What Is The "Gospel"

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by Singer, May 1, 2003.

  1. Singer

    Singer
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    1,343
    Likes Received:
    0
    For starters:

    1. That God is True

    St. John 3:33
    He that hath received His testimony hath set to his seal that God is true
    ____________________________________________________

    2. To believe the record

    1 John 5:10
    He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself : he that
    believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record
    that God gave of his Son.


    Singer
     
  2. Dualhunter

    Dualhunter
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2002
    Messages:
    872
    Likes Received:
    0
    1 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,
    2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.
    3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
    4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, - 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 NASB
     
  3. Glorious

    Glorious
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2002
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    Good question:)
    (although, a loaded one perhaps? ;)

    I always understood it to mean "Good News".

    Here is the Merriam Webster meaning:

    Finally, I think it is a universal word/term.
    One which is in the scriptures ... and which encompasses Gods own truth.

    Man is the one who has split the meaning into fragments ... many churches, and many interpretations of the meaning..... and many people who use it as a lever to get people to understand it their way.


    Lets get back to the basics and start right at the beginning.
    Lets not make this a complicated word and meaning .... I think God meant it plain and simple!

    [​IMG]
     
  4. BobRyan

    BobRyan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,837
    Likes Received:
    4
    Rev 14:7 "The Everlasting Gospel" INCLUDES several KEY facts according to this message -

    #1. God is the CREATOR of ALL things on earth -(using the unique language of the 4th commandment to make the point). So God created MAN on the 6trh day and ALL the earth in 6 days.

    Man was created sinless and PERFECT by a loving "Creator" God - man in FELLOWSHIP with God complete with a "holy day" of worship at the START.

    But then PERFECT sinless man - FELL into Sin, and now has a sinful nature - doomed to the lake of fire and eternal death.

    #2. Christ died for our sins - "God so loved the World that He gave His only begotton Son that WHOSOEVER believes on Him should not perish but have everlasting life".

    #3. Rev 14:7 (and Romans 2:16) tells us that the Judgment is ALSO part of that ONE Gospel.

    So we are saved by grace through faith under the ONE Gospel (ONE in ALL AGES) - and yet we are JUDGED by the things written in the books. (Daniel 7:9-10) "By their fruits you shall know them" Matt 7. For we must ALL stand before the jdugment seat of Christ to give account for the deeds done in the body both GOOD and BAD.(2Cor 5:8-10)

    But in the end "Judgment is passed IN FAVOR of the saints" as Daniel 7 states - and the saints receive the Kingdom "For theirs is the Kingdom of Heaven". The New Heavens and the New Earth (Rev 21:1-3).

    The "Gospel" is the "Good News" of Salvation - "ALL OF IT" 1Cor 15:1-9 gives a good example of HOW the story of people's lives play into that complete Gospel message.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  5. Singer

    Singer
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    1,343
    Likes Received:
    0
    Good responses.

    Dual...that scripture was on my mind also and there are yet more
    verses that refer to Christ's death, burial and risen state to include
    a present existance. That is definitely Good News like Glorious
    stated ( God's own truth). God cannot lie and God gave us
    the bible to reveal history that included fallen mankind and His
    plan to redeem it. That is definitely Truth in the First Degree.

    Bob Ryan.....you slipped a little promotion in there for your church of
    which I didn't notice from the scripture you gave. Rev l4:7 merely said
    to "Worship God and give Glory to Him" and to worship Him who made
    the heavens, earth, sea and fountains of water. It was referred
    to as an ''everlasting gospel'' to preach to those dwelling on the earth.

    Quite obvious is the fact that the "everlasting gospel'' is the Good News
    of Christ's death, burial and resurrection.

    Loaded question huh.....Glorious [​IMG]

    Well okay; I am hoping the Pure and Simple gospel can be unveiled without
    including denominational flavor. We have to remember that the plan of
    salvation was from the 'beginning' and aren't we safe to say that God knew it
    would be offered to the Gentiles as well as the Jews. (He surely knew that
    also .... From the beginning [​IMG]

    Ephesians 3:9

    And to make all [men] see what [is] the fellowship of the mystery,
    which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who
    created all things by Jesus Christ


    Ephesians 3:11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed
    in Christ Jesus our Lord


    I'm sure there is more scripture relating to the Good News !!
     
