What is your final authority?

You are STILL evading!! How do you know how to consult with your final authority? I can see what He said by going to my (error free,thank you very much) final authority,the King James Bible. I believe every word it says there. </font>[/QUOTE]As opposed to both you and Stefan but in general agreement with Ed, I do believe God has preserved His Word for us in the scriptures. He simply has not chosen to do it with one set of perfect, divinely inspired words.

I believe the KJV and accept its teachings as my final authority. But these are the same teachings that are found in several faithful versions of the Bible.

Nowhere does it teach anything remotely resembling KJVOnlyism. Therefore I reject KJVOnlyism.

You keep demanding that we give you a final authority. Why don't you be honest about yours? The KJV doesn't teach what you believe about the KJV... that belief comes from somewhere else so... the KJV is not an authority at all for you concerning Bible versions.

Thumper, Answer one question for me please. Prior to the invention of the printing press every Bible was different from all others. Out of 5300+ Greek mss, no two are exactly alike. The 6-10 manuscripts used by the Roman Catholic Desiderus Erasmus to create the text that became known as the Textus Receptus were all different. Only one contained any portion of Revelation and that was imbedded in a commentary. Erasmus actually back translated the last 7 verses of the Bible from the RCC's Latin Vulgate into Greek. Brilliant scholarship... however it created readings in those verses with zero, nada, zilch Greek support.

In Revelation 22:19, there is no Greek support for "book of life"- that comes from the Latin Vulgate. The Greek reads "tree of life"... like most MV's. Contrary to most of the variations between MV's and TR based Bibles, this one has possibly legitimate doctrinal implications.


____________________________________________________
I, like others on our side, used to be KJVO... until I evaluated that belief by biblical principles.

1) It depends on double standards in violation of Bible commands concerning equal balances and plain honesty.

2) It ignores issues of fact contrary to the biblical command to "prove all things"- note the scripture doesn't say to "assume all things." You can't just assume that a Bible created 1500 years after the originals (that is obviously different from the originals not even being the same languages) is the standard by which all other Bibles are to be compared. That is by definition making yourself the final authority rather than appealing to the "proof" God commands us to use and that He providentially provided.

3) It is based on experential traditions of men... like those of the Pharisees that Jesus condemned. I and many others argue that it is the "spirit" ie. sayings, messages, word, revelations, etc. of the originals that is perfectly preserved and not the "letter of the text".

Jesus rebuked the Pharisees for concentrating on the letter of the law while violating the spirit of the law.

4) There are no promises in the Bible that a perfect text will be preserved or supplied in different languages. In fact, there is direct proof in the KJV contrary to such a notion, witness and compare Luke 4:18 v. Isaiah 61:1.

5) The Bible says that it is profitable for "doctrine" to the point that we can be "perfect" or mature and "thoroughly furnished unto all good works". Yet, if version onlyism is true doctrine there should be scripture to make it plainly clear without having to read into the text as Michelle does... the scriptures are completely silent on how we are to go about choosing that one perfectly worded Bible to the exclusion of all others. It doesn't tell us to use feelings, experience, past success, historical use, or anything else. It simply doesn't say that only one set of wording exclusively expresses God's Word.

I can add much more but until you deal with these things I don't want to overwhelm you.

[ August 18, 2004, 06:03 PM: Message edited by: Scott J ]

 

Michelle:Here is a great link that shows this error quite well in the NIV, to which is reflected in other mv's.

SAME OLE ONLYIST TRASH! SAME GARBAGE, NEW BAG!

It has many of the usual KJVO lies and tall tales, such as the omission of words, Lucifer-morning star, divinity of Jesus at Luke 2:43,, AD NAUSEUM.

Get it through your thick skull, Michelle...MOST OF US HERE DO NOT BELIEVE THAT TRASH, IT'S BEEN CLEARLY DISPROVEN FOR OVER THIRTY YEARS, AND WE'RE NOT *EVER* GONNA BELIEVE IT!

Look what it's done for YOU! You cannot comprehend a common English sentence any more.


There is your evidence. You can choose to take it, or leave it. That is ultimately your own decision.

Your "evidence" was *PROVEN* to be a pack of lies thirty yreas ago, or more.Now, here it is again, same ole smelly trash, new bag.


