Should the weight of pastors be addressed?

[Ascetic X]

https://manhoodjourney.org/is-gluttony-a-sin/

The sin of gluttony is the over-indulgence and over-consumption of food or drink. But there is a bigger idea at play. It is a desire for more that cannot be quenched, not unlike greed. The point is that food becomes a god for you. In Genesis 25, Esau trades his entire birthright to his brother Jacob for a bowl of stew. One meal. His appetite cost him everything his future held, and it is one of the clearest pictures of gluttony in all of Scripture.

So, is gluttony a sin? Yes. And it is one that rarely gets called out from the pulpit. We tend to treat it as a respectable sin, something to laugh off while we go back for seconds. But it is not all that different from the deadly sin of lust. Both are rooted in appetite overriding obedience. Both cause real damage to the man and everyone around him.

In the 4th century, Christian teachers tended to list eight especially damaging sins, and gluttony was usually near the top of the list. John Cassian is an example:

[W]e now propose, being strengthened by God through your prayers, to approach the struggle against the eight principal faults, i.e. first, Gluttony or the pleasures of the palate; secondly, Fornication; thirdly, Covetousness, which means Avarice, or, as it may more properly be called, the love of money, fourthly, Anger; fifthly, Dejection; sixthly, “Accidie,” which is heaviness or weariness of heart; seventhly, κενοδοξία which means foolish or vain glory; eighthly, pride.

 

[atpollard]

I suspect “gluttony” is not about food or being overweight when the Bible talks about such things. Y’all are pastors (by and large) and I am not … but sin and I are no strangers.

Starting with Adam and Eve and the fruit in the garden, it was pleasant to look at, delightful to the senses and good for becoming like God. Those are the three areas that all sins draw us into the trap:

”lust of the eye” = seeing and wanting; including lust and coveting.
”pleasures of the flesh” = physical self indulgence; hedonism.
”pride of life” = desire for control; the need to be master of our destiny; refusal to submit to God.

I suspect Biblical warnings about “gluttony” are not about food, but about the attitude of the heart that feeds the “flesh”.

 

[Ascetic X]

I suspect “gluttony” is not about food or being overweight when the Bible talks about such things. Y’all are pastors (by and large) and I am not … but sin and I are no strangers.

Starting with Adam and Eve and the fruit in the garden, it was pleasant to look at, delightful to the senses and good for becoming like God. Those are the three areas that all sins draw us into the trap:

”lust of the eye” = seeing and wanting; including lust and coveting.
”pleasures of the flesh” = physical self indulgence; hedonism.
”pride of life” = desire for control; the need to be master of our destiny; refusal to submit to God.

I suspect Biblical warnings about “gluttony” are not about food, but about the attitude of the heart that feeds the “flesh”.

Gluttony is most certainly about food. Your suspicions are wrong.

Gluttony is over-indulging in food. It is lust for more food than you need, which leads to disease and wrecking your body, which is the temple of the Holy Spirit,

Proverbs 23:20-21 - Be not among drunkards or among gluttonous eaters of meat, for the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

Proverbs 23:2 - And put a knife to your throat if you are given to appetite.

Deuteronomy 21:20 - And they shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This our son is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.’

1 Corinthians 3:16-17 - Do you not know that you are God's temple and that God's Spirit dwells in you? If anyone destroys God's temple, God will destroy him. For God's temple is holy, and you are that temple.

Proverbs 25:16 - If you have found honey, eat only enough for you, lest you have your fill of it and vomit it.

Psalm 78:18 - They tested God in their heart by demanding the food they craved.

1 Corinthians 10:31 - So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.

Philippians 3:18-19 - For many, of whom I have often told you and now tell you even with tears, walk as enemies of the cross of Christ. Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things.

 

[Ben1445]

Y’all are pastors (by and large)

 

[Ben1445]

Gluttony is most certainly about food. Your suspicions are wrong.

Gluttony is over-indulging in food. It is lust for more food than you need, which leads to disease and wrecking your body, which is the temple of the Holy Spirit,

Proverbs 23:20-21 - Be not among drunkards or among gluttonous eaters of meat, for the drunkard and the glutton will come to poverty, and slumber will clothe them with rags.

Proverbs 23:2 - And put a knife to your throat if you are given to appetite.

Deuteronomy 21:20 - And they shall say to the elders of his city, ‘This our son is stubborn and rebellious; he will not obey our voice; he is a glutton and a drunkard.’

1 Corinthians 3:16-17 - Do you not know that you are God's temple and that God's Spirit dwells in you? If anyone destroys God's temple, God will destroy him. For God's temple is holy, and you are that temple.

Proverbs 25:16 - If you have found honey, eat only enough for you, lest you have your fill of it and vomit it.

Psalm 78:18 - They tested God in their heart by demanding the food they craved.

1 Corinthians 10:31 - So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.

Philippians 3:18-19 - For many, of whom I have often told you and now tell you even with tears, walk as enemies of the cross of Christ. Their end is destruction, their god is their belly, and they glory in their shame, with minds set on earthly things.

The flesh profits nothing.

Colossians 2:20-23
Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances,
(Touch not; taste not; handle not;
Which all are to perish with the using after the commandments and doctrines of men?
Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh.

 

[Deacon]

Can a person be obese and not gluttonous?

Obesity does not necessitate gluttony.
Gluttony is a state of mind, an attitude, a trait.