  6. Carson Weber

    Carson Weber
    Expand Collapse
    <img src="http://www.boerne.com/temp/bb_pic2.jpg">

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2001
    Messages:
    3,079
    Likes Received:
    0
    I recently wrote a paper for my Scripture, the Heart of Catechesis graduate course on this topic, and I would like to share it on this thread.

    The Relationship betwen "Gospel" and "Paschal Mystery" by Carson Weber

    The purpose of this paper is to examine the interconnected and essential relationship between the Gospel and the Paschal Mystery. We will first examine the general nature and precise definition of these two absolutely fundamental aspects of Christianity before highlighting the interaction and connection between them. With this accomplished, it will be seen how both are distinct from one another yet inseparably united to form an integral unity. Due to this inseparable unity, it will be evident that without the Paschal Mystery, we would be left without a Gospel message. A preached Gospel without the historical and utterly profound reality of the Paschal Mystery of Jesus Christ would be left utterly empty and powerless.

    The Paschal Mystery has its roots in the Jewish Passover, which begins on the fourteenth day of Nisan – a lunar month roughly corresponding with the latter part of March and the first part of April – and continues for eight days through the twenty-first of the same month. The Passover is also known as the Pasch (i.e., &quot;fifteenth&quot; for the fifteenth day of Nisan), and it is a yearly festival that commemorates the deliverance of Israel’s firstborn sons from the tenth plague during their four-century sojourn in Egypt. These divine plagues were targeted against Egypt and the Egyptian gods (cf. Ex 12:12) in order to deliver Israel from the bondage of Egyptian slavery. It was then that God commanded the Israelite families, through Moses, to slaughter a year-old male lamb without blemish from either the sheep or the goats (cf. Ex 12:5). They were to apply some of its blood to the two doorposts and lintel of the house in which the lamb was eaten, and at midnight, the Lord slew every first-born in the land of Egypt except for the houses marked with the blood of the Paschal lamb (cf. Ex 12:29-30). In this event, Pharaoh lost the life of his firstborn son, who was considered divine; in consequence, he commanded Israel to depart from their land (cf. Ex 12:29-32). From then on, the Passover became a perpetual institution (cf. Ex 12:14), whereby unblemished, year-old, male lamb is sacrificed and then consumed during the Seder meal in remembrance of this historical event on the evening of the fourteenth day of Nisan. In the Jewish calendar, the day begins in the evening, so the lamb is actually consumed on day fifteen, and this is why the sacrifice is referred to as the &quot;Paschal&quot; lamb.

    In light of the divine revelation received through Jesus Christ, we are able to recognize how this historical event of the tenth plague serves as a type or foreshadowing of the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world (cf. Jn 1:29). It prefigures the sacrifice of the New Covenant. In John’s Gospel, we recognize several Old Testament literary allusions whereby John shows how Jesus is our sacrificial lamb. First, we notice the use of the hyssop branch in giving Jesus wine just before he handed over his spirit from the cross (cf. Jn 19:29). It was a hyssop branch with which the blood of the Passover lamb was sprinkled on the lintel and two doorposts (cf. Ex 12:22). Second, John records how &quot;when they came to Jesus and saw that he was already dead, they did not break his legs&quot; (Jn 19:33), and the Passover lamb’s bones were not to be broken (cf. Ex 12:46). Jesus Christ is our lamb immolated through vicarious atonement in order to free men from the bondage of sin as the Paschal lamb of the Exodus Passover freed the Israelites’ firstborn from death and was instrumental in freeing the Israelites from slavery in Egypt.

