What percentage does it take for your budget to pass

Discussion in 'General Baptist Discussions' started by MorganT, Dec 30, 2011.

  1. MorganT

    MorganT
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    We have a completely new Stewardship and Finance Committee at our church and our new budget proposal is alot more this year. Like over $100,000.00 more than last, so we have had alot of discussion concerning this new budget proposal. Members have asked me by what percentage it takes for the budget to pass as I am Chairman of the Deacons. I have no idea what it takes because the BY LAWS do not state that it takes a 51 percent, or a 3/4 percent to pass. We had the same treasure for over 30 years who retired and he was a well trusted man and this new Committee has not (some peoples words not mine) proven themselves. So what does it take at your church for the budget to pass. This goes to the entire Church for a vote Sunday Morning to either pass or decline and go back to the drawing board. Thanks for any advice.
     
  2. Tom Butler

    Tom Butler
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    In the absence of a specific rule, a simple majority is all that is required to pass the budget.

    That said, if the budget barely passes, you may want to send the Budget Committee back to the drawing board. It's the sign of a larger problem.
     
  3. Salty

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    Basically I agree with Tom - but if it passed - it passed. I suppose what I would do is make a second motion to review the budget at the end of the first fiscal quarter for possible change.
     
  4. annsni

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    I like Salty's idea. I have no idea what it is in our church because I've not even seen one "no" on our votes! LOL
     
  5. agedman

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    Because there are that many who are not pleased or hold the committee as valid, it might be very reasonable to have a church wide discussion.

    An item by item question and answer with the committee members sitting as the panel to answer the questions, you as a pastor (neutral party) should moderate the proceedings, and a no holes bared discussion of EACH item be done.

    This will do at least two things.

    First, there were be a noticeable and growing consensus on agreement or disagreement with the budget.

    Second, there will be a public accountability of the committee member's thinking, which will either give rise to general approval of the member's work, or that the body needs to select a new wiser, or more politically in line with the assemblies, thinking.

    I would most certainly, NOT hold a up or down vote without the congregation exhausting all questions, and some member actually calling for the question (the call to vote) with a second.

    Work for unity and love of the brethren.

    Money is the root the enemy can use to create all manor of evil - most of which won't even be noticed until it is too late!!!
     
  6. Romans7man

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    With that much of a difference I would think at least 3/4 vote would have to carry and even with that discussion would have to be in order. All cards on the table, so to say.
    We just voted in a fellowship hall that is soon to be constructed. It is supposed to cost "around 100 thousand dollars". It carried with little question.

    In this economy everyone needs to be on the same page in the same book singing the same song.
    Being a truck driver and seeing much, I have seen what looked like fairly new church buildings closed down. I'm not talking about run down buildings either.

    You might ask, How do I know it was closed down? When the church sign is talking about Easter in summer and the grass is 2 feet high, I would say no body is home. I can probably think of about a half dozen churches on my routes that are empty.
     
  7. MorganT

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    All of this has been done already, the vote was postponed and we had a second meeting and now it goes to a vote a week late. Nothing was resolved in the meetings as both sides are right but dont agree on the method, therefore its going to come down to the vote. I have been asked what it takes on the vote to pass or fail. We use Roberts Rules of Order for all our meetings and on the budget the By-Laws do not state what kind of majority it takes to pass as this has never been an issue. The problem stems from a new Sanctuary that we build, half want to pay it off as quickly as possible and the other half want to loosen the reins so to speak in order to start new ministry's and do more with the ministry's we already have.
    Thanks for your help



     
  8. matt wade

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    I don't have any great ideas for you, except that you must get this resolved. Something like this can tear a church apart.
     
  9. freeatlast

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    First this is the problem with sheep voting. Shepherds are suppose to do the leading not the sheep, but that is another debate. I agree with Tom if it is not in writing then majority wins, but that is a bad way to do it as that is what causes splits. I would add that you need to vote on the percentage to pass things before you try and pass this since there is this kind of opposition. Personally if the sheep are going to vote I am always in favor of 100% being required for any vote and in the by-laws stated as such, but only a few churches are set up that way.
     
  10. agedman

    agedman
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    I have an idea that you might consider asking the congregation if they would agree.

    Place a mark for Yes and a mark for No on the bottom of two large empty (and clean) cans.

    Place the cans in a cardboard box to not only muffle the sound, but to "hide" cans from the general audience view.

    Each person is given a marble.

    Because they cannot know which can is yes and which is no, the assembly must earnestly pray for the Holy Spirit to guide them in which can to place the marble.

    The person is not to look into the cans, but to walk up, put the marble determinately into a can as the Holy Spirit has led them.

    The can with the most marbles carries the vote.

    This type of voting would removes politics.

    It removes all behind the lines scheming.

    It makes the vote totally up to that person and the Lord.

    But best of all - it is Scripturally based. In more than one occasion the will of God was established by such means - though the ancients perhaps didn't have marbles.

    At least this way, no one can "blame" someone else for how they voted.

    I once offered this suggestion (with some modifications) to a pulpit committee who were so into the politics of a selection they had lost all touch with the work of the Holy Spirit in the matter.

    They didn't take the idea, either.

    But never the less - it as least is Scripturally based way of deciding.
     
  11. JesusFan

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    We probably make it too complicated, but IF its budget, just need a simple majority to pass it...

    IF voting on Elders/pastors, need to have 2/3 of membership present, and need a 3/4 vote...

    And you are right, at most we have just had 1-2 disseing votes on the budget!
     
  12. MorganT

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    We vote by ballot on this, they mark a box, either yes or no and drop in the offering plate as it goes around. The ballots are taken to a room and counted my the Chairman of the Deacons, the Assistant Chairman of the Deacons and one other deacon, so a total of 3 Deacons. We have never had this problem before and since the By-Laws do not specify it reverts back to Roberts Rules of Order, which I am thinking is 51% to pass but was curious as to what other Churches specify.
     
  13. govteach51

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    50.1% to pass the budget, and it is a secret ballot. I've never seen ours receive less than a 90% yes vote on the budget.
     
  14. preachinjesus

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    If you're using Robert's Rules's as the guideline for all things parliamentary you are in luck. The kind of vote is like any other issue. It requires a simply majority...50% + 1 vote.

    I don't know what copy of Robert's you might have but the section which covers voting in mine are Sections 38-39. That will tell you all you need to know. Unless your Constitution and Bylaws state otherwise, the vote is a simple majority....50% + 1 vote of the gathered members when a quorum is recognized.

    Now, just as in all things, context matters. If this is a particularly troublesome issue and you've got 55% for the budget and 45% against it might be time for being conciliatory or pass a temporary budget while the side discuss.

    Salty's point about having the budget and reviewing after a quarter is very good. Whenever churches experience significant difficulties in simple votes there is usually something else going on. It is time for prudent leadership and humble reconciliation. :)
     
  15. MorganT

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    We had our vote this morning and it passed with 82.22% in favor. Thanks for you thoughts on this.
     

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