... they themselves can pluck themselves out of God's hand, as in John 10:28? I've heard them say in rebuttal to Jesus in this passage, that "nothing" can pluck us out, but that "You" can pluck your ownself out of His hand. Isn't this taking mans alleged free-will and transcending it above the power of Christ in Salvation? Doesn't this also suggest works based maintenance in salvation? Did God need any of our help in saving (rescuing) us, in the first place?