    We may also discern how the tradition of Passover symbolically foreshadows the Eucharistic sacrifice instituted by Jesus in the Upper Room during his celebration of the same Passover Seder meal. In each of the Synoptic Gospels, we recognize that the Last Supper is accomplished within the context of this Passover meal (cf. Mt 26:17; Lk 22:15; Mk 14:16). The Paschal Feast is structured around four cups of wine. The first cup of wine is poured out for each participant and the head of the house prays the solemn blessing (Hebrew: kiddush); everyone then drinks and partakes of bittern herbs dipped in salt water. The second cup of wine is served after the Passover narrative is read from the twelfth chapter of Exodus and the little Hallel is sung (i.e., Psalms 113 and 114). Now the meal proper begins wherein the president blesses the unleavened bread and all partake of it as well as the paschal lamb, bitter herbs, and other dishes. The third cup is then filled including an extra cup that is left for the prophet Elijah, whom they expect as the precursor to the Messiah. Silence is observed for some time, and the door to the room is opened. After this, the fourth cup is filled and the great Hallel is recited (i.e., Psalms 115-118). The final &quot;cup of consummation&quot; is then partaken of to conclude the Passover Seder meal.

    With the background of the Passover Seder meal in place, we are able to discern how Jesus fulfills the Old Testament Passover at the Last Supper. We read in Matthew’s Gospel that in the context of this meal (cf. Mt 26:17.19), &quot;Jesus took bread, said the blessing, broke it, and giving it to his disciples said, ‘Take and eat; this is my body’&quot; (Mt 26:26). In doing so, during the main meal, Jesus provides the unleavened bread, blesses it, and declares it his own body. Jesus provides his own unblemished flesh, the flesh that takes away the sin of the world. &quot;Then he took a cup, gave thanks, and gave it to them saying, ‘Drink from it, all of you, for this is my blood of the covenant, which will be shed on behalf of many for the forgiveness of sins’&quot; (Mt 26:27-28). The Messiah has now come to partake of this third cup, and in doing so, he transforms it into his sacrificial blood, which will serve as the covenant sacrifice, shed for the forgiveness of sins.

    Then, Jesus declares, &quot;I tell you, from now on I shall not drink this fruit of the vine until the day when I drink it with you new in the kingdom of my Father&quot; and then &quot;after singing a hymn, they went out to the Mount of Olives&quot; (Mt 26:29-30). Here we notice that Jesus explicitly declares that he will not partake of the cup of consummation, they recite the great Hallel, and then everyone departs for the Mount of Olives. In refusing the fourth cup, the cup of consummation, Jesus prolongs the Passover Seder meal because it is not yet complete. Matthew then shows that Jesus refused to drink of wine drugged with myrrh, a narcotic, just before his crucifixion on Golgotha (cf. Mt 26:34). Just at the three o’clock hour, one of the bystanders &quot;ran to get a sponge; he soaked it in wine, and putting it on a reed, gave it to [Jesus] to drink&quot; just before he &quot;gave up his spirit&quot; (Mt 26:48.50). John records this event in greater detail: &quot;After this, aware that everything was now finished, in order that the scripture might be fulfilled, Jesus said, ‘I thirst.’ There was a vessel filled with common wine. So they put a sponge soaked in wine on a sprig of hyssop and put it up to his mouth. When Jesus had taken the wine, he said, ‘It is finished.’ And bowing his head, he handed over the spirit&quot; (Jn 19:28-30). Jesus finishes and fulfills the Passover as he partakes of the cup of consummation and gives over his spirit to the Father.

    When we speak of &quot;the Paschal Mystery&quot;, we are addressing explicitly the saving work of redemption Jesus Christ accomplished through the work of his Passion, Death, Resurrection, and glorious Ascension. In dying, Christ destroyed our death; in rising, he restored our life. It is the mystery by which Christ accomplished the work of our salvation. These objective events occurred once in the reality of human history. &quot;Once for all he has appeared at the end of the ages to take away sin by his sacrifice&quot; (Hb 9:26). &quot;For Christ also suffered for sins once, the righteous for the sake of the unrighteous, that he might lead you to God. Put to death in the flesh, he was brought to life in the spirit&quot; (1 Pet 3:18). &quot;It was also for us, to whom it will be credited, who believe in the one who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead, who was handed over for our transgressions and was raised for our justification&quot; (Rom 4:25). Though we distinguish between Jesus’ Passion, Death, Resurrection, and Ascension, we distinguish in order to unite because each of these aspects constitute one complete reality, that of the Paschal Mystery.

