Would God destroy the earth for animal-human chimera and hybrid experiments?

Discussion in 'Other Christian Denominations' started by BobRyan, Aug 14, 2016.

  1. BobRyan

    BobRyan
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    Keep silent or speak up?


    Gen 1 26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.” 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them

    Gen 6:11 11 The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. 12 So God looked upon the earth, and indeed it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way on the earth.

    "But if there was one sin above another which called for the destruction of the race by the flood, it was the base crime of amalgamation of man and beast which defaced the image of God, and caused confusion everywhere". …. {1SP 69.1}


    ==============================================================


    Ezek 3 17 “Son of man, I have made you a watchman for the house of Israel; therefore hear a word from My mouth, and give them warning from Me: 18 When I say to the wicked, ‘You shall surely die,’ and you give him no warning, nor speak to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life, that same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood I will require at your hand. 19 Yet, if you warn the wicked, and he does not turn from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but you have delivered your soul. (Ezekiel 3)

    QUOTE == from http://www.geneticsandsociety.org/article.php?id=9611

    NIH Plans To Lift Ban On Research Funds For Part-Human, Part-Animal Embryo


    by Rob Stein, NPR
    August 4th, 2016

    The federal government announced plans Thursday to lift a moratorium on funding of certain controversial experiments that use human stem cells to create animal embryos that are partly human.

    The National Institutes of Health is proposing a new policy to permit scientists to get federal money to make embryos, known as chimeras, under certain carefully monitored conditions.

    The NIH imposed a moratorium on funding these experiments in September because they could raise ethical concerns.

    One issue is that scientists might inadvertently create animals that have partly human brains, endowing them with some semblance of human consciousness or human thinking abilities. Another is that they could develop into animals with human sperm and eggs and breed, producing human embryos or fetuses inside animals or hybrid creatures.

    But scientists have argued that they could take steps to prevent those outcomes and that the embryos provide invaluable tools for medical research.

    For example, scientists hope to use the embryos to create animal models of human diseases, which could lead to new ways to prevent and treat illnesses. Researchers also hope to produce sheep, pigs and cows with human hearts, kidneys, livers, pancreases and possibly other organs that could be used for transplants.

    To address the ethical concerns, the NIH's new policy imposes several restrictions.

    But the policy would lift the moratorium on funding experiments involving other species. Because of the ethical concerns, though, at least some of the experiments would go through an extra layer of review by a new, special committee of government officials.

    That committee would, for example, consider experiments designed to create animals with human brain cells or human brain tissue. Scientists might want to create them to study neurological conditions such as Alzheimer's and Parkinson's diseases. But the experiments would undergo intensive scrutiny if there's any chance there might be a "substantial contribution" or "substantial functional modification" to an animal's brain.

    ---
    In addition, the NIH would even consider experiments that could create animals with human sperm and human eggs since they may be useful for studying human development and infertility. But in that case steps would have to be taken to prevent the animals from breeding.

    "I am confident that these proposed changes will enable the NIH research community to move this promising area of science forward in a responsible manner," Carrie Wolinetz, the NIH's associate director for science policy, wrote in a blog post.

    "At the end of the day, we want to make sure this research progresses because its very important to our understanding of disease. It's important to our mission to improve human health," she said in an interview with NPR. "But we also want to make sure there's an extra set of eyes on these projects because they do have this ethical set of concerns associated with them."

    Several scientists said they are thrilled by the new policy. "It's very, very welcome news that NIH will consider funding this type of research," says Pablo Ross, a developmental biologist at the University of California, Davis, trying to grow human organs in farm animals. "We need funding to be able to answer some very important questions."

    But critics denounced the decision. "Science fiction writers might have imagined worlds like this — like The Island of Dr. Moreau, Brave New World, Frankenstein," says Stuart Newman, a biologist at New York Medical College. "There have been speculations. But now they're becoming more real. And I think that we just can't say that since it's possible then let's do it."

    The public has 30 days to comment on the proposed new policy. NIH could start funding projects as early as the start of 2017.

    ===== clic on the "Comment" word to ... comment.
     
    #1 BobRyan, Aug 14, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2016
  2. BobRyan

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    I say again --

    "The public has 30 days to comment on the proposed new policy. NIH could start funding projects as early as the start of 2017."

    ===== clic on the "Comment" word to ... comment.
     
  3. Sapper Woody

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    The way I see it, God is in control. Man cannot create an animal that is part man. Not really. After all, humans and chimps share 98% of the same DNA, but we don't consider them 98% human.

    The only way that this is a threat to the natural order of things is if one believes wholeheartedly in evolution as a means of genesis.

    Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk
     
  4. BobRyan

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    1. Turns out we don't share 98% the same DNA. That is a myth. Just like we don't share 50% of the same DNA as a banana. Another myth. Only 5-15% of the DNA is "coding genes" - it is that 5% that they are talking about being 98% the same or 50% the same... That leaves 95% to be unknown variance!

    2. What you say they cannot do - -they already did. Creating the human brain in a rat to such an extent that they could then introduce a virus into the rat's human brain and get the virus to attack the human brain tissue just as it would do in a human... then dissect the rat at various stages to see just where the virus was attacking the human brain. They learned a lot about that pathogen that way. Doing what you claim they could never do.

    This form of abomination has nothing at all to do with evolution - it has to do with abomination.

    By introducing human stem cells designed to create entire organs - and organ systems - they can create genuine human organs in animals - so real that when transplanted into the human body they are accepted as "native" to the body.

    Hitler also had a number of wonderful "benefits" proposed for his monstrous programs experimenting on humans.

    "But if there was one sin above another which called for the destruction of the race by the flood, it was the base crime of amalgamation of man and beast which defaced the image of God, and caused confusion everywhere". …. {1SP 69.1}
     
  5. Sapper Woody

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    Whatever the percentages, my point still stands. Even if they are .01% the same, we still don't say that Chimpanzees are human/ape hybrids.

    That's not what I said they could not do. I said they could not make an animal that is part man. In other words, they can make organs and tissues that are compatible and contain human DNA, but the entity is still simply a mutated rat, or pig, or cow, as the case may be.

    You have yet to show how what has already been done is an abomination, or that what you're claiming would happen could happen.

    I was going to use myself as an example, but that would be a bad example as I am blood type O positive. But, even amongst humans, there is enough variance that just to accept blood our blood types have to be compatible. Can they make organs that could be taken by humans and used? It seems possible with our current technology, and I think it's wonderful. But to say that it would be accepted as "native" to the body? That is a huge stretch. Even in compatible humans, the recipient has to take drugs that lower their immunity so that the new host doesn't attack and destroy the incoming organ.

    Conflating experimenting with human DNA in animals and experimenting on humans in no way helps your argument.

    Neither does quoting Ellen White. Her words are pure conjecture, and in this case extremely extra-biblical. There is no evidence of any human/animal relations ever causing mutated offspring.

    While this may be too much information, on security cameras in Iraq I was the unwilling witness to a man having his way with a sheep. Evidently (even though frowned upon by Islam) this was a common occurrence. Why don't we have a bunch of half human / half sheep hybrids over there? Because they are incompatible.

    Even amongst "compatible" species, offspring cross overs are generally sterile. Mules, for example. Ligers for another (barring one case of a female liger getting impregnated by a male lion).

    Even nature shows us that what you think is happening or is going to happen cannot occur.
     
  6. BobRyan

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    That is true because it would be nonsense.

    But what we are talking about is taking actual human DNA at the 100% level for a given organ of the body - and inserting it into the embryo of an animal so that for a given organ the animal is 100% human.

    hint - that is where paying attention to actual details matters.

    =================================================================

    Gen 1 26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.” 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them

    Gen 6:11 11 The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. 12 So God looked upon the earth, and indeed it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way on the earth.

    "But if there was one sin above another which called for the destruction of the race by the flood, it was the base crime of amalgamation of man and beast which defaced the image of God, and caused confusion everywhere". …. {1SP 69.1}
     
  7. BobRyan

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    This is the only board that responds to the animal-human hybrid and chimera experiments - the abominations by every standard of human decency - gets treated with whining about the fact that it is even brought up as a problem!

    That my friends is "instructive".
     
  8. BobRyan

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    =================================================================

    Gen 1 26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.” 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them

    Gen 6:11 11 The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. 12 So God looked upon the earth, and indeed it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way on the earth.

    "But if there was one sin above another which called for the destruction of the race by the flood, it was the base crime of amalgamation of man and beast which defaced the image of God, and caused confusion everywhere". …. {1SP 69.1}

    What about simply "doing nothing" -- giving approval by silence as did the citizens of Germany in WWII?

    "Elijah cries: “How long halt ye between two opinions? if the Lord be God, follow Him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word.” Not one in that vast assembly dared utter one word for God and show his loyalty to Jehovah." {3T 280.2}

    "What astonishing deception and fearful blindness had, like a dark cloud, covered Israel! This blindness and apostasy had not closed about them suddenly; it had come upon them gradually as they had not heeded the word of reproof and warning which the Lord had sent to them because of their pride and their sins. And now, in this fearful crisis, in the presence of the idolatrous priests and the apostate king, they remained neutral. If God abhors one sin above another, of which His people are guilty, it is doing nothing in case of an emergency. Indifference and neutrality in a religious crisis is regarded of God as a grievous crime and equal to the very worst type of hostility against God." {3T 280.3}
     
  9. BobRyan

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    Your logic -- as always on this thread -- "illusive"
     
  10. Sapper Woody

    Sapper Woody
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    I haven't seen anyone "whining". You think it's a problem, I don't. You quote Ellen White, I trust God. I get it.

