Yos can't lose salvation!

good post....

 

You made some excellent points. I would add that you are sealed by the Spirit. If one has not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His (never was); If one has the Spirit of Christ he/she is sealed. Having been involved in trucking, I can tell you that a seal cannot be broken except by the receiving party. That "party" in this case is the Lord Jesus Christ. You do not, cannot, break His seal!
One big objection to eternal security is that God does not take away our free choice. But that is not the way to look at it. Once saved the God-believer relationship is Parent-child, and God knows how to parent! The one that is in Christ is a child of God and can not be otherwise at the whim of the child, no more than he/she can ever be a child of anyone other than their natural parents.
Would any parent here stand by and just watch while their child drinks poison? Well. rebellion, unbelief, willful sin is poison and God will deal with that, even if it means the loss of this life. If one can seemingly walk away and they have no trouble with this, it is indicative of a person who never was saved and it does not matter how much fruit that person may have displayed in the past.
Also consider that the Lord Jesus said that His sheep will not listen to another voice. Human philosophy, the teachings of cults, the "...doctrines of devils and things taught by demons," or whatever else may be trying to convince a believer to abandon the faith are "other" voices.

 

A very good book which addresses this is Grace Gone Wild! by Pastor Robert Jeffress.

In it he defends Grace as the source for all salvation but he doesn't allow it to be a source for excuses for waywardness and vice (i.e. Antinomianism). In our day I believe it such antinomianism has driven many from the Gospel and others in the Church into a feeble lukewarm Christianity where the answers to slavery and bondage to a sinful life is not preached. Some would say that Grace is to no effect for those seeking relief from addictions but our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ was a healer and he can and will heal his followers so we can look to a life not bound to sin but bound to Christ's Cross. Amen.

 

HP: Was Adam a child of God before the fall?

 

That is answered in the Scriptures:
"the son of Enosh, the son of Seth, the son of Adam, the son of God (Luke 3:38)

 

Watchman

From one trucker to another-:thumbs: :thumbs: :thumbs: :godisgood:

 

HP: A very telling verse indeed. Possibly your original post could stand to be updated or edited in light of the passage you quote?

 

HP you are a nut beating a dead horse! If the "salvation" you have isn't eternally secure then you are in trouble.

 

HP: What kindness you emit in you post. (Not)

I simply asked a pertinent question. I would guess that you do not have the foggiest what I believe concerning the issue. By the way, I don’t beat horses, dead or alive.

 

AAA

Amen!:thumbs:


I'd like to add some food for thought. If the gift of Salvation was imperfect, then obviously it could be forfeited or lost, but it was God in the flesh(the creator of the universe), not some ordinary human being, who lowered himself for us and died on the cross for us. Unfortunately, the majority of people pollute the perfect gift of Jesus Christ by trying to add something to it. This only serves to nullify what Christ did on the cross. Paul's whole letter to the Galatians addressed this problem, and it is just as bad today as it was then.

The next time you hear someone say they've given/forfeited their faith because,
-It's been a rough year.
-My car just keeps breaking down.
-I'm plagued by illness.
-I've lost a loved one.
-God just isn't answering my prayers, so He must not be there.
etc...
Ask them where that verse in the Bible is where Jesus says,
"Wanna be a Christian?
Then, Hey! Hey! Hey!
Come Partay!"

You just wont find it. People, the life of a Christian is not all giggles and goosebumps. What did Jesus really say?
Look at John 15:18:
"If the world hates you, keep in mind that it hated me first."
Then in verse 20 Jesus says,
"...If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also."
This is one of several warnings of the consequences of following Christ.

Anybody here ever read Foxes Book of Martyrs? It is a record of some of the thousands of Christians throughout history who have been tortured and executed because they would not recant the name of Jesus Christ. Even though we don't hear much about it, there are more Christians dying today than there were then.

How about the Disciples? Does anybody know what happened to them?
-Philip was scourged and crucified.
-Matthew was nailed to the ground with spikes and beheaded.
-Jude was beaten to death with sticks and clubs.
-Simon was tortured and crucified.
-John, the son of Zebedee, was tortured and exiled.
-James, the brother of John, was beheaded.
-James, the brother of Jesus, was pushed from the top of a building and then his broken body was beaten to death.
-Andrew, Peter's brother, hung on a cross for three days before dying.
-Bartholomew was beaten and skinned alive before being beheaded.
-Thomas was speared with a javelin.
-Peter was crucified upside down.

Just a note on Peter. He asked to be crucified upside down because he felt he wasn't worthy to be crucified right-side up as the Savior was.
And just so the ladies don't feel left out--Peter's wife was crucified just before he was, and he was forced to stand and watch her die. It has been said(and I've not been able to confirm this)that until she died, Peter kept repeating over and over to her,
"Remember the Lord. Remember the Lord. Remember the Lord...."