    The English term “Gospel” is derived from the Old English “gōdspel”, which itself is a conjunction of “gōd” (English: “good”) and “spell” (English: “message” or “news”). The Gospel is the good news that the Apostles – and the Church following them – have to proclaim to the entire world as it is handed on in the apostolic tradition of the Church as the origin of all saving truth and moral discipline. Essentially, the Gospel is the good news of God’s mercy and love revealed in the Paschal Mystery of Jesus Christ.

    The Paschal Mystery is the cause and center of the Gospel. At the center of the Christian proclamation stands the Paschal Mystery of Christ’s cross and glorious resurrection from the dead. What do we as Christians have that is good news for the world? Our Gospel – our &quot;good news&quot; – is that &quot;when the time had fully come, God sent forth his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those who were under the law, so that we might receive adoption as sons&quot; (Gal 4:4-5). God has sent his own beloved Son, visited his people, and fulfilled the promise he made to Abraham and his descendants (cf. Gen 22:18; Gal 3:14). The Gospel is the coming of the Reign of God through the advent of the Eternal King, Jesus Christ. If Jesus had not accomplished the saving work of the Paschal Mystery in the historical course of history, there would be no Gospel to spread forth to the nations. There would then be no ushering in of the kingdom of heaven on earth in the form of the pilgrim Church. We would not have received adoption as sons in the Son. There would be no atonement or expiation for sins (cf. 1 John 2:2). Our suffering would not have redemptive value, united as it is to the redemptive suffering of the Redeemer (cf. Col 1:24). There would be no new life in the Resurrection. Essentially, the Paschal Mystery may be viewed as the everlasting Energizer battery that powers the Gospel; it is the Gospel’s very driving force that makes the Christian Gospel worth preaching, endowed with saving effects.

    Because of the saving event of the Paschal Mystery, the Gospel renews the life and culture of man. It combats evil and removes sin from humanity. The Gospel’s Law asks that man imitate the perfection of the heavenly Father (cf. Mt 5:48), fulfilling the moral commandments of the Law as revealed in the Old Testament. In fact, the entire law of the Gospel is summed up in the new commandment given to us by Jesus Christ: &quot;As I have loved you, so you also should love one another&quot; (Jn 13:34). The new law of the Gospel is a law of love that makes us act out of love infused by the Holy Spirit; it actually and really gives us the grace to act by way of faith and sacrament. These realities of the Christian Gospel demand that the Gospel contain &quot;the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes: for the Jew first, and then Greek&quot; (Rom 1:16). Without Christ’s redeeming work, &quot;the surpassing greatness of his power for us who believe&quot; (Eph 1:19) would not be available in the Holy Spirit, who dwells in us and gives life to our mortal bodies, allowing us to put to death the deeds of the body (cf. Rom 8:11-13). Had Christ never come into the world, the Christian Gospel message would be rendered void of substance, and it would find itself stripped of the power to save us from our sins.

    In review, we began by examining the etymological background to two central terms of the Christian mystery: the Paschal Mystery and the Gospel. The Gospel is the unique message Christianity has to proclaim, and this good news has at its heart the entire saving work of redemption from the Passion to the Ascension wrought by the Lamb of God, who is prefigured in the Passover lamb of Israel’s exodus from Egypt. The Paschal Mystery is not only the central message of the Gospel but it is also the historical reality that endows the Gospel with its saving effects. The Gospel message conveys the reality of the Redemption, and without this reality, we are left without a message that is truly good news to a humanity broken and scarred by the stain of sin. However, we can be eternally thankful that the latter is not the case, for God &quot;gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ&quot; (1 Cor 15:57), and so we who are endowed with the Spirit of Christ may rejoice in saying, &quot;thanks be to God, who in Christ always leads us in triumph, and through us spreads the fragrance of the knowledge of him everywhere&quot; (2 Cor 2:14).
     
