Who are the parties of the New Covenant?

Discussion in '2004 Archive' started by rjprince, Dec 14, 2004.

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Who are the parties of the New Covenant?

  1. The New Covenant is between the Nation of Israel (incl. Judah) and God. The Church participates in

    87.5%
  2. The New Covenant is between God and the Church, the church being the new Israel

    12.5%
  3. There are 2 New Covenants, one for Israel, and one for the Church

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. rjprince

    rjprince
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    There are at least three positions on this issue. Sorry if I did not list yours.
     
  2. wopik

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    Strange as it may seem, the New Covenant is not yet fully implemented. We know this from the fact that believers - young and old - still need instruction.

    But when the New Covenant is fully operational then "they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest."

    The full effect of the New Covenant will take place in the Millenium, when all people everywhere will be keeping the Sabbath (Isa. 66:23) and the Lord's "appointed times" (Zech. 14:16-19). So keep them now, in the New Covenant era -- before the Millenium.

    http://atschool.eduweb.co.uk/sbs777/snotes/note1105.html
     
  3. rjprince

    rjprince
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    wopik,

    Not strange at all! Contextual Literal Grammatical Historical Hermeneutics. You been to the land promise thread?
     
  4. wopik

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    didn't know such a thread existed
     
  5. rjprince

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    As foundational as this question is to the relationship between Israel and the church I am surprised at the lack of response!!!

    This is foundational to one's view on future events!
     
  6. LadyEagle

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    Could be some people would rather argue (debate) about the End Times without knowing what the Covenants are about and how they tie in to all of it. Same with the Feasts of Israel. There is not enough teaching about these things in our Baptist churches, IMHO. And little interest. :(
     
  7. Archeryaddict

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    The New covenant Has been given to All who Believe And recieve.
    no one becomes a part of the body of Christ unti their name is written down in the lambs book of life.
    But the New Testament was written for all mankind that they may be saved.

    Sorry but I could not vote on youre poll.

    the names of parties of the New covenant are those of whom has been written in the Lambs Book of Life whether they be Jew or Gentile.
     
  8. rjprince

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    Archeryaddict,

    Got any Scriptures to support your view that the New Covenant has been given to all who believe and receive?
     
  9. rjprince

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    The names of all believers are written in the Book of Life "from the foundation of the World" not when they become part of the Body of Christ.
     
  10. Archeryaddict

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    But when the time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under law, to redeem those under law, that we might receive the full rights of sons. Because you are sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, "Abba, Father." So you are no longer a slave, but a son; and since you are a son, God has made you also an heir.
    (Galatians 4:4-7)

    All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law." Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith." The law is not based on faith; on the contrary, "The man who does these things will live by them." Christ redeemed us from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us, for it is written: "Cursed is everyone who is hung on a tree." He redeemed us in order that the blessing given to Abraham might come to the Gentiles through Christ Jesus, so that by faith we might receive the promise of the Spirit.
    (Galatians 3:10-14)

    Since Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant, He is the new Lawgiver and Lord of the church:

    If perfection could have been attained through the Levitical priesthood (for on the basis of it the law was given to the people), why was there still need for another priest to come--one in the order of Melchizedek, not in the order of Aaron? For when there is a change of the priesthood, there must also be a change of the law.
    (Hebrews 7:11-12)

    In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. The Son is the radiance of God's glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven.
    (Hebrews 1:1-3)

    Thus, all Christians are under the authority of the New Covenant which is governed by the New Testament Scriptures:

    Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God's people and members of God's household, built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.
    (Ephesians 2:19-20)

    The Old Covenant has been perfectly fulfilled in Christ and done away. God's law is still binding on the believer in the New Covenant era, but God’s righteous standards are contained in the Law of Christ, not the Law of Moses:

    To the Jews I became like a Jew, to win the Jews. To those under the law I became like one under the law (though I myself am not under the law), so as to win those under the law. To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God's law but am under Christ's law), so as to win those not having the law.
    (1 Corinthians 9:20-21)

    Carry each other's burdens, and in this way you will fulfill the law of Christ. (Galatians 6:2)
     
  11. Archeryaddict

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    Concerning the names of the saints who are written in the lambs Book of life, can you give me scripture that those names have already been written down in the lambs book of life prior to their second birth?

    I know that God is All knowing and I know the scriptures concerning Gods elect I also know the calvinist view of Gods elect (TULIP which I do not believe and think is a whacked out theology)
    but what I spesifically want to see is scripture that plainly states that a persons name is already written in the book without first accepting Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior.

