Pro-Russian Separatists Aggressions Lead to Tragedy

[preachinjesus]

For those who are suspicious of pro-Russian separatists being able to shoot down this Malaysian airliner seem to forget the recent pattern of their aggression.

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/bestoftv/2014/07/19/ac-questions-about-flight-path.cnn.html

http://www.businessinsider.com/ukra...-multiple-aircraft-over-the-past-month-2014-7

Notice in this video that there have been five aircraft shot down by these pro-Russian separatists in the past several weeks. Clearly they had the military capacity to shoot down this civilian airliner as they had demonstrated in the downing of a cargo jet earlier in the week.

Since FoxNews is a more credible source for some around here, they have a report on the phone call about the downing the plane from a pro-Russian leader:
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/0...calls-point-finger-in-jet-downing-at-russian/

As of today, the Ukraine has not shot down any pro-Russian separatist aircraft.

The evidence is beginning to build and become undeniable.

 

[poncho]

For those who are suspicious of pro-Russian separatists being able to shoot down this Malaysian airliner seem to forget the recent pattern of their aggression.

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/bestoftv/2014/07/19/ac-questions-about-flight-path.cnn.html

http://www.businessinsider.com/ukra...-multiple-aircraft-over-the-past-month-2014-7

Notice in this video that there have been five aircraft shot down by these pro-Russian separatists in the past several weeks. Clearly they had the military capacity to shoot down this civilian airliner as they had demonstrated in the downing of a cargo jet earlier in the week.

Since FoxNews is a more credible source for some around here, they have a report on the phone call about the downing the plane from a pro-Russian leader:
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2014/0...calls-point-finger-in-jet-downing-at-russian/

As of today, the Ukraine has not shot down any pro-Russian separatist aircraft.

The evidence is beginning to build and become undeniable.

Maybe the Washington (5 billion dollars and counting) EU backed coup government, who incidentally, lest we forget used violence to overthrow an elected government and outlawed the speaking of the Russian language are the ones to blame for all the violence and bloodshed. I find it most interesting that these two acts by the coup government are condoned by the same people who would go absolutely bonkers if these actions were to transpire here and I dare say our government is every bit if not more corrupt and lawless than the former elected government of Ukraine.

The evidence that Washington through the State Dept, USAID and NED was behind this "regime change" effort is also piling up though those who wish to blame the "separatists" for all the violence will not look at it.

Maybe the reason the Ukrainian coup governemt hasn't shot down any of the "separatists" planes is because they don't have any to shoot down? Who's really to blame for all the violence if not those responsible for financing the violent overthrow of the former elected Ukraine government?

Or is that something we aren't suppose to look at or consider on our great humanitarian quest to build up another dragon to slay abroad?

 

[Revmitchell]

First, the seperatists did not shoot down a Eukranian plane. They shot down a civilian commercial jet liner of which had nothing to do with the conflict.

Second, the seperatists have all the resources of Russia at their disposal.

 

[poncho]

Again . . . Show me the proof.

There seemed to be some confusion the last time I said "show me the proof" so let me clarify right from the begining. I'm asking YOU to SHOW ME the PROOF that the "separatists" shot down this plane. In other words you stated as a matter of fact that the "separatists" are responsible for shooting down this plane so you must have irrefutable evidence. Show it to me.

And no I won't accept other's opinion, accusations, hearsay, "gut feelings" or more fear mongering as evidence. It's not accepted in a court of law so I don't believe it should be accepted here either.

Show me the proof.

 

[Revmitchell]

I bet you want proof we landed on the moon also don't ya.

 

[poncho]

No all I'm asking is for you to back up your "matter of fact" statement you just made with proof.

Show it to me, show it to all of us.

 

[Revmitchell]

Apparently my post went over your head.

 

[poncho]

First, the seperatists did not shoot down a Eukranian plane. They shot down a civilian commercial jet liner of which had nothing to do with the conflict.

Second, the seperatists have all the resources of Russia at their disposal.

Wiggle wiggle wiggle or . . .