  7. SolaScriptura in 2003

    SolaScriptura in 2003
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Messages:
    398
    Likes Received:
    0
    The gospel is the death, burial and resurrection of Christ. BUT, not just any death, burial, and resurrection. If someone came to you preaching what he called "the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ" but did not preach it as the Bible has it - perhaps he said that Christ dies on a stake rather than a cross or that Christ died of pneumonia, would you not consider this to be "another gospel"? I certainly hope you would! Likewise, when people say today that Christ's blood covers sin rather than removes it, this is another gospel - John the Baptist said "Behold the Lamb of God that TAKES AWAY [removes] the sins of the world." Likewise, when people say that you don't have to appropriate his death to you, that the mere fact he died saves you and you don't need to do anything because "God will give you faith" this is another gospel!

    (Col 2:11-12 NKJV) In Him you were also circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, by putting off the body of the sins of the flesh, by the circumcision of Christ, {12} buried with Him in baptism, in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.

    The sacrifice of Christ is appropriated to the believer in baptism, in which the believer is spiritually resurrected through faith in the operation of God! Notice that the spiritual resurrection does not take place before nor after baptism, but IN baptism!
     
  8. Glorious

    Glorious
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2002
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    Dear Mr Weber,

    PLEASE can you do me the BIGGEST favour, and explain in one simple sentence what the Paschel Mystery is!


    When it comes to those LONG posts .. which I am sure are full of wonderful research etc, I am a failure!
    Yes, I admit it to you .... my brain cannot understand these posts at all.


    You said that if there was no Paschal Mystery, then there would be no Gospel.
    I started reading, but got bogged down in the first two paragraphs.

    Please do not take this personally as against your post, but just that my mind doesn't work in such depth.

    I would love and appreciate a simple little, ONE small paragraph explaining:) Perhaps pretend you are explaining to a 10 year old child. [​IMG]

    With gratitude
    Gloria S.
     
  9. Frank

    Frank
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2002
    Messages:
    1,441
    Likes Received:
    0
    The gospel is the last will and testament of Christ. I.E. Matthew through Revelation.
     
  10. Catholic Dad

    Catholic Dad
    Expand Collapse
    Guest

  11. Carson Weber

    Carson Weber
    Expand Collapse
    <img src="http://www.boerne.com/temp/bb_pic2.jpg">

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2001
    Messages:
    3,079
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gloria, the Paschal Mystery is the work that Jesus Christ accomplished once and for all in the course of history in order to gain our redemption from sin and our sanctification for glory. Essentially, it is the work of Jesus' Passion, Death, Resurrection, and Ascension.

    This mystery is at the heart and center of the Good News, and because of it, the Gospel has the power to save us from our sins and to sanctify us with the Spirit. The Paschal Mystery realizes the Gospel and makes it effective.
     
  12. BobRyan

    BobRyan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,837
    Likes Received:
    4
    Rev 14:7 declares that the words found there "ARE the Everlasting Gospel". "I saw an Angel having the EVerlasting Gospel to PREACH... SAYING Fear God and Give Him the glory for the Hour of His Judgment HAS Come. Worhip HIM who MADE the Heavens and the Earth[b/]
    [/quote]

    You are objecting by saying that although Rev 14 says this IS the preaching of the Everlasting Gospel - it is not.

    Paul in Romans 2 "confirms" that same point that the Gospel DOES include that message by saying "When ACCORDING to my GOSPEL God WILL JUDGE the secrets of men through Christ" Romans 2:16.

    So arguing that "oh no that is not part of the Gospel" is actually to contradict the clear teaching of God's Word on this point.

    There is a popular "Nugget Gospel" model today that does not include what John and Paul explicitly say IS in the "GOOD NEWS" - the "Gospel".


    No question - that is central to the "Good News".

    But as Paul points out in 1Cor 15:1-9 there is A LOT of information in the "GOOD NEWS".