    Sent from my QTAQZ3 using Tapatalk
     
  11. BobRyan

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    With that encouraging statement about nobody whining on this thread -- let's focus on the topic of Christians 'doing something' --- over simply receive inherited guilt by refusing to stand and be counted.

    " doing nothing in case of an emergency. Indifference and neutrality in a religious crisis is regarded of God as a grievous crime and equal to the very worst type of hostility against God."
    =================================================================

    Gen 1 26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.” 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them

    Gen 6:11 11 The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. 12 So God looked upon the earth, and indeed it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way on the earth.

    "But if there was one sin above another which called for the destruction of the race by the flood, it was the base crime of amalgamation of man and beast which defaced the image of God, and caused confusion everywhere". …. {1SP 69.1}

    What about simply "doing nothing" -- giving approval by silence as did the citizens of Germany in WWII?

    "Elijah cries: “How long halt ye between two opinions? if the Lord be God, follow Him: but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered him not a word.” Not one in that vast assembly dared utter one word for God and show his loyalty to Jehovah." {3T 280.2}

    "What astonishing deception and fearful blindness had, like a dark cloud, covered Israel! This blindness and apostasy had not closed about them suddenly; it had come upon them gradually as they had not heeded the word of reproof and warning which the Lord had sent to them because of their pride and their sins. And now, in this fearful crisis, in the presence of the idolatrous priests and the apostate king, they remained neutral. If God abhors one sin above another, of which His people are guilty, it is doing nothing in case of an emergency. Indifference and neutrality in a religious crisis is regarded of God as a grievous crime and equal to the very worst type of hostility against God." {3T 280.3}
     
  12. utilyan

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    Your kidding right? You should visit New Orleans, with all the vampires, werewolves, mutants,x-men, mermaids, centaurs, bigfoot, gargoyles, satyr, orcs, goblins, hob goblins, ogres, zombies, trolls, dragons, kobolds, attack chickens, Owls, Owls-chickens, gremlins, Cyclops, Ninja Turtles, rat people, minotaurs, elves, dwarves, hobbits and the chupacabra.

    :Biggrin


    God we should trust. Thing that scares me is humans is fragile as is we've seen civilizations wiped out by disease.

    We've seen natural predators to particular animals and natural defenses vice versa. Its a scary thought if by "DNA code" there is already a code for mankind's direct predator.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. BobRyan

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    Let me guess - you live in a tiny world where the NIH - the National Institute of Health is a mermaid.

    err... umm... because they did not know about the NIH back in the dark ages?

    What is your story for making such absurd associations with the NIH??

    Are you "new" to the 20th century?? Even in this - the 21st?
     
  14. utilyan

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    I don't agree with messing with human beings. Maybe you could start with teaching your own church to stop doing abortions.

    I hope you found everything I said absurd. Your worried God will blow up the planet incase we harm ourselves.

    Wasn't killing Jesus bad enough?

    You think making wolf-man is where God will draw the line.


    At least those things are living, MAN if you had that kind a fervor maybe SDA hospitals would stop doing abortions, stop murdering children.


    Let me hear you say "Abortion is the murder of human being". Then we can take a consistent step against all this genetic mumbo jumbo.
     
    #14 utilyan, Aug 20, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2016
  15. BobRyan

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    You mock crimes against humanity as if you're used to it. Wonder how that happened. This is not an anti-catholic thread. Or is "history" -- anticatholic?

    Is that simply the "catholic way"? Being disagreeable for the sake of being disagreeable - no matter the topic?

    "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Edmund Burke

    The good men will take action -- the rest will mock.


    The sin of being silent
    9. Ezekiel 3:18-19 If I say to the wicked, ‘You shall surely die,’ and you give him no warning, nor speak to warn the wicked from his wicked way, in order to save his life, that wicked person shall die for his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. But if you warn the wicked, and he does not turn from his wickedness, or from his wicked way, he shall die for his iniquity, but you will have delivered your soul.


    Ephesians 5:11-12 Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. It is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret.

    Psalm 94:16 Who will rise up for me against the wicked? Who will stand for me against those who practice iniquity?

    Isaiah 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

    Proverbs 17:15 ESV He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous are both alike an abomination to the Lord.
     