    God wants a relationship with each person who has ever lived and he made the covenant that we may have a relationship with Him. God made Us for His purposes, for His pleasure and to love us and for us to love Him and for us to serve and obey Him and tell others about Him but He also wants us to want a personal relationship with Him.

    Although He does fully Know who will and will not accept His Risen Son I do not believe their name is written down in the lambs book of life until they have had their spiritual re birth.

    If you can show me scripture that tells me otherwise I sure would like to see it.
    Thanks.
    Mike.
     
  12. Daniel David

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    The New Covenant was cut when Christ died. The parties of the New Covenant are all who are saved since the cross.

    The New Covenant has not reached its fulfillment yet, but it is in full force and effect.
     
  13. grace56

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    This is where the New Covenent started Matthew 26:26 through 28. While they were eating, Jesus took bread, said the blessing, broke it, and giving it to his disciples said, "Take and eat; this is my body." Then he took a cup, gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you, for this is my blood of the covenent, which will be shed on behalf of many for the forgiveness of sins.

    He came and established the New Covenent when he came to save us from our sins, by dying on the cross and by rising up again!

    grace56
     
  14. DeafPosttrib

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    Archeryaddict,

    I am 100% agree with you. We are already under the New Covenant through Calvary 2,000 years ago. It is fulfilled. No longer under the old covenant again no more.

    To everyone: I urge you to read and study whole book of Hebrews in the New Testament talking lot about covenant, blood, sacrifice, priest, etc. That book shows us, we are now under the new covenant through Calvary.

    Ephesians 2:12-22 talking about reconciled both Jews and Gentiles together into one through Calvary.

    Whole of Galatians chapter 3 talking about the covenant, that both Jew and Gentile are share by the faith through Jesus Christ, both are one on the same new covenant.

    DD, I do not agree with you.

    Calvary already fufilled the old coevent 2,000 years ago. Now, we are under the new covenant because of through Christ's blood.

    In Christ
    Rev. 22:20 -Amen!
     
  15. rjprince

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    ArchAdd,

    Re 17:8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. (KJV)

    Re 17:8 "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, will wonder when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come. (NAS95)

    Re 17:8 "The beast that you saw was and is not, and is about to come up out of the abyss and to go to destruction. And those who dwell on the earth will wonder, whose name has not been written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast, that he was and is not and will come. (NAS)

    Re 17:8 The beast, which you saw, once was, now is not, and will come up out of the Abyss and go to his destruction. The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the creation of the world will be astonished when they see the beast, because he once was, now is not, and yet will come. (NIV)

    The term “earth dwellers” is contrasted with believers throughout the book of Rev. Earthdwellers, the ones who will worship the beast, were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world. This is in contrast to those who are believers, who’s names are written in the book of life from the foundation of the world (a clear implication of the passage, though admittedly not a direct statement).

    Hope this clarifies my statement. More later.
     
  16. rjprince

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    ArchAdd,
    Thanks for the references given in reply to my request. NONE OF THEM SUPPORT YOUR POINT! NOT DIRECTLY AND NOT EVEN INDIRECTLY!

    NONE OF THE PASSAGES YOU QUOTED EVEN MENTION THE NEW COVENANT!
     
  17. Pastor Larry

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    According to Scripture, the New Covenant is between God and the nation of Israel and Judah, the descendants of the people who were led out of Egypt. The means that it is not the church. The church participates in teh blessings of the New Covenant. The New Covenant has not yet been fulfilled, as we can tell by reading the Jeremiah passage and comparing it to what we see now.
     
  18. DeafPosttrib

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    Pastor Larry,

    Tomorrow, I will discuss on covenant, 'House of Israel & House of Judah', what these scriptures talking about.

    In Christ
    Rev. 22:20 -Amen!
     
  19. Pastor Larry

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    What is there to discuss? It is plain that it means the house of Israel and the house of Judah whose fathers came out of the land of Israel. There is no reason to make it more difficult. This is simple.
     
  20. Daniel David

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    Larry, that isn't the only text in Scripture regarding the New Covenant.

    Paul said he was a minister of the new covenant in 2 Cor. 3.

    The writer of Hebrews said it has come.

    The fact is that ethnic Jews will be partakers of it, but it was hardly an exclusive promise to Israel.

    What do you think Jesus meant when he instituted the Lord's Supper and specifically mentioned the New Covenant?
     

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