Will the Board Bushies ever admit Iraq is a mess?

Discussion in 'Free-For-All Archives' started by LadyEagle, Sep 19, 2004.

  1. LadyEagle

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    http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040919/D856VE883.html

    Good Grief! If Bush would have only left this up to the Generals instead of goofy MBAs trying to plan wars! No wonder Tommy Franks retired. :rolleyes:
     
  2. Joseph_Botwinick

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    1. All wars are a mess. But, most of them are very necessary, as is this one.

    2. Pick up a copy of General Tommy Franks new book "American Soldier" and I think you will find that he has a different perspective of how the war has and is being run than you do. He has, BTW, publicly endorsed President Bush this year.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  3. LadyEagle

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    Have you read his book, Joseph?

    The Taliban al Qaeda are bragging they have retaken Southern Afghanistan.

    Of course, at the time, I even posted on this board that I thought the war in Afghanistan was going wrong. General Franks was in charge of that, too. He failed to secure the border between Afghanistan and Iran and made it easy for the enemy to slide.

    Galatian even chided me on that one, if I remember. But it looks like I was correct after all. Guess it must be those hundreds of old black and white WW2 movies I watched with my dad when I was a kid. And my mastery at the game of chess. You have to second guess your opponent and make a plan for every possible move they might do. Apparently that wasn't done. Either in Afghanistan or Iraq.
     
  4. Joseph_Botwinick

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    I have read part of it in the bookstore, mainly where he discusses the conference he had with the President concerning the war in Iraq. It was very interesting. I am on the waiting list to check it out from the library currently. Here are some interesting quotes I found on Newsmax directly from General Franks himself:

    http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/11/20/185048.shtml

    We are not going to win every battle. But, we can and will win the war. We must.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  5. Joseph_Botwinick

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    http://apnews.myway.com/article/20040919/D856VE883.html

    Good Grief! If Bush would have only left this up to the Generals instead of goofy MBAs trying to plan wars! No wonder Tommy Franks retired. :rolleyes:
    </font>[/QUOTE]Which generals should he have left this up to? It would seem that General Franks, the top guy who was in the country, agreed with Bush's decisions.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  6. LadyEagle

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    Well, Joseph. We won't. There will be civil war in Iraq and our troops will be caught in the middle as I have been saying all along.

    We do win the battles. But we will not win the war. The reason is because there has been and continues to be too much politicking going on just like in Vietnam.

    I would like to know in what ways other than possible intelligence gathering, the war in Afghanistan or Iraq has profitted the American people with the exception of the very rich.

    Certain people in this administration have made money off of this war. A person of moral character would believe that policy makers of any country who sends the sons and daughters of others to be maimed and die, while profitting from the act of war on another nation, would be a conflict of interest or a betrayal of the public trust. At the very least.

    But if one can promote enough justification for the Body Politic to support one's actions, that makes it okay. One way to promote justification is to make the threat seem more ominous than it really is, or, to create a diversion from what one is really up to.
     
  7. Joseph_Botwinick

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    So, which generals were you referring to, LE? You know, the ones Bush should have listened to, besides Franks? The only similarity I can find in this war and Vietnam is the predictable belly-aching and seditious (borderline treasonous) speech that has come from the liberal anti-war crowd.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  8. LadyEagle

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    Joseph, I seem to remember there was a big to-do between the Generals and Rumsfeld about the number of "boots on the ground" needed to assure complete victory. Even all the talk shows with retired military officers were talking about the numbers. There weren't enough. The estimates were reduced by the civilian, Donald Rumsfeld.

    And especially my #1 Military hero, the Hack, harped on it. The Hack got so disgusted with the military leadership (including the Commander in Chief), and their strategies, he even stopped appearing on cable shows.

    Here is his web site: http://www.hackworth.com

    Here's a snip from a Conservative website:

    http://www.amconmag.com/2004_08_30/article1.html
     
  9. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Here is what General Tommy Franks, who was in Iraq and had a firsthand leadership perspective of what was going on in Iraq had to say about the number of troops issue:

    Franks: No Extra Troops Needed in Iraq
     
  10. LadyEagle

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    Looks like he was wrong.
     
  11. Pennsylvania Jim

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    No number of troops can force order and "democracy" upon a nation made up of three large, non-Christian groups who hate each other and are glad to die for their respective causes.
     
  12. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Was he wrong because Hack says so or because you say so? Or, is it possible that Hack, as great a military hero as he probably was, doesn't have a clue what he is talking about because he is not there and doesn't know what is really going on? I don't know. I think General Franks probably has more credibility than some guy on the tv and radio and probably has a better handle on the situation.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  13. Pennsylvania Jim

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    Hack must be wrong...after all, those in charge have everything about wrapped up.
     
  14. poncho

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    We'll be in Iran and Syria before long and Iraq will be just another small matter. Hey! I wonder if Haliburton is hiring? I's think there would be lots of glass repair work to be done over there by now.

    Is it fair to outsource yourself to another country?
     
  15. Joseph_Botwinick

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    Do you think this is the only work Haliburton has ever done after a war? There is a reason they are there that has nothing to do with Cheney or some grand conspiracy.

    Joseph Botwinick
     
  16. Terry_Herrington

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    Yea, right. :rolleyes:
     
  17. Pennsylvania Jim

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    Sure, all the connections are simply coincidinces.
     
  18. SpiritualMadMan

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    As Joeseph says all wars are a mess...

    Given the political climate of this nation and the large numbers of 'Armchair' generals...

    What we have is a mess...

    But, it is **FAR** less of a mess than the Liberal Pro-Communist News Media is making it out to be...

    I'd rather have what we now have than have saddam still in power using the billions of dollars from the Oil for Food Program to fund Al Queda actively...

    Most sources close to the scandal investigation are saying that it is left over Oil for Food money that is funding the insurgency...

    And, we 'dare' wnder why France, Germany, and Russia didn't want us to go into Iraq??? They made over 10.1 Billion dollars!

    And, kerry still thinks the UN is the US's friend and it's true value is yet to be relaized?????

    Go on Don Quixote... Have your joust...
     
  19. Pennsylvania Jim

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    Saddam Hussein did not, as far as I have seen, fund Al Quaeda. It would be illogical for him to do so, since they hated him and would have used the money to attampt to kill him or destroy his regime.
     
  20. Pennsylvania Jim

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    To answer the original question of the post:

    "Will the Board Bushies ever admit Iraq is a mess?"

    Yes, around next February, if Kerry is elected.
     

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