Show me the proof.

 

[preachinjesus]

The evidence that Washington through the State Dept, USAID and NED was behind this "regime change" effort is also piling up though those who wish to blame the "separatists" for all the violence will not look at it.

Well, this is a red herring. I don't care about the regime change that either is, or is not, going on in the Ukraine. This is about a civilian airliner shot down that took the lives of nearly 300 persons.

Or is that something we aren't suppose to look at or consider on our great humanitarian quest to build up another dragon to slay abroad?

I have yet to hear any US leader, or any international leader (I could be missing some), calling for military action. There will be consequences, but there needs to be a fact finding, evidence gathering process that is currently being held up by armed pro-Russian separatists.

Show me the proof.

What kind of proof are you willing to accept? Please be specific. What sources, terms, and data will merit proof in your view?

Likewise, please present to us, from credible news sources, that this was not a civilian airliner. Please present to us, from credible sources, that the persons on this airplane were not civilians and were agents of some other force. Please present to us what actually happened and why there is a massive debris field strewn across eastern Ukraine right now. Please present to us why there are nearly 300 bodies and thousands of body parts, seen via Twitter and other social media networks from users with no apparent government ties, around this debris field.

I'll show you mine if you show me yours.

 

[poncho]

Well, this is a red herring. I don't care about the regime change that either is, or is not, going on in the Ukraine. This is about a civilian airliner shot down that took the lives of nearly 300 persons.

Questioning the word of a government that is known to lie every time it speaks is a red herring?

Thanks for being man enough to admit you don't care if or how much damage Washington's foreign policy causes other nations. Most here just try to make excuses for their lack of concern or empathy for non Americans.

I have yet to hear any US leader, or any international leader (I could be missing some), calling for military action. There will be consequences, but there needs to be a fact finding, evidence gathering process that is currently being held up by armed pro-Russian separatists.

There's always the big buildup and fear mongering campaign and threats first. Or have you forgotten how it works so soon?

It sounds like your mind is already made up. What will you do if we find out it was the Ukrainian coup government that did it after all your blustering and blaming?

What kind of proof are you willing to accept? Please be specific. What sources, terms, and data will merit proof in your view?

More proof than the suspicion you evidently feel is good enough to convict the "separatists".

Likewise, please present to us, from credible news sources, that this was not a civilian airliner. Please present to us, from credible sources, that the persons on this airplane were not civilians and were agents of some other force. Please present to us what actually happened and why there is a massive debris field strewn across eastern Ukraine right now. Please present to us why there are nearly 300 bodies and thousands of body parts, seen via Twitter and other social media networks from users with no apparent government ties, around this debris field.

Why should I do all that? I've never made any claims as to anyone's guilt or innocence. All I've done is question the word of those who have lied to us in the past about such things to work the public up into a war frenzy and offer some alternate scenarios that could explain what happened.

Pretty obvious you don't want to hear them because you're set on blaming a certain party with no proof.

I'll show you mine if you show me yours.

You haven't got any and neither does the Rev else wise he wouldn't have clammed up and high tailed it out here so fast after making his "matter of fact" claim. That's the whole point.

BTW, there is such a thing as cause and effect. You remember, they taught us that in school. It's quite possible that if Washington had adhered to the constitution like it's supposed to and not been interfering in the Ukrainian's national affairs to the tune of an admitted 5 billion plus American tax payer dollars this violence might have never happened.

But I suppose like most paranoid fearful neocons you don't care about following the constitution when it comes to making war on people you seem to view as "un exceptional" or might that even be Untermensch at this point?

Here's some more possible explanations. http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=2130014#post2130014 I'm fairly certain you'll also view these as "red herrings" because they don't immediately place the blame on those you want so badly to be guilty.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Again . . . Show me the proof.

Not that you'll believe it, nor would you have believed it had you been sitting by the photographer shooting the video. That's how obsessed you are with conspiracies that do not exist.

Russian missile systems and other weapons moving toward Urkaine's eastern border in March