have us come there as well.
You must have a short memory, so I'll remind you.
There was much joy and literal dancing in the streets after where captured the demon from hell named Saddam Hussein, after killing his demon sons, and overthrowing that government.
I guess you would go over there and lecture the Iraqi citizens concerning all that dancing, and firmly reprimand then for it while doing what you can to put Sadamm Huisein back in power?
And you said...
And the images of that attack...suicide bombers plunging into American ships as the smoke rises and the ships sink...are remarkably similar to the images of....
Sept 11, 2001.
Suicide pilots plunging planes into American skyscrapers as the smoke rises and the buildings collapse.
But of course, this is an immoral war being waged by a reckless president, isnt it?
I guess we should have just wrung our hands and said "Oh, darn the luck! That clever Osama Bin Satan is under cover now, so...lets take our ball and go home."
And wait meekly over here as they plot their next attack.
And Saddamm brutalises more people...throwing them off 5 story buildings, chopping off their fingers, gassing his enemies by the thousands.
(how many more mass graves are we going to find?)
Yep...no dancing in the streets of Iraq because we wouldnt be there to cause the dancing.
And nobody would die.
Ooops...no Americans will die.
With regard to the 'dumping of Somalis in places like Atlanta and Maine', those people wanted out, we didnt capture them and make them come here for crying out loud.
At the very least, they are documented aliens. Maybe they will apply for citizenship. Good for them. That is one of the very best things about America. Their lives were spared from genocide, and perhaps this one gift of freedom will allow them to become productive members of the human race. And if those who follow Islam really want peace, there is no better time to start than the present.
You should also know they will spend a good part of the next 7 years or so paying back the cost of travel and settlement back to the US government.
I would just like to remind you that you should be thankful you werent born there.
I cant figure out if you just dispise everyone or just like to complain about everything. Whatever it is, prayer will help.
G - take a break. This thread has nothing to do with Iraq. Besides, we already know how you feel on it, what with at least 50 recent posts turned into a forum for you to express your condescension of this country. That must be like having a second job, looking for any opportunity to push your agenda.
You voted for Al "I'll steal this election if it kills me" Gore and John Kerry didnt you?
Its actually not just you, its lots of people, but I just more and more get the impression that so much of this loathing of a good president...in time of war...is simply because of a "pity party".
My guy lost so I'll have me a good pity party and be against the guy that won for no good reason.
How anyone can possibly believe that this is not a justified and morally right war is just beyond me. Ordinarily smart and surely sane people coming across like lunatics. Saying things that make absolutly no sense.
Its just the most amazing thing.
We freed Afghanistan of the satanic Taliban and there was dancing in the streets.
We freed Iraq of the satanic Sadaam Hussein, and there was dancing in the streets.
But this is a terrible failure, and we are the problem not the solution, and its an immoral war, and our president is a scumbag, and we are the terrorists against Iraq instead of the liberators, etc etc etc etc ad nauseum.
Hey! Maybe Sadamm can break ouf jail and return to power! You'd probably have a party if that happened, wouldnt you? Drive us out, scum that we are, and then resume his terroristic regime of mass murder, torture, oppression, extermination of enemies, and resuming his quest for weapons of mass destruction!(wouldnt THAT be reason to throw a big party!)
(Sorry, rant over.)
The Germans did not attack us. Was our war with Hitler, in your opinion, wrong? Did we take our eye off the ball?
They came here because the US made a deal with the UN to accept them because the original countries who agreed to accept them went back on the deal. We were left holding the bag.
I'd like to see some documentation of that but you can't produce any because it simply isn't true. Right now, these resettled Somalians are sending money home to the warlords in their mother country. As inept as our bureaucracy of a government is, there is no way all these people have been adequately screened for ties to terrorism. Really, you should do so research before you ask us to believe your opinions are based on facts.
Oh, I am. And my ancestors worked hard to make this country as great and wonderful as it is by sacrifice of blood, life, land, and treasure. Get it? They worked for it and sacrificed for it. They were given no handouts. Somalian immigrants haven't earned the right to be here - it was a political deal only, not based on their own merit.
I don't "dispise anyone." Neither do I despise everyone. What I do despise is our government importing people in here by the thousands and expecting taxpayers to support them, giving them FREE goods and services they are not entitled to because they didn't earn it.
Prayer always helps. No dispute there.
He'll get off, don't worry. I've always said that.
As far as dancing in the streets, there were millions of muslims dancing in the streets over 09/11, all over the world.
Now, can we please return to the topic of this thread - Somalia?
We could. But to not tangent compleately, Africa is still the leading Continent in the amount of converts that occur. Thats a good thing I guess. Which is why I can't figure out why Somalia was left out
The Somali problem is rooted in post-WW2 colonial polices. Before WW2, the Horn of Africa aka Somalia was divided up between British, French, and Italian Somalilands. After WW2, the Italian territory was merged into the British Mandate. French Somaliliand is now the independent nation of Djibouti.
The problem when the European powers withdrew they did not allow the various local groupings to unite or splinter as the locals saw fit. This scenerio is also playing out in the West of Africa. Tribes were divided up and welded together with their rivals based on old colonial boundaries.
Already two regions of "Somalia" have organized themselves with representative (in that they represent more than one clan or tribe) governments. One, IIRC, is based in the old British Somaliland. The international community needs to recognize these governments and give up on a Mogadisu based government ala the old failed regime.
I guess someone should remind him that all 19 of the terrorist on 9/11 were from Saudi Arabia, and that Saudi Arabia is the largest supporter of terrorism in the world. I guess that would interfere with his Saudi sleepovers at the ranch in Texas though, wouldn't it.
The invasion of Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, it was planned long before 9/11, and had more to do with the fact that Saddam was planning on moving away from the US dollar for his oil and moving toward the euro, he was trying to get the rest of OPEC to do the same.