The only obese person I can think in Scripture is Eli, Samuel's tutor and the father of the wicked Hophni and Phinehas (1 Sam. 4:18). He wasn't condemned for his obesity but for the neglect of aggressively disciplining his sons.

HALOT supplies translations of contemptible, of low value, weak; mean, thoughtless, rash
(Dt 21:20; Pr 23:20-21; 28:7...), not fat.
I think obese is a meaning added by our modern society.
So a person can be gluttonous and not obese.

In this time of abundance, obesity may be a sign of blessing.
When obesity is accompanied by these other undesirable traits, then it becomes a sin.

Rob (I've been blessed)

 

[Jerome]

The only obese person I can think in Scripture is Eli, Samuel's tutor

Hello?

[Judges 3]
12 And the children of Israel did evil again in the sight of the Lord: and the Lord strengthened Eglon the king of Moab against Israel, because they had done evil in the sight of the Lord. 13 And he gathered unto him the children of Ammon and Amalek, and went and smote Israel, and possessed the city of palm trees. 14 So the children of Israel served Eglon the king of Moab eighteen years. 15 But when the children of Israel cried unto the Lord, the Lord raised them up a deliverer, Ehud the son of Gera, a Benjamite, a man lefthanded: and by him the children of Israel sent a present unto Eglon the king of Moab. 16 But Ehud made him a dagger which had two edges, of a cubit length; and he did gird it under his raiment upon his right thigh. 17 And he brought the present unto Eglon king of Moab: and Eglon was a very fat man. 18 And when he had made an end to offer the present, he sent away the people that bare the present. 19 But he himself turned again from the quarries that were by Gilgal, and said, I have a secret errand unto thee, O king: who said, Keep silence. And all that stood by him went out from him. 20 And Ehud came unto him; and he was sitting in a summer parlour, which he had for himself alone. And Ehud said, I have a message from God unto thee. And he arose out of his seat. 21 And Ehud put forth his left hand, and took the dagger from his right thigh, and thrust it into his belly: 22 And the haft also went in after the blade; and the fat closed upon the blade, so that he could not draw the dagger out of his belly; and the dirt came out. 23 Then Ehud went forth through the porch, and shut the doors of the parlour upon him, and locked them. 24 When he was gone out, his servants came; and when they saw that, behold, the doors of the parlour were locked, they said, Surely he covereth his feet in his summer chamber. 25 And they tarried till they were ashamed: and, behold, he opened not the doors of the parlour; therefore they took a key, and opened them: and, behold, their lord was fallen down dead on the earth. 26 And Ehud escaped while they tarried, and passed beyond the quarries, and escaped unto Seirath. 27 And it came to pass, when he was come, that he blew a trumpet in the mountain of Ephraim, and the children of Israel went down with him from the mount, and he before them. 28 And he said unto them, Follow after me: for the Lord hath delivered your enemies the Moabites into your hand. And they went down after him, and took the fords of Jordan toward Moab, and suffered not a man to pass over. 29 And they slew of Moab at that time about ten thousand men, all lusty, and all men of valour; and there escaped not a man. 30 So Moab was subdued that day under the hand of Israel. And the land had rest fourscore years.

 

[Ascetic X]

Can a person be obese and not gluttonous?

Obesity does not necessitate gluttony.
Gluttony is a state of mind, an attitude, a trait.

The only obese person I can think in Scripture is Eli, Samuel's tutor and the father of the wicked Hophni and Phinehas (1 Sam. 4:18). He wasn't condemned for his obesity but for the neglect of aggressively disciplining his sons.

HALOT supplies translations of contemptible, of low value, weak; mean, thoughtless, rash
(Dt 21:20; Pr 23:20-21; 28:7...), not fat.
I think obese is a meaning added by our modern society.
So a person can be gluttonous and not obese.

In this time of abundance, obesity may be a sign of blessing.
When obesity is accompanied by these other undesirable traits, then it becomes a sin.

Rob (I've been blessed)

Gluttony is making food an idol. It manifests itself in obesity.

Over-eating is sinful indulging of the flesh.

While obesity can be caused by a medical issue, it is mostly due to food lusts.

Obesity is not a sign of blessing, it is a sign of a lack of self-control.

Our body is a temple of the Holy Spirit. Obesity is disrespectful toward this temple.

I Corinthians 9:27

but I strictly discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified.

 

[Ben1445]

How does certain cultures of mothers and mothers in law standing over you and forcing you to eat, fit into the doctrine of skinny Christians?

Do we turn to them as they bring you more food and say “Get thee behind me Satan?”

Just wondering how other people’s forceful generosity fits into this.

 

[Ascetic X]

How does certain cultures of mothers and mothers in law standing over you and forcing you to eat, fit into the doctrine of skinny Christians?

Do we turn to them as they bring you more food and say “Get thee behind me Satan?”

Just wondering how other people’s forceful generosity fits into this.

Blaming obesity on other people forcing food on you?

You can decline the surplus food with a “Thank you, but I’m already full, I’m completely stuffed, and cannot put more into my stomach.”

I had to stubbornly resist food forcing when a Muslim friend invited me to a post Ramadan meal at a halal restaurant where he was the chef. His friends kept trying to get me to eat more, and to take several wrapped sandwiches home with me.

I politely declined their urging to keep eating, telling them that I had enough.

Later, my Muslim friend told me I had offended them by rejecting their food.

I don’t ever want to offend anyone, but people should respect your boundaries, and not try to force things on you.