    As Paul points out in Hebrews 4:1-2 EVEN the Jews of the OT had it preached to them "WE have had the GOOD NEWS preached to us JUST AS THEY ALSO"..


    But MORE to the POINT - the CREATION, the CREATOR, the FALL INTO SIN and the the REDEMPTION From that fall are ALL part of the "story".

    AS you can see from Rev 14:6-7 Evolution corrupts the Gospel message JUST as the myth that judgment has NO part in the Good News that was "According to the GOSPEL" preached by Paul, would do.

    In Christ,

    Boib
     
  13. Singer

    Singer
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    1,343
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bob Ryan,

    There are no points of contrast as far as I'm concerned in what you posted.
    The whole Creation story should be / could be included in the Good News.
    It all makes for a glorious and astounding plan and future for us.

    I don't refute anything you said concerning what is included in the Gospel.

    The patronage you gave yourself was in this statement:

    Man was created sinless and PERFECT by a loving "Creator" God -
    man in FELLOWSHIP with God complete with a "holy day" of worship
    at the START.


    This believer doesn't consider old testament laws as part of the Good News
    that we are to Go and Tell the world. Christ fulfilled them and we are
    free.

    Right?

    Singer
     
  14. BobRyan

    BobRyan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,837
    Likes Received:
    4
    The Holy Day of Worship that we see in Genesis 2:4 given to MANKIND in the Garden of Eden is to emphasize the point that Mankind was worshipping God, in fellowship with God and IN harmony with God at the very start.

    The PERFECT creation, by an all powerful and loving God who "MAKES the Sabbath FOR MANKIND" Mark 2:27. God blessed it - for our benefit.

    It is "from that" holy perfect state that Adam fell.

    Some introduce the notion of "Evolution" as though it can be married to that perfect, holy, obedient, sinless start of mankind. They contrive that God condemned all mankind to hell over the "bad thought" of one monkey-brain-bashing hominid "once upon a time a long long time ago".

    As for God's Perfect Law NOT being a part of the Gospel "I WILL WRITE MY Laws on their HEART" - the New Covenant Hebrews 8.

    "We ESTABLISH the LAW of God" Rom 3:31 as a result of the GOSPEL's "good news".

    For it is NOT the HEARERS of the LAW that are JUST but the DOERS will be JUSTIFIED Rom 2:13.

    And those that do so are "SHOWING the works of the Law WRITTEN on their HEART" Romans 2:15-16.

    It is all one glorious - plan of redemption showing God's love from start to finish.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  15. Singer

    Singer
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    1,343
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bob,

    You almost emphasize "Holy Day" worship as a requirement to salvation.
    Salvation was available to me upon my acceptance of (believing in) the
    fact that Jesus rose from the dead. I received the Holy Spirit as promised
    by God when Jesus said "I stand at the door and knock......and sup with
    him and he with Me". All I had to do was open the door and however
    God chooses to enter and when He does that is His business.

    "Whosoever believes in me and lives shall never die".

    Millions have died, wars have been fought and divisions have reared over
    just what constitutes Belief.

    Make it easy for Gloria and the rest of mankind. Share some favorite
    scripture verses that support the Good News without getting difficult.

    Thanks
    Singer
     
  16. BobRyan

    BobRyan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,837
    Likes Received:
    4
    God's Holy Day of Gen 2:4 shows mankind in worship and holy fellowship and obedience to his creator. I did not write it - that was God in Gen 2:4.

    The gospel is the "full story" of who God is - the fall of man and the full story of what God DID to save us - including the future that is ours as His children.

    In Isaiah 66 - God says that in the New Heavens and New Earth "ALL MANKIND" will come before Me to worship "from Sabbath to Sabbath".

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  17. Singer

    Singer
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    1,343
    Likes Received:
    0
    Bob:

    I sense your sincerity on the matter of Sabbath and your suggestion
    that a complete understanding of those matters constitute the Gospel.