Now, you might be saying,
"Good heavens, why would I want to be a Christian?"
Why did these people listed above and how have people down through history remained faithfull and been willing to die for Jesus Christ?
They were convicted that Jesus Christ was and is Lord, and He promised them and us he would return for them and us. They kept looking up. Our joy as Christians lies not in what we will gain now; today. It is in what we will gain in eternity. These people knew it and many suffered horribly for it, and Christians today continue to suffer for it.

The next time you question your faith in God, remember, He didn't promise us Heaven on earth, He promised us eternal life with Him in Heaven. That's eternal immortality. That's where our joy is. Gene Rodenberry's imagination doesn't hold a candle to John's description in Revelation 21 and 22 of Heaven.

Paul sums all this up in Romans,
"As it is written:
'For your sake we face death all day long:
we are considered as sheep to be slaughtered.'
No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, neither height nor depth, not anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord."-Romans 8:36-39 NIV

That's the conviction that each and everyone of us should have if we are Christians. We don't need more truths to be convicted of, we need more conviction of the Truth we have. Because Jesus Christ was heaven sent, Christians are Heaven bound.

 

The Security of the ELECT is in CHRIST, not one's self.

There is no objective test for election.

 

HP: If there was, could one be saved by faith?

 

If i were to ask this question:
Which is true
a)5+5=9
b)2+7=4
c)7+7=3
d)9-1=5
How would you answer this?
I would have to say there are no right answers to wrong questioins.
If ask I a person could loose their salvation I would respond the same with there are no wrong answers to wrong questions.

I have no idea why anyone would want to loose their salvation so why should I respond to anyone that ask if you could loose their salvation. I have never wanted to loose my salvation.

 

Yos can't lose salvation!

I'm glad it ain't like excess weight, then.

 

Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a merchant man, seeking goodly pearls: Who, when he had found one pearl of great price, went and sold all that he had, and bought it. - Matthew 13:45-46 KJV

I ask myself 'am I like the merchant... have I went and sold all that I have to purchase it'? :tear:

 

I would like to quote Major Payne (the movie)

You have a attitudinal problem!:laugh:

 

alright - here's how i view this OSAS deal. if that's what you want to call it.
..........

i don't believe that once you know someone - that you can just choose NOT to know them. it's not possible.

for example - you meet a friend and you get to know them real good for the next two years.

then something happens and you decide to "un-know" them... it just doesn't work. you still will know that person even if you don't want to.
..........

BUT. there is always the possiblity (and this is scriptural) of not being friends or having relations with that person at all. you can "deny" that person any relations with you.

just like that one verse says "if we deny Him, He will deny us before His Father" (something like that).

i believe that people who were once christians - can't become atheists. it's not possible.

BUT i do believe that people who were once christians can go away and deny Christ - deny that he ever rose from the dead etc. etc. -- to turn away from Christ and go to other 'gods' - other religions.

and it's in that case where i would look at that person and not see Christ - in other words - they wouldn't be christians. because they've turned away and gone astray to other gods. false gods.

..........

i believe this because it's exactly what has happened to my dad.

my dad was once a very strong christian.
then he got into researching judaism (he blames it on the lack of power within the churches these days) - and turned over to judeaism (sp? haha)

i know for a fact that he's not a christian now. he's denied Christ and all that He is. and has turned over to orthodox Judaism.
..........

that is the only way where i can see how somebody can lose salvation.
"if it's able to be gained - it's possible to be lost" or something like that.

but i don't believe that somebody can go from knowing God to not-knowing God. not possible - not logical.

God bless - peace.

 

To ask whether or not one was ever saved to begin with is nothing more than a cop-out response and a weak one at that. If that’s the standard response then how does any of us know we are truly saved, for we don’t know what future circumstances could affect our relationship with God.

I also don’t believe that anyone or thing can pluck me from God’s hand, but I do believe that we still have the freedom to jump from His hand if we choose too.

I love the woman I’m married to and we both nurture our relationship in many ways that ensures that our relationship will continue to grow until death do us part. But, my wife could still choose in the future to leave me and break our relationship…I will still love her and desire a relationship with her, but if she’s moved on and no longer loves me, then our relationship has been broken and she’s turned her back on me…

This is how I look at my relationship with God. God loves me and desires that not only I, but also all of mankind will be saved. I have been saved, I am being saved and I have the hope that when I draw my last breath I will be saved. As long as I nurture my relationship with God through prayer, and the Sacraments that Christ gave His Church, then the odds in me turning my back on God are slim to none.

God will never turn His bock on Agnus_Dei, but as Paul says, we must work out our own salvation with both fear and trembling.

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