But just because you choose not to see it, doesn't mean it hasn't been shown, nor proven. It only shows &lt;edited by moderator&gt;.

On the contrary, it was all DISproven long ago. But there's always a new KJVO who comes along and digs it up from the compost pile, and we hafta repeat all the proof against it again. It gets boring, but we DO have responsibility to try to keep the new or weak Christian from falling into that compost pile.

As for you, you have proven yourself to be both a wrong-as-can-be fanatic and a liar. I don't think you'll lead anyone astray because your errors and ignorance are so obvious, but I DO hope no one has a heart attack from LAUGHING so hard.

 

Be nice Roby... she stopped talking to me when she couldn't slither out of the corner anymore on her false arguments.

While she is still interacting with someone who espouses truth, there is hope that she or someone else might be helped out of their doctrinal error.

 

michelle said:

We are not to compromise with error. It is like accepting a donut that is laced with arsenic.

Put another way: &lt;Attack on a version deleted&gt;

[ August 19, 2004, 12:37 AM: Message edited by: C4K ]

 

Scott J:Be nice Roby... she stopped talking to me when she couldn't slither out of the corner anymore on her false arguments.

But you kept'em coming, for the sake of the newbies, same as I do. And for ME, I AM being nice! I grow quite angry with false doctrines, and those who try to fob them off on the public.

While she is still interacting with someone who espouses truth, there is hope that she or someone else might be helped out of their doctrinal error.

That's why I've been so patient, even though she demonstrates a complete lack of knowledge of the issues being discussed, and an amazing non-comprehension of plain facts, set forth in everyday language, with proof Scriptures from her own fave BV.

 

KJV Bible Thumper: This is why I suggested you post your paper in a new topic when you're ready. This'n's gone to pot.

 

I just don't want her to stop interacting and leave. Any rational person that follows a thread between her and you (or anyone else here) will see the utter emptiness of KJVOnlyism.

She provides better proof against KJVOnlyism than we ever could.

 

--------------------------------------------------
Providing a full rebuttal to the spin, misinformation and false witness on that page would take more effort than I am prepared to provide at the moment.
--------------------------------------------------


You are the one saying that they are presenting a spin, giving misinformation, and false witness. If you desire for others to see that it is all these things you claim, and you truly believe it is, and care enouph for others to know that it is, I would think you would make the effort. Otherwise your comment is just that. Only a comment.


love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

OK.

Then HOW can you maintain your position when there is not ONE VERSE OF SCRIPTURE TO SUPPORT IT??!!
I mean,you rant and rave about us(the Bible believer) having to bear the burden of proof for our position when Acts 11 & 13(and Church history) support our postition..

You have none!!

I'm sorry,but God made it plain for Jewish people to stay out of Egypt;and seeing how the Jews were custodians of Scripture(Romans 3:2,Deuteronomy 17:18; 31:25-26,and Malachi 2:7.),God made it PLAIN for his name NOT to be spoken of in the land of Egypt by the Jews(Jeremiah 44:26).


Just like the ol' saying goes here in the South,"that dog wont hunt."

 

michelle said "I would think you would make the effort"

In case you didn't notice, I provided some examples. And I put in more effort describing the problems I see than you do with links other provide - you just tell them they are not spirutally discerning or similar worthless explanations.

 

&lt;attack snipped&gt;-Alexandrian said "when Acts 11 & 13(and Church history) support our postition"

Sorry, neither Acts 11 & 13 nor church history support KJV-onlyism. Good try at trying to associate yourself with orthodoxy, though.

[ August 19, 2004, 12:39 AM: Message edited by: C4K ]

 

--------------------------------------------------
Sorry, neither Acts 11 & 13 nor church history support KJV-onlyism. Good try at trying to associate yourself with orthodoxy, though
--------------------------------------------------

This is just proof positive that you cannot see the truth past the labels.


love in Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour,
michelle

 

Michelle said "This is just proof positive that you cannot see the truth past the labels."

I can see past the labels when its applicable to do so. It wasn't applicable.

 

Pushin' for 20 pages, so they can lock it down!

 

This topic is continued here:

#2 Which KJV is your authority?

Two questions there. Thank you for shifting.

 

Since Ed has shifted this

I will go ahead and close this one