Featured Was it God's will for Adam to Sin ?

No it is a very practical conclusion because it will not matter what kind or amount of evidence is placed before either of you as both of your are incapable of OBJECTIVE evaluation of Biblical evidence. For example, Romans 8:7-9 is a self-evident and clearly stated contrast between the unregenerated man "in the flesh" and the regenerated man "in the Spirit" and you will flatly deny the emphatic negative description of the unregenerated state as it is described in Romans 8:7-8. You will refuse to accept the complete denial of spiritual ability clearly stated "enmity" "not subject" "neither indeed CAN be...THEREFORE...in the flesh CANNOT please God"

Nothing could be stated more clear in a more defined context of the unregenerate and yet you and your compadre deny the obvious and the explicitly stated condition set clearly before you and instead run to labeling (e.g. "Calvinism" "Calvinists" Augustinians) simply because of your own inability to objectively deal with Biblical evidence no matter how clear it may be. Hence, you are both "hopeless" heretics IMO.

In addition, Jesus clearly states "NO MAN CAN" come to him except faith is "given unto him of my Father (Jn 6:64-65) and every single one the Father does draw does come to him (Jn. 6:44) because every single one the Father teaches "cometh to me" (Jn. 6:45).

 

God Ordained that Adam and Lucifier would fall by an Act of sinning against the Lord, but the 'trick" in that is that he also allowedthem to do what they desired to see fit to do!

Were not 'robots" that God forced to do, but God had his sovereinghty and that classic 'free will" tied up in their falls!

 

muhj as God ordained that jesus would die to atone for Sin, He had determined that event, but also used 'free will" of wicked people to bring it to pass!

 

God cannot sin, nor does He tempt any to sin!

 

Exactly!

Acts 2:23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain:

 

So think that the calvinism that you rail against is NOT the version held by vast majority, as you appear to be set against a hard determinism one, that has God ordaing that Evil would occur, who caused the Fall, and who created people for both heaven/hell!

 

I certainly do not hold to any of those tenets.

 

Calvinists, Lutherans, and any religion that calls itself reformed believe that all humans are totally depraved, and cannot choose to come to God. If none can choose God, then all are forced to go to Hell. If all are totally depraved and cannot hear and believe, then God does force those going to Hell to go to Hell.

You have just stated your belief, and it is exactly what I said. You do believe that humans cannot believe in God after learning of Him. People who believe in total depravity believe that God saves them first so that they can believe. That is against what the Word of God says.

If you believe that God is sovereign, and that humans are totally depraved, then with your beliefs, it is God’s fault that people are born spiritually dead. However, God is sovereign, and God gave us a choice, but we choose to sin. There are those who gladly do right and remember His ways, but we cannot stop sinning, that is why we need a Savior. See Isaiah 64:5. You and anyone who believes in total depravity goes against what the scriptures say.

You say all are sinners and God redeems out a people unto Himself…But you also believe that God, for no know reason, choose not to save many people, but instead created them to go to Hell, for His pleasure.

How do you think there are a “faithful remnant” if all people are totally depraved?

 

It's just as blaphemous to assume that God is not. When God created Adam, it was "good" because that was exactly how God wanted him to be.

Can the creation undo what the Creator has done? Can the creation do anything but what the Creator has designed him to do? Satan is a creation of God and serves his purpose. The elect were created to give the Lord Jesus an elect congregation, a redeemed (by His work) people that loved him and would praise him becaue He is worthy.

It doesn't matter what happens, God is always glorified, because He is God.

:godisgood:

 

If God is glorified by sin, it would be a sin not to sin.

All I can say is some have strayed far from the truth.

 

It is not that sin glorifies God, but whatever sin God permits He will ultimately overrule it for His glory (Psa. 76:10).

 

HP: Then sin is nothing more than the creation of a Holy God? You could not define a Holy God in a more wicked light than than that.

 

God created lucifier, he chose to become satan, and the Lord uses that being to have His ultimate plans at times be fulfilled!

 

What you sought to do against me for evil, God turned it around for the good....

Joseph seemed to have a perspective agrreing with you here!

 

Jas 1:13 Let no one say when he is tempted, "I am being tempted by God," for God cannot be tempted with evil, and he himself tempts no one.
Jas 1:14 But each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire.
Jas 1:15 Then desire when it has conceived gives birth to sin, and sin when it is fully grown brings forth death.

 

What you say here is why we must keep speaking the truth and continue to expose the false doctrines of Calvinism.
Whenever I debate Calvinists, Lutherans, and anyone from the reformed denominations, I have had people say that we should not argue, since Calvinists and non-Calvinists believe the same when it comes to the basics. No way is it a small matter.

 

HP: It is not a small matter. Truth and error have consequences, some eternal, and influence intents and subsequent actions. It is sad, but the basics of Calvinism and non-cals is no small separation. There is a vast void fixed between the two systems of thought and never the twain shall they be the same. One is a system of fatalism and determination, the other one of freedom and choice.