Featured Does James disprove Free Will?

We do have a body and soul. We are not clouds. Being in God’s image as 2/3rd is still only 2/3rds. We are depraved because we are only 2/3rds. Those who choose Christ are still depraved. We are still in bodies of flesh. We just do not have to let the flesh will us to do fleshly desires.

 

Without the tongue, we cannot tell others about the Good News of the Gospel. You could mime? Hold signs, without interpretations? What is bigger than telling others about Jesus Christ and His Atonement on the Cross?

 

Sounds like you think God keeps changing His mind, based on my desires.

Life is not science. Life is not testing several theories to understand a final outcome. You are wrong about God wanting us to tempt Him, or do evil. James 1:13-15

13 Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:
14 But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed.
15 Then when lust hath conceived, it bringeth forth sin: and sin, when it is finished, bringeth forth death.

 

Dave could you please point out where this passage in Romans below teaches that (dare I say it) sin has the power to corrupt the image of God in man.

It is mans heart which is corrupted by sin brother. Here is what Our Father has to say about our human heart,

Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?

Not just deceitful but deceitful above ALL THINGS.
Not just wicked but desperately wicked,
it is so horrible that even the personal realization of evil of one's own heart must come through divine revelation.

Romans 1
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness;
19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:
27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient;
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,
30 Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful:
32 Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them.

 

true, we have power available to us from the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ to be overcomers.

 

Allow me to clarify...
As I understand Romans 1 teaching, God gave mankind over to that which then gradually corrupted us:
Sin and our love for it.

So, the way I reason it, we as men corrupt everything we touch..
Even the image of God that we are created in.

Is there Scripture that specifically states it this way?

No, so I suppose you got me there, Hank.

Amen.

 

i dont know of any Dave but doesn't mean that there isn't one or two tucked away some where.

 

It also indicates that all humans are sealed by the Holy Spirit at conception. They are without excuse and protected from the Adversary. They are not protected from their own will, until they can understand. They are without excuse. They simply reject God because their own will is stronger than the free will of choice. The Holy Spirit still remains at work getting all to the point they can freely choose.

 

Tim,
I read this through and have to commend you for a well-thought-out response.
But I cannot seem to find any Scripture in it, and you haven't punctuated your thoughts with it, either.

Would you run through it again with Scriptural emphasis, please?

 

Romans 1:19-25

19 Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them.
20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
21 Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
23 And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves:
25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

This is not a blanket condition throughout history. This is conception to being reprobate. Verse 26, is the reprobate point.

This is God working in every single human at conception.

The will of God is Romans 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Believe:
accept (something) as true; feel sure of the truth of.

Free will as belief has not been well defined. Accepting something as true, with assurance is the ability to choose unimpeded. Only the Holy Spirit can even get us to that point. Mark 9:23-24

23 Jesus said unto him, If thou canst believe, all things are possible to him that believeth.
24 And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help thou mine unbelief.

Nothing concerning Salvation and Atonement is about us. We really do not have a choice in our flesh nature. But free will can only be the point we change from our sinful will in flesh, and the seemingly impossible will of God. Not doing anything or trying to justify ourselves is not changing our will.

Are belief and free will the same thing? If you are going to find free will as defined today, in the Bible, that may be a start. Belief cannot save either, and "belief" has more uses than incorrect definitions of "free will".

Jesus claimed belief could do all things. Some accuse free will of having the same ability. I am just sticking with the ability to choose unimpeded by necessity or fate.

 

Absurd. Sin does not mean loss of free will. It is a sin to think wrong thoughts about God but your brain still does it. So you sin by thought.

 

So you will not have a free will unless you are dead and in Heaven? Why then do people choose to go to Hell?

 

So I am guessing that you are a Calvinist?

 

Well, I have truly learned something today. John (3:16) lied when he said; “- - WHOSOEVER - -“!!!!!!

{Sarcasm, friends, to show the fallacy of claiming that God chooses (allows OR denies) who can/will be saved. If this is true, then it is God, not the individual, who chooses heaven or hell for the person.}

If true that God DOES choose who is saved or goes to hell, and John DID lie about this, then what else might be a lie that we don’t even know about now???????

 

You cannot choose without free will. Free will is the ability to choose.

One does not have free will, if they do not have the mental capacity to make a decision.