    #15 BobRyan, Aug 20, 2016
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2016
  16. BobRyan

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    You "claim" to be against killing humans - yet what exactly do you think is going to happen in those cases they mention where animals have fully human male and female gametes and the mating of animals results in a fully human embryo - what exactly did you think was going to happen to such an embryo??

    a "blessed glorious life and future" in the lab?? Here is a new source of human embryo with no human parent to deal with or complain about "what happens next".

    Yet your "contribution" to standing against such evils - is to mock any effort to expose them?

    Seriously?

    That is the Catholic way or something??
     
  17. DHK

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    Romans 8:22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
    23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.

    The passage teaches that not only we wait for the redemption of our bodies, that is the second coming of Christ or our own resurrection, the two happening at the same time (the rapture of the believer, and the judgment of the unbeliever in Rev.20:11-15).
    But this world looks for its redemption as well. It groans and travails in pain even now, and has been from the time of the curse when the Fall took place. At the Second Coming, seven years after after the rapture, Christ will set up his millennial kingdom, and the earth will be restored to its former glory. The earth is waiting for that time. Until then it groans under a curse.

    There will come a time when God will destroy this earth, but not for the reasons that you state. It is in his eternal plan, and has been all along. Nothing that man does alters God's plans which were set before the foundation of the earth.

    2 Peter 3:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
    7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
    --God destroyed the earth once by a flood. He promised never to do that again. But he has promised to destroy this earth one more time.

    2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
    --After they are burned with great heat, then he will make a new earth and a new heaven. Then man (saved man) will dwell for all eternity. This is the point you continually miss when you take passages like those in Isaiah 66 out of context.

    Isaiah 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
    23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.
    --He is not speaking of this earth. This earth; this heaven; will be burnt up with a fervent heat, but not for the reasons you state.
     
  18. utilyan

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    Bob the only reason I ever responded on this thread is the OP question. Which implies God will destroy the world for a particular evil. The worst evil was killing Jesus, God's mercy has no limit.

    Just because I don't think God is going to destroy the planet because someone made a genetic abomination, doesn't mean I'm for genetic abominations.


    I am not for testing on human beings in unborn states or messing with genetics. You know how to read right? not silent.

    But you are silent about abortion........ All I got to do is hear you say "abortion is murder".

    ergo your "SILENCE" dodging, tap dancing, unable to face up the murder taking place in SDA hospitals.

    I would be off your back.


    Its amazing I have a bad character because I won't agree to a God that murders the entire planet. You ready to toss folks in volcano. Sorry chief.
     
  19. BobRyan

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    You have once again "quote you well" -- and in this case in defense of one of the worst abominations that can be done by mankind.

    Now let's go to the actual Word of God - given to man.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    Gen 1 26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.” 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them

    Gen 6:11 11 The earth also was corrupt before God, and the earth was filled with violence. 12 So God looked upon the earth, and indeed it was corrupt; for all flesh had corrupted their way on the earth.

    "But if there was one sin above another which called for the destruction of the race by the flood, it was the base crime of amalgamation of man and beast which defaced the image of God, and caused confusion everywhere". …. {1SP 69.1}

    Rev 11
    18
    And the nations were enraged, and Your wrath came, and the time came for the dead to be judged (starting Oct 22,1844), and the time to reward Your bond-servants the prophets and the saints and those who fear Your name, the small and the great, and to destroy those who destroy the earth.”


    Matt 24

    37 For the coming of the Son of Man will be just like the days of Noah. 38 For as in those days before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noah entered the ark, 39 and they did not understand until the flood came and took them all away; so will the coming of the Son of Man be.

    ================================

    And for those who view themselves as enlightened Christians whose job it is to be a light on a hill.

    9. Ezekiel 3:18-19 If I say to the wicked, ‘You shall surely die,’ and you give him no warning, nor speak to warn the wicked from his wicked way, in order to save his life, that wicked person shall die for his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand. But if you warn the wicked, and he does not turn from his wickedness, or from his wicked way, he shall die for his iniquity, but you will have delivered your soul.


    Ephesians 5:11-12 Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them. It is shameful even to mention what the disobedient do in secret.

    Psalm 94:16 Who will rise up for me against the wicked? Who will stand for me against those who practice iniquity?

    Isaiah 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil, who put darkness for light and light for darkness, who put bitter for sweet and sweet for bitter.

    Proverbs 17:15 ESV He who justifies the wicked and he who condemns the righteous are both alike an abomination to the Lord.
     
  20. BobRyan

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    The argument on God's side is not that man has only committed one abomination, only one sin... the argument is that of all the heaven-daring acts of man some in fact one - calls for quick destruction.

    The fact that it has been 2000 years since the cross proves that the cross did not call for immediate destruction of the planet. So also for a great many other abominations and sins all of which doom the earth, and all of which call for eventual destruction.

    They do call for destruction but not immediate -- not swift and quick retribution. But there is one that will get you such a result.
     

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