Your Chance to Defend Islam

Hello Johnv,

I'm simply trying to understand how you and I can profess faith in the same Lord Jesus Christ and yet hold two very different views regarding the identity and very nature of God. Your response here does not address the questions that I asked. As a Bible-believing Christian I would hope that your answers to the questions would be something like the following:

1. When Adam and Eve sinned in the Garden of Eden, did Yahweh God forgive them so completely that their sin caused no lasting consequence that would effect all generations since that time?

No. According to the Genesis account God forgave Adam and Eve of their sin, but he drove them out of Eden and decreed that the curse of their sin would effect all future generations of mankind. Thus, all humans since that time, with the exception of Jesus, have been born with the curse of original sin.

2. Did Yahweh God command Abraham to offer Isaac up to Him as a sacrifice?

Yes.

3. Does Yahweh God ever change?

No.

4. Can Yahweh God ever lie or act in a deceitful manner?

No. He is perfectly Holy, Just, and Righteous.

5. Does Yahweh God utterly love His creation, mankind?

Yes, because God so loved the world He sent His only begotten Son to suffer and die as the only perfect sacrifice that could remove the curse of original sin. Then He raised Him from the the dead as a sign to assure us of our future hope in Christ.

6. Has Yahweh God revealed that He is Triune?

Yes.

Again, as Bible-believing Christians I hope that our responses to those six simple questions would be something similar to what I typed above.

However, if you and I were to agree that those are acceptable answers to those six questions I would then be forced to attempt to answer them using the information containted in the Quran and the answers would be gravely different as follows:

1. When Adam and Eve sinned in the Garden of Eden, did Allah forgive them so completely that their sin caused no lasting consequence that would effect all generations since that time?

Yes, according to surah 2 of the Quran, Allah in his mercy quickly forgave Adam and there is no lasting effect of the sin. Thus, there is no curse of sin, or original sin that effects all mankind.

2. Did Allah command Abraham to offer Isaac up to Him as a sacrifice?

No, according to the Quran Allah commanded Abraham to sacrifice Ishmael (surah 37:100-11).

3. Does Allah ever change?

Yes. According to the Quran Allah changes, "If We supersede any verse or cause it to be forgotten, We bring a better one or one similar. Do you not know that Allah has power over all things!" (surah 2:106)

4. Can Allah ever lie or act in a deceitful manner?

Yes. According to the Quran Allah deceives, "They plot and plan, and Allah plans, but the best of planners [in context meaning 'deceivers'] is Allah" (surah 8:30). Additionally, the Jews boast in surah 4:157, "'We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Apostle of Allah', - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them" (surah 4:157).

5. Does Allah utterly love his creation, mankind?

No. According to the Quran Allah changes his affections, "If we so willed, we could have brought every soul its true guidance, but the word from me will come true: 'I will fill Hell with demons and men all together' (surah 32:13)."

6. Has Allah revealed that he is Triune?

No! According to the Quran Allah can be no God but one. The Trinity is blasphemous, "They do blaspheme who say God is on of three... for there is no Allah except one Allah" (surah 5:73).

Now, as Bible-believing Christians we answered these questions differently than we were able to answer them using the Quran as our source. There is a contradiction here. If we claim that the Quranic Allah of Mohammad and the biblical God of Abraham are one and the same we have violated the law of non-contradiction. Therefore, logically speaking, such a claim is proven to be invalid.

I cannot understand why you would say that you are unwilling to change your opinion when presented with hard facts that directly contradict that opinion. It does not seem logical. I am certainly willing to change my opinion with respect to our current discussion. However, you'll have to present some facts and prove to me where my logic has failed. No one engaged in this debate has yet to do that. Here I stand...

[ February 27, 2003, 02:20 AM: Message edited by: BibleboyII ]

 

Then why are you arguing in support of the idea that the Quranic Allah of Mohammad and the biblical God of Abraham are one and the same? If that is your position then we most certainly do hold two very different views of God.

[ February 16, 2003, 06:05 AM: Message edited by: BibleboyII ]

 

It seems that we have had an undercover Muslim, posting as a Methodist, on this thread while I was away from the computer for a few days. I see that his posts have been removed from this thread as well as other threads on the boards. I am sorry that I missed his posts. I would like to have seen (heard) what he had to say. Oh well, I'm still waiting for someone who maintains that the biblical God of Abraham and the Quranic Allah of Mohammad are one and same to demonstrate their case in a logical and non-contradictory manner. Anyone who wants to continue this debate can start by addressing the six questions that I asked a couple of post back in the thread.