    There is also the same sincerity amongst Catholics in support of their
    issues. The 2x2 Sect I grew up in was equally intense on their pet
    matter. I've often been amazed that various mainline churches and
    sects gain followers who are vigorously supportive of CERTAIN issues/
    doctrines and overlook others. I guess that's why I don't address any
    of them and just stick with "confess and believe". That's a hard one
    to dispute, but yet many on here do just that .......by saying that
    believing requires something/ requires one to adhere to certain laws
    and principles.

    Trouble is, there is no Board of Equalization to resolve that syndrome.
    It has and will continue to cause division amongst those who follow
    Jesus.....it's sad.

    Singer
     
  18. BobRyan

    BobRyan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,837
    Likes Received:
    4
    The Bible truths pointing to the harmony and worship relationship that sinnless man had with God and will have with God throughout eternity - remain true no matter how we may "feel about them".

    As you point out Singer, some people "feel better" about some parts of that than others. I don't doubt it. We all have areas where we "feel uncomfortable with what God's Word says". No doubting that. Also, I am not trying to harrangue others for the areas they are uncomfortable with - or choose to avoid.

    But when making the case for "what is the Gospel" it is fascinating that Rev 14:6-7 DOES point these facts out about the Creator - using the unique language of Exodus 20:8-11 (I suppose you can blame me for Rev 14's language if it makes you feel better.).

    Rev 14 also points out that the judgment is a part of that eternal Gospel just as Paul explicitly states in Rom 2:16.

    (And I suppose that others may want to blame me for noticing that in my post as well.).

    In Any case - I think this topic "what is the Gospel" is a great one.

    Notice also that Heb 4:1 says "WE have had the GOSPEL preached to US just as THEY ALSO" speaking of Israel forty years in the desert.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     
  19. Singer

    Singer
    Expand Collapse
    New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2002
    Messages:
    1,343
    Likes Received:
    0
    No, I won't discount your scripture references , Bob.

    This is by no means a final point in the gospel discussion, but look at this verse:

    For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with
    wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
    1 Corinthians 1:17


    It could be understood from that verse that baptism was not considered
    a part of the gospel. That doesn't set well with me, but that's what it says.

    Of course it could mean that he was to preach baptism but not administer it.

    So many choices !!
     
  20. BobRyan

    BobRyan
    Expand Collapse
    Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2002
    Messages:
    30,837
    Likes Received:
    4
    In 1Cor 3 Paul says that a carnal "dispute" was going on in the church where some were saying "I am of Paul" and others "I am of Apollos". Paul asks them "Was PAUL crucified for your sins"??

    The issue in 1Corinthians is NOT whether the Gospel commission includes the command to Baptize believers - the issue is the contrast between "following the Evangelists" vs "following the CHRIST of the Evangelist".

    Correcting that error in the church can not be taken as a statement that the Gospel does not include the call to be Baptized - "Repent and Be Baptized for the remission of sins" as we find in Acts 2.

    Notice the "unfolding Gospel" of 1Cor 15

    1 Corinthians 15
    1 Now I make known to you, brethren, the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received, in which also you stand,
    2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast the word which I preached to you, unless you believed in vain.
    3 For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received, that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures,
    4 and that He was buried, and that He was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,
    5 and that He appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve.
    6 After that He appeared to more than five hundred brethren at one time, most of whom remain until now, but some have fallen asleep;
    7 then He appeared to James, then to all the apostles;
    8 and last of all, as to one untimely born, He appeared to me also.
    9 For I am the least of the apostles, and not fit to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.
    10 But by the grace of God I am what I am, and His grace toward me did not prove vain; but I labored even more than all of them, yet not I, but the grace of God with me.
    11 Whether then it was I or they, so we preach and so you believed.
    12 Now if Christ is preached, that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead?
    13 But if there is no resurrection of the dead, not even Christ has been raised;


    And notice the Gospel of Rev 14:6-7 includes BOTH God's role as Creator and Judge - judgment is part of the gospel according to John in Rev 14.

    Paul makes the same point in Romans 2:16 "According to MY GOSPEL God will judge the World through Christ".

    It is a large context - not a small one.

    In Christ,

    Bob
     

Share This Page

Loading...